It's definitely too early to say this, but there's a lot to like about the bullpen as of 4/13/22

[interloper]

The bullpen is currently the strongest aspect of the team right now, and it's not really close. It's extremely early and so a handful of these guys could plummet and it could change very quickly (most of these guys have only thrown 2-3 times), but for now, you have to like what you see.

Chief among them, Bautista looks to be a development success. Meoli's latest has some good tidbits: https://jonmeoli.substack.com/p/orioles-felix-bautista-rise?s=r To me, this is a great Duquette-era acquisition, followed by successful player development of the Elias era. More than all of that, it's just fun to see a huge dude on the mound throwing heat and striking people out. We haven't had an imposing reliever like that in a long time. I'm sure some rough stretches are ahead for him, but he's looked great so far. 

The two waiver claims I mentioned in another thread - Perez and Baker - are off to a great start as well. Krehbiel is a third waiver claim who seems like he'll be solid enough to hold down the fort. All 3 guys have varying degrees of good stuff and velocity. Command hasn't been a big issue so far for Perez, so that's good. 

Lopez appears to be settling in to a closer/late-inning role and while his first outing was dicey, he definitely had some bad luck. His second appearance was much better. He's hitting 99 at times, which is fun, and while I don't expect him to be the Orioles' next shutdown closer, he's got a good chance to at least be a Brad Brach or Mychal Givens type reliever.

Mike Baumann! It's great to see him throwing 97 again and eating a few innings while doing so. I would keep him right where he is and just let him settle in. He looks a little nervy to me out there, but the stuff is super encouraging. 

Keegan Akin? Yes, incredibly, Akin is also eating innings and pitching with great stuff. He looks confident and another guy you just keep right where he is. 

If there's a weak link, it's Paul Fry, but I'm willing to give him some non-Rays appearances to hopefully lock it in. He hasn't shown the extreme lack of command, so that's a positive, but with other lefties like Nick Vespi knocking on the door, he could be the next Elias bullpen trade. 

And finally, Tate looked great his first appearance, and then showed a pretty severe down-tick in stuff his 2nd appearance. Hyde says it was a mechanical flaw that they've identified and are working on, so thankfully not injury-related. A lot of people don't like Tate, but I think he could be primed to be much more interesting this year. I am not a fan of him in multiple innings stints, but the O's insist on using him like that for whatever reason. Anyway, time will tell. 

Right now I don't think the team misses Scott in the least. Sulser would be nice to have around, but it appears they can hang without him. The real test will be the upcoming Yankees serie

[Sports Guy]

I think you have to like a lot of the arms out there.  Are any of these guys good enough to be part of a contending BP?  I think it’s possible but we have a long ways to go before we can get a good feel for that.
 

I do like the long term potential of the pen with the arms in the organization.  Do we have that Josh Hader type shut down, elite guy?  Who knows but we definitely need at least one or 2 guys at that level.

[waroriole]

Agree that it’s too early, but there are some bright spots. I like getting a lot of guys into multi-inning roles. We clearly don’t have 5 SP, so this lets us evaluate a lot of guys and let’s them ease into pitching in the ML. 

[glenn__davis]

I'm pretty sure we say this every year.  Seems like every year the bullpen gets off to a great start and then regresses.

Last year Adam Plutko looked like a great find for the 1st few weeks of the season and then was awful after that.

[wildcard]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

The bullpen is currently the strongest aspect of the team right now, and it's not really close. It's extremely early and so a handful of these guys could plummet and it could change very quickly (most of these guys have only thrown 2-3 times), but for now, you have to like what you see.

Chief among them, Bautista looks to be a development success. Meoli's latest has some good tidbits: https://jonmeoli.substack.com/p/orioles-felix-bautista-rise?s=r To me, this is a great Duquette-era acquisition, followed by successful player development of the Elias era. More than all of that, it's just fun to see a huge dude on the mound throwing heat and striking people out. We haven't had an imposing reliever like that in a long time. I'm sure some rough stretches are ahead for him, but he's looked great so far. 

The two waiver claims I mentioned in another thread - Perez and Baker - are off to a great start as well. Krehbiel is a third waiver claim who seems like he'll be solid enough to hold down the fort. All 3 guys have varying degrees of good stuff and velocity. Command hasn't been a big issue so far for Perez, so that's good. 

Lopez appears to be settling in to a closer/late-inning role and while his first outing was dicey, he definitely had some bad luck. His second appearance was much better. He's hitting 99 at times, which is fun, and while I don't expect him to be the Orioles' next shutdown closer, he's got a good chance to at least be a Brad Brach or Mychal Givens type reliever.

Mike Baumann! It's great to see him throwing 97 again and eating a few innings while doing so. I would keep him right where he is and just let him settle in. He looks a little nervy to me out there, but the stuff is super encouraging. 

Keegan Akin? Yes, incredibly, Akin is also eating innings and pitching with great stuff. He looks confident and another guy you just keep right where he is. 

If there's a weak link, it's Paul Fry, but I'm willing to give him some non-Rays appearances to hopefully lock it in. He hasn't shown the extreme lack of command, so that's a positive, but with other lefties like Nick Vespi knocking on the door, he could be the next Elias bullpen trade. 

And finally, Tate looked great his first appearance, and then showed a pretty severe down-tick in stuff his 2nd appearance. Hyde says it was a mechanical flaw that they've identified and are working on, so thankfully not injury-related. A lot of people don't like Tate, but I think he could be primed to be much more interesting this year. I am not a fan of him in multiple innings stints, but the O's insist on using him like that for whatever reason. Anyway, time will tell. 

Right now I don't think the team misses Scott in the least. Sulser would be nice to have around, but it appears they can hang without him. The real test will be the upcoming Yankees serie

Tampa had the best pitching staff in the AL last year.  They used 39 pitchers. I still don't like trading Scott and Sulser for a draft choice that does get to the majors until 2025. Velez doesn't have much velo on his  fastball.  We will see how far that takes him.

[Aristotelian]

Bullpen has been a bright spot for sure. Only one win to show for it but they have done a great job of keeping us in games.

I am skeptical Lopez will last long in the closer role. Hope he proves me wrong. I feel like it is a matter of time before Fry is DFA. 

Very impressed with Perez as well as Baker. Baumann back to 97 with command is a huge development, same with Akin. 

It is very, very early but I wonder if they figured something out in the offseason and are emphasizing anything with the group. First time through the rotation team era is 3.64, 14th in the league. 

[interloper]

1 hour ago, glenn__davis said:

I'm pretty sure we say this every year.  Seems like every year the bullpen gets off to a great start and then regresses.

Last year Adam Plutko looked like a great find for the 1st few weeks of the season and then was awful after that.

That is definitely a fair point. However every guy in the 'pen right now has better stuff than he does. It's at least encouraging that we don't have to rely on guys like him so far/yet. Same goes for dudes like Tom Eshelman or Connor Wade. 

Refreshing to see guys with good stuff. 

[Bmorebirds24]

1 hour ago, waroriole said:

Agree that it’s too early, but there are some bright spots. I like getting a lot of guys into multi-inning roles. We clearly don’t have 5 SP, so this lets us evaluate a lot of guys and let’s them ease into pitching in the ML. 

My worry is that the bullpen is taxed early due to the lack of innings from the SP. I do like seeing multiple guys a night and see what they have but the old school in me likes seeing a SP give 6 strong innings. 
 

I also wonder if this innings limit is more of an organization thing or a Hyde thing? 

[btdart20]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

I do like the long term potential of the pen with the arms in the organization.  Do we have that Josh Hader type shut down, elite guy?  Who knows but we definitely need at least one or 2 guys at that level.

Can't tell if you're being literal/general or snarky/serious but - One or two guys literally at Hader's level is tilting windmills.  Hader may be in a tier all by himself.  Is there one other shut down type at Josh Hader's level across the league over the past 2-3 years?  If there is, that tier has to be single digits.  Hendriks is in the conversation, but I can't find anyone else.  Don't get me wrong, one or two Josh Hader's would be awesome!  

The BP doesn't have to have Hader-tier to be a strength of a contending team.  If a few of our guys fall into the next tier or two (or more depending how you tranche tiers), and the BP will be competitive.  (And maybe that's what you were saying...)  

 

Agree that the pen has been strong.  Only Fry has a FIP higher than 2.72.  No HR allowed either.  5 BB over 19.6 (2 by Fry in his 2.1).  To completely get ahead of myself "That plays for a contender!"  Not that any of this means anything with the sample size, because (no matter what they say) size does matter.  

Let's enjoy it and see where it goes.  But the realist in me says to (outside of some fundamental change in inputs) expect that regressing to the mean will play both ways (bad to good and good to bad).  Which means the hitting and fielding should get better.  And the pitching...  Well, let's just enjoy it and see where it goes!

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

Can't tell if you're being literal/general or snarky/serious but - One or two guys literally at Hader's level is tilting windmills.  Hader may be in a tier all by himself.  Is there one other shut down type at Josh Hader's level across the league over the past 2-3 years?  If there is, that tier has to be single digits.  Hendriks is in the conversation, but I can't find anyone else.  Don't get me wrong, one or two Josh Hader's would be awesome!  

The BP doesn't have to have Hader-tier to be a strength of a contending team.  If a few of our guys fall into the next tier or two (or more depending how you tranche tiers), and the BP will be competitive.  (And maybe that's what you were saying...)  

 

Agree that the pen has been strong.  Only Fry has a FIP higher than 2.72.  No HR allowed either.  5 BB over 19.6 (2 by Fry in his 2.1).  To completely get ahead of myself "That plays for a contender!"  Not that any of this means anything with the sample size, because (no matter what they say) size does matter.  

Let's enjoy it and see where it goes.  But the realist in me says to (outside of some fundamental change in inputs) expect that regressing to the mean will play both ways (bad to good and good to bad).  Which means the hitting and fielding should get better.  And the pitching...  Well, let's just enjoy it and see where it goes!

You need multiple elite shut down arms in the pen.  Define that with whatever pitcher you want but in todays game, that’s what you need. 

Guys with command and have the ability to get a lot of Ks, miss bats and keep the ball in the yard.

With the emphasis of the sport geared so much towards the pens, especially in the playoffs, these guys are crucial to the success of your team in a short series.

[btdart20]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You need multiple elite shut down arms in the pen.  Define that with whatever pitcher you want but in todays game, that’s what you need. 

Guys with command and have the ability to get a lot of Ks, miss bats and keep the ball in the yard.

With the emphasis of the sport geared so much towards the pens, especially in the playoffs, these guys are crucial to the success of your team in a short series.

Again, I wasn't sure how literal you were being.  Apparently not literal at all.  

Agree with the general direction.  But to expect multiple relief pitchers in Hader's tier to be in one bullpen is unreasonable.

[OrangeTurtle]

Our "Hader" is probably going to be DL Hall. Obviously rooting for him to become a long-term rotation staple, but I'm pretty confident that, at his floor, he should be a dominant Andrew Miller type.

[waroriole]

47 minutes ago, Bmorebirds24 said:

My worry is that the bullpen is taxed early due to the lack of innings from the SP. I do like seeing multiple guys a night and see what they have but the old school in me likes seeing a SP give 6 strong innings. 
 

I also wonder if this innings limit is more of an organization thing or a Hyde thing? 

I think it’s by their ability. Means and Lyles are really the only SP with the ability to work deep into games. I think Zimmerman will get there. Everyone else can really only be trusted 2 times through the order, at most. 

[Aristotelian]

47 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

Can't tell if you're being literal/general or snarky/serious but - One or two guys literally at Hader's level is tilting windmills.  Hader may be in a tier all by himself.  Is there one other shut down type at Josh Hader's level across the league over the past 2-3 years?  If there is, that tier has to be single digits.  Hendriks is in the conversation, but I can't find anyone else.  Don't get me wrong, one or two Josh Hader's would be awesome!  

The BP doesn't have to have Hader-tier to be a strength of a contending team.  If a few of our guys fall into the next tier or two (or more depending how you tranche tiers), and the BP will be competitive.  (And maybe that's what you were saying...)  

 

Agree that the pen has been strong.  Only Fry has a FIP higher than 2.72.  No HR allowed either.  5 BB over 19.6 (2 by Fry in his 2.1).  To completely get ahead of myself "That plays for a contender!"  Not that any of this means anything with the sample size, because (no matter what they say) size does matter.  

Let's enjoy it and see where it goes.  But the realist in me says to (outside of some fundamental change in inputs) expect that regressing to the mean will play both ways (bad to good and good to bad).  Which means the hitting and fielding should get better.  And the pitching...  Well, let's just enjoy it and see where it goes!

Yeah, even with our bullpen's success in the earlygoing, you just kind of new when it got to Boxberger/Williams/Hader we weren't gonna score for a while. I remarked in the game thread I remember what it was like having a bullpen like that. We are nowhere near that and probably won't be without spending some money (Boxberger had been my pick for a reasonable cost closer).

[Porky]

2 hours ago, glenn__davis said:

I'm pretty sure we say this every year.  Seems like every year the bullpen gets off to a great start and then regresses.

Last year Adam Plutko looked like a great find for the 1st few weeks of the season and then was awful after that.

I agree. Offense always starts slow league-wide the first week or two generally as well.