Angelos Family Fued

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, interloper said:

If people really think the Os definitely won't spend money and that this rebuild is really a "rebuild" that exists to have an excuse to not spend money, then why go through the trouble of hiring a qualified brain trust like Elias and Sig, who have made other good hires like Koby and Eve? Why so much effort retooling and consolidating the organizational philosophy? I get that the Dominican academy isn't a huge expense, but then why do it at all?

I'm not saying the Angeloses aren't problematic - it's clear that they are, and the benefit of the doubt I had been giving John Angelos is kind of out the window at this point.

But - I just don't know why he would put such a strong baseball ops team in place and not follow through on the eventual end game. He could have easily hired some has been to not spend. 

Because they had to hire someone?

Elias had experience in doing a tear it down to the bare bones and slash payroll as low as possible rebuild.

He's a rookie GM, it isn't as if the O's won a bidding war for his services.  I don't think the O's were even the only team to hire a GM that offseason.  Why didn't the other team snag him up if he was that in demand?

[Pickles]

2 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I won't really comment except to say that we don't know. 

I just know that no matter the situation there will always be those who assume it will get much worse, and soon.  In the middle of the Orioles' 47-win season there were a number of posters were quite sure they'd win 30 or 40 games.  The next year many predicted they'd be much worse than the year prior. 

So... we'll see.

That's the comfort I try to take: People have been predicting apocalypse for a couple thousand years now.  And they're only right some of the time.  So maybe I'm wrong.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Pickles said:

Oh, I agree.  When I was speaking about the economic whirlwind coming, it's coming for us all.  It's just places like Baltimore are going to be hurt the most.  If you think it's dystopian now, just wait.

No doubt.  The whole lockdown stuff created this and why I was one of those that didn't want to see it happen.  I know some people in construction who do big jobs and they are telling me that stuff is getting canceled, shut down, etc..left and right.  Its long term job loss, infrastructure issues, etc....We have barely cracked the surface and yes, the inner cities will get crushed the most.

Baltimore was going downhill fast before this happened, so its even worse for them.

[Pickles]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

No doubt.  The whole lockdown stuff created this and why I was one of those that didn't want to see it happen.  I know some people in construction who do big jobs and they are telling me that stuff is getting canceled, shut down, etc..left and right.  Its long term job loss, infrastructure issues, etc....We have barely cracked the surface and yes, the inner cities will get crushed the most.

Baltimore was going downhill fast before this happened, so its even worse for them.

I work in education.  You don't even want to know what it has done to education and a whole generation of students.  And I work in a southern state that opened up way before everwhere else.

I teach at a community college which is a dual credit program, so while I teach college courses I'm actually teaching many high schoolers.  These are supposedly the best high schoolers in the district.   60% of them are functionally illiterate.  

It ain't getting better, folks.

Learn to garden and tend chickens.

(I realize I woke up a ray of sunshine today.)

[interloper]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Because they had to hire someone?

Elias had experience in doing a tear it down to the bare bones and slash payroll as low as possible rebuild.

He's a rookie GM, it isn't as if the O's won a bidding war for his services.  I don't think the O's were even the only team to hire a GM that offseason.  Why didn't the other team snag him up if he was that in demand?

Fair. I just think the amount of effort that has gone into a total overhaul of the organization goes against the simple theory that this is all just a ruse. To SGs point, it does help the value or perceived value of the franchise, but they could have achieved that with much less effort.

Elias' promises only go as far as ownership allows, so we'll see, but so far all his promises from that initial presser have come to pass, and more, I'd argue. The last remaining promise was spending, which he alluded to again as recent as this season. Ultimately it's not up to him though, so we'll see. Like others, I believe the time to spend is absolutely this off season. If there aren't clear attempts to improve the roster through free agency AND trade, then that's a big problem.

[LTO's]

24 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

The cops aren't allowed to fight crime and the corruption is terrible.

Are you from Baltimore? Have you ever lived here? The BPD have been one of if not the most corrupt part of the city for decades. But also, what happened to no politics???

[Tony-OH]

10 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

No doubt.  The whole lockdown stuff created this and why I was one of those that didn't want to see it happen.  I know some people in construction who do big jobs and they are telling me that stuff is getting canceled, shut down, etc..left and right.  Its long term job loss, infrastructure issues, etc....We have barely cracked the surface and yes, the inner cities will get crushed the most.

Baltimore was going downhill fast before this happened, so its even worse for them.

Easy guys, I don't want this to get into politics. I think we all have strong feelings about Baltimore one way or the other, but let's not take this into the political realm or talk about the country as a whole right now.

This isn't necessarily directed at just you Rob, just using your post as a jumping in point.

[mojmann]

1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

lol... I do when you when you publicly denounce an Oriole legend in the one area where everyone he agreed he was the best at. But I don't want to derail this thread. 

Honestly though, it's more about how I see the Ironbirds run. I took my Autistic son there last year for his birthday and I was shocked at how poorly the place was run. No staff, only like two things open to get something to eat, no dessrts available anywhere. It was awful. 

But the main thing is the optics of not having an announcer on there MiLB broadcasts. It's absolutely embarrassing to have an Orioles affiliate to not even bring in a local kid in college and give him or her a chance. I'm sure they would do it for pennies just to get the experience. When I watch other teams in the same league have dual announcers with center field cameras and major league baseball like production, you realize how much Cal as owner doesn't care how his team looks. He cares about the bottom line I'm sure.

That's not someone I'd want as part of a local ownership group. I want someone to come in and say we're going to be first class in everything we do from treating are employees to the fan experience. Including competing for the top talent to make the team a winner again.

 

Yes, that is disturbing. My son plays in collegiate summer ball -- and every game has two announcers. Certainly, a professional team should have someone calling play-by-play at least.

[Tony-OH]

1 minute ago, LTO's said:

. But also, what happened to no politics???

Agreed and that's why I want all of this conversation to stop. Thanks.

[Hank Scorpio]

It's amazing how EASILY all of this stuff blends together.

It's tough to dance around it. It has consumed us all 

[Going Underground]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

No doubt.  The whole lockdown stuff created this and why I was one of those that didn't want to see it happen.  I know some people in construction who do big jobs and they are telling me that stuff is getting canceled, shut down, etc..left and right.  Its long term job loss, infrastructure issues, etc....We have barely cracked the surface and yes, the inner cities will get crushed the most.

Baltimore was going downhill fast before this happened, so its even worse for them.

Construction is booming in Harbor Point with the T. Rowell Price Global Headquarters. Port Covington is finally starting to be built,but on a smaller scale. The crappy arena is getting rebuilt  with Kevin Durant's help. Paramount also under construction.  Rebuilding Lexington Market. I was told they are having trouble getting enough workers. The city really needs to get their act together on the crime and the dirt bike fiasco. Can you tell me what major projects in construction got cancelled? I know some where put on hold.

[Tony-OH]

Let's get back to this Angelos drama and away from the city. Thanks. 

Any more posts from here on out will be deleted.

[Going Underground]

Steve Rales and his brother where once asked to join the Angelos group. They are not young anymore but own Danaher.

[Going Underground]

David Rubenstein from the Carlyle group but he is also over 80.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

I will take a stab at this and there are posters on the OH that know more than I do, so they can correct me.

If Peter left everything to his wife without a Trust there would be no inheritance tax because of the husband wife relationship.  The inheritance tax would happen when she passes.

But that does not  appear to be happening here.  The ownership has probably already passed to the Trust.   When Peter passes there would be no inheritance tax because he no longer owns of the team or the other assets.  The  terms of the Trust determine who has control of the team with rights to manage, sell,  distribute the businesses and assets including the Orioles and probably MASN.  

Also in the terms of the Trust are who has to agree on what happens to the Trust. If one of the principals has rights to assets and wants to sell their portion that could trigger taxes.  But in order to know what would happen we have to know the terms of the Trust.  

Not a trusts & estates lawyer, but generally, this is not correct.  Many people have revocable trusts they put their assets in.   Those trusts do not avoid estate taxes.   Trust me on this - my dad died three months ago, he had a revocable trust holding most of his assets, and I’ve hired an estate attorney who’s told me there will be significant local estate taxes to pay based on assets in the trust. (The federal threshold for estate tax is well beyond the size of my dad’s estate.)  So why have a trust like that if it’s not saving you taxes?   The simple reason is that the assets in the trust are not under supervision of the probate court.   You save a lot of time and bureaucracy because the trustee of the trust doesn’t have to await confirmation of his/her appointment by a court, or file paperwork accounting for disposition of assets, or await court approval to make distributions.

Now, there are some other kinds of trusts that may defer or avoid taxes.  Generally, these are irrevocable trusts.  I don’t know what Peter has but the complaint refers to a revocable trust, and that should operate the way I described.  

Lswyers who know more about this can feel free to correct me.