With the MLB additions are we a much better team than 2022?

[Roll Tide]

I said this in the other thread 

So we’ve made 3 MLB additions and they are mostly lateral at best. But, 

Odor (minimum) vs Frazier $8 million

McCann $2.5 Million vs Chirinos $700,000

Gibson $10 Million vs Lyles ($6 million plus the $1 million buyout)

 

WAR 

Lyles 1.0 vs Gibson .7 

Odor -.4 vs Frazier .9

Chirinos .1 vs McCann -.1

So we’ve spent 23 million to get .8 WAR improvement (I’m including the whole commitment to McCann as we are stuck with him for 2 seasons). This is a total waste of revenue IMO. 

 

Honestly, I feel this is a piss poor effort or just that our GM isn’t trying to win more baseball games. 

Edited December 22, 2022 by Roll Tide

[owknows]

4 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I said this in the other thread 

So we’ve made 3 MLB additions and they are mostly lateral at best. But, 

Odor (minimum) vs Frazier $8 million

McCann $2.5 Million vs Chirinos $700,000

Gibson $10 Million vs Lyles ($6 million plus the $1 million buyout)

 

WAR 

Lyles 1.0 vs Gibson .7 

Odor -.4 vs Frazier .9

Chirinos .1 vs McCann -.1

So we’ve spent 23 million to get .8 WAR improvement (I’m including the whole commitment to McCann as we are stuck with him for 2 seasons). This is a total waste of revenue IMO. 

 

Honestly, I feel this is a piss poor effort or just that our GM isn’t trying to win more baseball games. 

I think we tried shopping at Macy's but Our offers typically fell about 40% short

So...  we ended up at the Dollar Store.

I guess I'm a little more stoic about these situations than you are. The players that are going to significantly move the needle for this team are in the farm system. Not on the FA market. I'm OK with that. I've made no secret of the fact that I even prefer it.

[Roll Tide]

Just now, owknows said:

I think we tried shopping at Macy's but Our offers typically fell about 40% short

So...  we ended up at the Dollar Store.

I guess I'm a little more stoic about these situations than you are. The players that are going to significantly move the needle for this team are in the farm system. Not on the FA market. I'm OK with that. I've made no secret of the fact that I even prefer it.

I’m just tired of it ….40 years of mostly suckage has gotten under my skin. 

[Spakman]

Don’t forget to subtract Lopez

[owknows]

Just now, Roll Tide said:

I’m just tired of it ….40 years of mostly suckage has gotten under my skin. 

I understand. Honestly, that's why the Frazier deal pissed me off. It intensifies an already growing middle infield logjam, and inhibits the growth of players that might actually improve the club in meaningful ways.

I find that a far more harmful move than which mediocre backup catcher we roll with.

[owknows]

1 minute ago, Spakman said:

Don’t forget to subtract Lopez

Trading Lopez at peak value was actually one of the best front office moves this club has made in awhile.

[Roll Tide]

Just now, owknows said:

I understand. Honestly, that's why the Frazier deal pissed me off. It intensifies an already growing middle infield logjam, and inhibits the growth of players that might actually improve the club in meaningful ways.

I find that a far more harmful move than which mediocre backup catcher we roll with.

I just think we could have spent 20 million on a player that would actually help. Then back fill with the garbage. If Chirinos has a job at all it will be for the minimum.

[Spakman]

Just now, owknows said:

Trading Lopez at peak value was actually one of the best front office moves this club has made in awhile.

Time will tell, but we also got Givens as a replacement

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, owknows said:

I think we tried shopping at Macy's but Our offers typically fell about 40% short

So...  we ended up at the Dollar Store.

I guess I'm a little more stoic about these situations than you are. The players that are going to significantly move the needle for this team are in the farm system. Not on the FA market. I'm OK with that. I've made no secret of the fact that I even prefer it.

It's the backup catcher.

Most teams end up with someone who is close to replacement level.  

As long as the O's didn't give up anything useful it's fine.

He should bounce back a bit.

[Sports Guy]

On paper, they are about the same team.

But whether they regress or improve will largely depend on the growth of the young players and whether or not some of the guys in 2022 turn into a pumpkin or if they are for real.  They could have added better players and this would still be the case.

[clapdiddy]

The other thing to remember is that Adley and Gunnar will be up for the entire season.

[MCO'sFan]

They haven’t moved the needle much but like others have said, any improvement will be largely due to the young players progressing. I’m okay with the moves so far. I would have liked to have seen a better starting pitcher signed but I’m in the camp that our position players should come from the minors this year. I still think we are in the let’s see what we have stage of the rebuild. I expect some regression from a W/L perspective because that almost always happens when there is a large jump in the previous year. I honestly don’t care about the money part of it. It’s a drop in the bucket and all essentially one year deals or deals that can easily be eaten if needed.  

[jrt3177]

12 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

On paper, they are about the same team.

But whether they regress or improve will largely depend on the growth of the young players and whether or not some of the guys in 2022 turn into a pumpkin or if they are for real.  They could have added better players and this would still be the case.

And I honestly think this why we are taking the approach we have taken so far this year.  Sign stop gap MLB players who (on paper) are a bit better than the guys they’ve replaced, while allowing the young guys to prove their worth this season, and more importantly, the future.  I believe next year will be when we see the FO get a bit more aggressive in FA and trade market after they have a better idea of how the young talent they’re grooming translates at the MLB level.

[Aristotelian]

If going by last year WAR it doesn't look great. If looking at career average WAR it looks much better. Clealr Elias does not believe last year is the right sample size. Either way, $20M to fill three holes is pretty cheap. We got pretty much the best available guys we could get without long term deals which appears to be the overriding imperative.

[oriole]

I’d say they’re a slightly better team but definitely wouldn’t use the word “considerably”. When you lay it out like that, it does seem like a lot of money for such an incremental improvement. Though, I don’t see the additions quite as negatively as some here.