MLB Offseason Moves/Rumor Thread

[OriolesMagic83]

2 hours ago, Yardball85 said:

Carl Pavano on the jumbotron as the opening day starter several years ago as the Orioles pitch to get him to sign.  The good old days.

We just missed the Pavano dynasty.

[Frobby]

27 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

We just missed the Pavano dynasty.

One of my favorite vignettes from Living on the Black was when Mike Mussina was negotiating a two-year extension with the Yankees without an agent.  Cashman originally offered him an annual salary that happened to be just under what Carl Pavano was making.  “Brian, you are not paying me less than Carl Pavano!”  Cashman laughed and quickly agreed to a number a tad north of what Pavano was making.  

[interloper]

There is truly nothing to talk about. Not even a whisper of a rumor.

Yamamoto, Snell, Glasnow, Bellinger. Seems like not a whole lot is happening until these guys are off the board.

[spiritof66]

42 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Young, cheap, good pitching is just about the best asset a team can have.  it can make up for a lot of other weaknesses, and also frees up cash for the team to address other needs.

The O’s with Bradish, Rodriguez, Kremer, Wells and Hall aren’t in such bad shape themselves on that score.

 

I think history has shown, or at least it's commonly believed, that young, cheap, good starting pitches often (not always) will help you win you a lot of ballgames but usually won't get you very far in the postseason. Elias doesn't say much that commits him to any particular course of action, but I thought he had come as close he can to pledging that he would be adding veteranosity above the Gibson level to the rotation. It certainly looks like he or John Angelos or both are backing off after reviewing the prices in money and talent for what's available.

In the Orioles' case, I don't see a strong case for saying a cheap starting rotation will free up cash to address other needs, unless you count augmenting the Angeloses' personal fortunes as among the team's needs. I don't see the $20 or $30 million that might be saved as making a significant contribution to retaining young talent through long-term contracts, and I'm not sure what other team needs can or will be addressed with the savings.

[orioles119]

[wildcard]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

Young, cheap, good pitching is just about the best asset a team can have.  it can make up for a lot of other weaknesses, and also frees up cash for the team to address other needs.

The O’s with Bradish, Rodriguez, Kremer, Wells and Hall aren’t in such bad shape themselves on that score.

 

Plus Means (though not young) and McDermott who should be in the majors sometime in 2024.

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, spiritof66 said:

I think history has shown, or at least it's commonly believed, that young, cheap, good starting pitches often (not always) will help you win you a lot of ballgames but usually won't get you very far in the postseason. Elias doesn't say much that commits him to any particular course of action, but I thought he had come as close he can to pledging that he would be adding veteranosity above the Gibson level to the rotation. It certainly looks like he or John Angelos or both are backing off after reviewing the prices in money and talent for what's available.

In the Orioles' case, I don't see a strong case for saying a cheap starting rotation will free up cash to address other needs, unless you count augmenting the Angeloses' personal fortunes as among the team's needs. I don't see the $20 or $30 million that might be saved as making a significant contribution to retaining young talent through long-term contracts, and I'm not sure what other team needs can or will be addressed with the savings.

Means is the veteran in the rotation.   I still think Elias adds a starter.  It just may not be the top half of the rotation guy the he was looking for.

1)  Trade Norby, and/or Stowers and/or Urias for a 4th or 5th starter.

2)  Sign Lorenzen

He may be in on Cease but the bidding will probably  be very high.  Higher than I expect the O's to go.  Sounds like last year.

[AnythingO's]

We talk about teams with surplus pitching and last year that was MIA who traded Lopez. Trevor Rogers was in their starting rotation at the beginning of the year, had a sore arm and was out for a bit. While rehabbing he tore a lat on his non-pitching side and missed the rest of the year. They obviously replaced him in the rotation the rest of the season. He is supposed to be ready for ST. What would he take to acquire? He is their DL Hall equivalent. Maybe he starts or maybe goes to the BP. Either way he is a talent.

[Spy Fox]

2 hours ago, spiritof66 said:

I think history has shown, or at least it's commonly believed, that young, cheap, good starting pitches often (not always) will help you win you a lot of ballgames but usually won't get you very far in the postseason. Elias doesn't say much that commits him to any particular course of action, but I thought he had come as close he can to pledging that he would be adding veteranosity above the Gibson level to the rotation. It certainly looks like he or John Angelos or both are backing off after reviewing the prices in money and talent for what's available.

In the Orioles' case, I don't see a strong case for saying a cheap starting rotation will free up cash to address other needs, unless you count augmenting the Angeloses' personal fortunes as among the team's needs. I don't see the $20 or $30 million that might be saved as making a significant contribution to retaining young talent through long-term contracts, and I'm not sure what other team needs can or will be addressed with the savings.

Can you explain how history has shown this or what makes you say it's commonly believed? I don't know about a narrative that it's a failing playoff build, and I think if we looked we'd find young/good/cheap SPs as a common feature of World Series champs.

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, spiritof66 said:

I think history has shown, or at least it's commonly believed, that young, cheap, good starting pitches often (not always) will help you win you a lot of ballgames but usually won't get you very far in the postseason. 

Jim Palmer, Mike Boddicker, Andy Pettitte, Josh Beckett, Madison Bumgarner and Cristian Javier say hi.  Off the top of my head.  

[Going Underground]

2 hours ago, orioles119 said:

How can you say this? Austin Wynns just got signed by the Reds.

[RZNJ]

40 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Means is the veteran in the rotation.   I still think Elias adds a starter.  It just may not be the top half of the rotation guy the he was looking for.

1)  Trade Norby, and/or Stowers and/or Urias for a 4th or 5th starter.

2)  Sign Lorenzen

He may be in on Cease but the bidding will probably  be very high.  Higher than I expect the O's to go.  Sounds like last year.

Wait.  You want to trade for a #4-5 starter AND sign Lorentzen?

Edited December 14, 2023 by RZNJ

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Going Underground said:

How can you say this? Austin Wynns just got signed by the Reds.

The Giants finally got someone to take their money!  The Giants!

[Just Regular]

Apologies if this link is wonky as it is a custom report, but if it works these are 5 IP World Series guys since 2000, including their Ages that  year.     

The '21 Braves Fried-Anderson-Wright were all 27 and down.      Madison Bumgarner was doing his 3rd championship thing when he was the age Chayce McDermott is now.

Link

Edited December 14, 2023 by Just Regular

[orioles119]

8 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

How can you say this? Austin Wynns just got signed by the Reds.