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paulcoates

By paulcoates
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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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That's a fan's reasoning, and if a head of Baseball Operations is using that sort of logic to make decisions then the team is doomed.

There is no one interested in this team. Jones is likely gone when he is a FA, and the only way he isn't is likely if BAL gives him a non-team friendly deal which will further prevent them from gaining any payroll ground.

It's not "what I think". It is a fact. There is no reasonable mathematical way for Baltimore to build a winner, as the core is currently constructed, for under $90 million. Your reasoning is what landed Baltimore a $40 million deal for Roberts. How's that working out?

Bravo Nick...Very well said.
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Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

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Agreed. It's just a shame when it doesn't seem that Jones is being shopped at all. You'd be selling him at possibly an all-time-high right now, in my opinion. And with only 2 years left after this one, I'm not sure I want Jones tied up in a long-term deal. If it were me, he'd be my top trade chip right now, looking to get 3-4 young pieces back to help build the upper levels of the system.
Exactly Nick.

You can trade those guys and get back the young, stud CFer who has more service time, is cheaper and is better.

Then, you flip Jones for several pieces. Its just another way of doing things.

What you end up with a cheaper payroll, more talent, potentially an ELITE talent and probably a better team.

Two teams involved are each discussing giving up a prospect for Beltran that no one thought was really going to be available. Jones would land that prospect, no doubt, and two or three more good pieces, depending on what exactly you needed back (ML vs. close to ML).

2012 isn't a playoff year for Baltimore. Why not use the next 18 months to put yourself in a position to start your run in 2013? Instead, Baltimore is going to make various solid but unspectacular moves and, accordingly, tread water in the AL East.

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MikeAD Hangout Grand Counsel

MikeAD

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But Jones won't be shopped. Its not happening. Baseball is also a business and Jones is the best marketing chip the Orioles have right now, young talented and producing.

You can disagree with that all you want, but that is the reality of the situation. Yeah, trading Jones makes a lot of sense in the numbers-game but in reality Jones is too big a piece of this organization right now.

Hate to break it to you, but it doesn't matter who the best marketing chip is. The team sucks and nobody is interested. Denise Richards playing 2B in a bikini would do more for the fan base than anyone we have or could bring in right now. That's just the way it is. The front office has an obligation to put the best product on the field, and right now that might be by trading Jones. If you combine it with a Rasmus deal, you've got your CF and the you take Jones and move him for a bounty. We need to make big moves, often times they will be tough moves.

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clapdiddy Hangout Grand Counsel

clapdiddy

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Two teams involved are each discussing giving up a prospect for Beltran that no one thought was really going to be available. Jones would land that prospect, no doubt, and two or three more good pieces, depending on what exactly you needed back (ML vs. close to ML).

2012 isn't a playoff year for Baltimore. Why not use the next 18 months to put yourself in a position to start your run in 2013? Instead, Baltimore is going to make various solid but unspectacular moves and, accordingly, tread water in the AL East.

Awesome, awesome post. This ship is moving in no direction. It's anchored into mediocrity.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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Apparently not a 3-1. Toronto sending those three + CPat and is getting 2 back in addition to Rasmus. Don't have names.

Its a 4-4 swap.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/07/edwin-jackson-expected-to-be-flipped.html

Did the trade have to be this complex to make it happen? I tend to doubt it.

Perhaps just something as simple as Guthrie and JJ or Koji for Rasmus would have been fine.

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mweb Hangout Grand Counsel

mweb

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Well it's impossible to know what the Cards would have wanted, but if Guthrie plus Koji or JJ and maybe a lesser piece could have landed him, I would have done that without knowing what they can get for those players in separate deals. It is still possible that those guys get traded for players I would rather have than Rasmus. We shall see.

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SilentJames Hangout Veteran Council

SilentJames

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Hate to break it to you, but it doesn't matter who the best marketing chip is. The team sucks and nobody is interested. Denise Richards playing 2B in a bikini would do more for the fan base than anyone we have or could bring in right now. That's just the way it is. The front office has an obligation to put the best product on the field, and right now that might be by trading Jones. If you combine it with a Rasmus deal, you've got your CF and the you take Jones and move him for a bounty. We need to make big moves, often times they will be tough moves.

Living in the city proper I can tell you that the Orioles still generate interest here. There is nothing I can do to prove that you but trust me. People still talk, they still follow, Orioles gear is everywhere.

Jones has a following in this city. Is it a fan's opinion - yes it is but it is also reality. For example, it was stated by various outlets that if the Mets traded Reyes there would be nothing but crickets in Citi Field, cue joke about crickets at Camden Yards. And I know that trading Jones would blah blah blah and I'm not disagreeing with that and I am telling you why its not going to happen.

Whether you like it or not that is a part of the process.

Really Beltran? how does a 34 year-old oft-injured outfielder and prospects help us? What exactly would you want back from the Mets? How many of their top 10? 15?

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SilentJames Hangout Veteran Council

SilentJames

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Its a 4-4 swap.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/07/edwin-jackson-expected-to-be-flipped.html

Did the trade have to be this complex to make it happen? I tend to doubt it.

Perhaps just something as simple as Guthrie and JJ or Koji for Rasmus would have been fine.

If it didn't have to be that complex, then why was it?

I'll answer that for you - because the Cardinals wanted more.

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Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

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If it didn't have to be that complex, then why was it?

I'll answer that for you - because the Cardinals wanted more.

It was only this complicated because Toronto didn't have a "now" ML starter they were willing to part with, so they had to go out and get one from Chicago. The 4-4 part is accounting -- proscouts grabbing pieces they like to "balance" the deal.

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MikeAD Hangout Grand Counsel

MikeAD

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Living in the city proper I can tell you that the Orioles still generate interest here. There is nothing I can do to prove that you but trust me. People still talk, they still follow, Orioles gear is everywhere.

Jones has a following in this city. Is it a fan's opinion - yes it is but it is also reality. For example, it was stated by various outlets that if the Mets traded Reyes there would be nothing but crickets in Citi Field, cue joke about crickets at Camden Yards. And I know that trading Jones would blah blah blah and I'm not disagreeing with that and I am telling you why its not going to happen.

Whether you like it or not that is a part of the process.

Really Beltran? how does a 34 year-old oft-injured outfielder and prospects help us? What exactly would you want back from the Mets? How many of their top 10? 15?

I don't want Beltran at all. What I, and others, are saying is that if a 34 year old oft-injured Beltran can fetch a good return, imagine what a young high-regarded CF can get.

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