Do you want to take a shot at Josh Hamilton?

[mcinww0]

He has relapsed twice since he has been with Texas despite the safety net they have in place for him.

I am unsure of where your confidence comes from.

His relapses have both been brief and he clearly takes his addiction extremely seriously. The 2012 one didn't affect his performance and didn't even consist of him doing anything you or I wouldn't do on a night out. I think his dedication to remaining sober as well and his family will keep him from having a serious performance-harming relapse. I love Baltimore but its got to be a pretty mellow place by the standards of pro athletes so the triggers he dealt with in Texas may be less strong here.

Considering how seriously he took his addiction to dip and caffeine I doubt he'll allow himself to sink back into serious drugs.

[Can_of_corn]

His relapses have both been brief and he clearly takes his addiction extremely seriously. The 2012 one didn't affect his performance and didn't even consist of him doing anything you or I wouldn't do on a night out. I think his dedication to remaining sober as well and his family will keep him from having a serious performance-harming relapse. I love Baltimore but its got to be a pretty mellow place by the standards of pro athletes so the triggers he dealt with in Texas may be less strong here.

Considering how seriously he took his addiction to dip and caffeine I doubt he'll allow himself to sink back into serious drugs.

It is the "He only relapsed a little bit" defense.

I don't do this on a "night out" when I am in a relationship with someone.

I am one of those you mentioned in your story.....here you go:

The activity started around 10:30pm during rock-star karaoke. Sequence of events:

1) Mr. Hamilton is standing in the stairwell that connects the front section to back section of Sherlock's.

2) Mr. Hamilton has a drink in hand and begins jamming in the stairwell to the karaoke music.

3) Mr. Hamilton is then approached by a very average looking woman.

4) They start slapping each others butts and making our near the stairwell area. At this point the Sherlock's manager is trying to block people from using their camera phones.

5) Mr. Hamilton and the woman make their way into the rear restroom area across from the pool table area near the patio.

6) Loud sexually oriented noise is emanating from within the men's restroom. Sherlock's manager is blocking the entrance to the restroom.

7) After about 5 minutes the woman exits the men's restroom. She seems to have a big smile on her face and her jaw is kind of dropped open. She returns to her table in the dining area.

8) Mr. Hamilton then exits the men's restroom and the Sherlock's manager apparently encourages him to leave.

9) Mr. Hamilton exits Sherlock's using the rear exit through the patio area, jumps over the small fence and gets in a pretty beat up 4 door Ford sedan and drives off.

http://deadspin.com/5883865/what-happened-on-the-night-josh-hamilton-had-a-relapse-alleged-bathroom-sex-one-eyewitness-account

Now his sex life is obviously his own business but I think the fact that he was willing to engage in that type of behavior shows his reasoning ability was rather impaired.

What happens if he has one of these "little relapses" and someone at the bar offers him coke or crack? Do you think he will have the ability to refuse?

[mcinww0]

I think you have to assume that he'll play in no more games/year than he has so far. Even without addicition issues, a typical player plays much less in their 30s than their 20s. Much of a player's decline isn't so much slipping ability as it is declining availability over 162 games.

True, but he did play one full season less and his first season was only half a season, whereas Nick's was a whole season. Injuries are unpredictable, especially Hamilton's' (broken arm, dry eyes due to caffeine etc). I'm not aware of any recurring issues with him. He does seem injury prone but that was also the knock on Jones and Hardy until this year. Nick was a model of durability until this year. I think injuries in baseball are more a case of luck than predisposition, although that does certainly exist.

[mcinww0]

It is the "He only relapsed a little bit" defense.

I don't do this on a "night out" when I am in a relationship with someone.

http://deadspin.com/5883865/what-happened-on-the-night-josh-hamilton-had-a-relapse-alleged-bathroom-sex-one-eyewitness-account

Now his sex life is obviously his own business but I think the fact that he was willing to engage in that type of behavior shows his reasoning ability was rather impaired.

What happens if he has one of these "little relapses" and someone at the bar offers him coke or crack? Do you think he will have the ability to refuse?

I was not aware of that account. Regardless, it only lasted one night. Bottom line is a one night relapse is embarrassing and maybe personally destructive but would not impair his ability to play professional baseball. I don't often get offered coke or crack when I'm drunk at a bar; its not something that strangers just pass around out in the open. Look, obviously its a risk but I think the probability of his addiction issues resurfacing to such an extent that his career would be affected is remote.

[El Gordo]

True, but he did play one full season less and his first season was only half a season, whereas Nick's was a whole season. Injuries are unpredictable, especially Hamilton's' (broken arm, dry eyes due to caffeine etc). I'm not aware of any recurring issues with him. He does seem injury prone but that was also the knock on Jones and Hardy until this year. Nick was a model of durability until this year. I think injuries in baseball are more a case of luck than predisposition, although that does certainly exist.

Many of Hamiltons injuries stem from his aggressive play, diving running into walls. etc. That is a kind of injury proneness IMO.

,

[Bradysburns]

It is the "He only relapsed a little bit" defense.

I don't do this on a "night out" when I am in a relationship with someone.

http://deadspin.com/5883865/what-happened-on-the-night-josh-hamilton-had-a-relapse-alleged-bathroom-sex-one-eyewitness-account

Now his sex life is obviously his own business but I think the fact that he was willing to engage in that type of behavior shows his reasoning ability was rather impaired.

What happens if he has one of these "little relapses" and someone at the bar offers him coke or crack? Do you think he will have the ability to refuse?

If he's actually in recovery, he won't have a problem turning down crack or coke, or anything else.

[Can_of_corn]

I was not aware of that account. Regardless, it only lasted one night. Bottom line is a one night relapse is embarrassing and maybe personally destructive but would not impair his ability to play professional baseball. I don't often get offered coke or crack when I'm drunk at a bar; its not something that strangers just pass around out in the open. Look, obviously its a risk but I think the probability of his addiction issues resurfacing to such an extent that his career would be affected is remote.

Except for the part where any relapse at all will give MLB all the justification it needs to permanently ban him.

[Can_of_corn]

If he's actually in recovery, he won't have a problem turning down crack or coke, or anything else.

Did you miss the part where he was intoxicated? He obviously had a problem turning down alcohol.

[mcinww0]

Did you miss the part where he was intoxicated? He obviously had a problem turning down alcohol.

Except for the part where any relapse at all will give MLB all the justification it needs to permanently ban him.

If a player is banned, is the team still responsible for his contract? Surely it would work like a suspension where the player doesn't get paid? In that respect, the risk of a relapse wouldn't necessarily present an economic liability as far as the Orioles payroll is concerned.

I still feel like there's a difference between accepting a hard drug like coke and alcohol, even for a recovering addict. After all, he hasn't reverted to any drugs since 2005. Alcohol may make you more likely to use drugs but its not a stone cold guarantee; his power over his coke addiction may be stronger than his power over the alcohol addiction.

[Can_of_corn]

If a player is banned, is the team still responsible for his contract? Surely it would work like a suspension where the player doesn't get paid? In that respect, the risk of a relapse wouldn't necessarily present an economic liability as far as the Orioles payroll is concerned.

I still feel like there's a difference between accepting a hard drug like coke and alcohol, even for a recovering addict. After all, he hasn't reverted to any drugs since 2005. Alcohol may make you more likely to use drugs but its not a stone cold guarantee; his power over his coke addiction may be stronger than his power over the alcohol addiction.

In early 2009 According to reports, witnesses saw Hamilton drinking, heard him asking where he could obtain cocaine, and heard him reveal his plans to go to a strip club later that evening

No idea what Weams' source for that quote is.

[WNY Orioles Fan]

No. He does not fit into the way this team plays. This is a "next man up" team, and I don't view him as that kind of player.

Yeah, I'd rather have Andino or Cruz hitting in a criticle spot than Josh Hamilton.

[mcinww0]

I still don't see Hamilton throwing his career away. I think he's learning how to cope with the addiction and clearly takes it very seriously. Even if he did get himself banned for life, how does that impact the Orioles? As far as I can tell via google we'd be let off the hook for his contract and basically be back to where we are now. It would suck losing him but we wouldn't be hamstrung by his contract for years to come like we are currently by B-Rob's.

You can count on him for 3-4 wins a year, and when he's hot he's on fire. He's also got the potential for a 6-8 win season, which would be enough to carry an otherwise solid team to the playoffs. I think we can all agree he's desirable, but disagree on the cost we're willing to assign to a risky investment. Considering the manner in which he has handled himself 99.9% of the time, I have faith that he is more committed to fighting his disease than anyone.

[Bradysburns]

Did you miss the part where he was intoxicated? He obviously had a problem turning down alcohol.

Did you miss the part of that sentence where I said "If he's actually in recovery"? That was kind of an important part. That's a big "if." People familiar with recovery will understand. Basically it comes down to this: if someone is committed to recovery and doing the right things to maintain that recovery, they're not in danger - at all. But that's IF...

[Can_of_corn]

Did you miss the part of that sentence where I said "If he's actually in recovery"? That was kind of an important part. That's a big "if." People familiar with recovery will understand. Basically it comes down to this: if someone is committed to recovery and doing the right things to maintain that recovery, they're not in danger - at all. But that's IF...

There is a reason that folks are said to be in recovery not recovered.

There is always a risk of relapse.

[Bradysburns]

There is a reason that folks are said to be in recovery not recovered.

There is always a risk of relapse.

I think you're point is very well taken. I could definitely nitpick semantics a little here, but whatever... I get your point. There's always a risk that someone - who isn't working on recovery - will relapse. There's also a risk that someone who is not in recovery is an addict, but nobody knows. There are risks everywhere. It's just that for me, this one doesn't outweigh the good things the guy has done, and his potentially positive impact on our team.