So how about Brian Roberts today?

[Pickles]

I think everyone made it clear that it was a SSS. If all you have is a SSS I think you are better off using it then going with no information whatsoever.

I for one care more about what he did last year then what he did in 2007.

I'd agree w all that too.

I just think some of the conclusions being drawn from last year's performance, are too strong.

[Can_of_corn]

I'd agree w all that too.

I just think some of the conclusions being drawn from last year's performance, are too strong.

That is a fair position to have.

[Pickles]

Is it odd that two other quality posters on this board told you the exact same thing I did? Is it odd that I'm not wrapped up about the statisitcal significance of 74 AB's? Or is it odd that your game really hasn't changed all that much?

Whatever bro. I've been clear about my point. If you want to get upset and feel I'm attacking you or whatever, reread the thread.

[CA-ORIOLE]

Whatever bro. I've been clear about my point. If you want to get upset and feel I'm attacking you or whatever, reread the thread.

So what did I say to you to deserve this?

Well so long as disregarding stats is left to your discretion and nobody else's.

Odd how that works.

[LookinUp]

1% of O's fans are probably bullish on Roberts' ability to come back and make a positive impact this year. 1% are probably totally writing off the possibility. The other 98% of us are mostly not confident, but regardless are in wait and see mode. Incredibly (actually not so much so since I've been around a while), we spend multiple pages of heated discussion driven by the premise that our minds have to be made up now.

This thread needs a therapist.

I will just add that I'm definitely on the negative side of the spectrum on this issue. My expectations are low and any animosity I have stems from the feeling that Brian's name and the number of 0's on his contract means the fix is in in his favor for at least April. That really bothers me because April games are just as meaningful in the standings as September games, and I don't think we have enough margin for error to potentially sacrifice real games starting in April.

IMO, the O's should absolutely do the organization and the man a solid and give him every opportunity to prove his value. 6 weeks of spring training is a long time. It's plenty of time to assess his defensive range, arm, coordination, baserunning instincts, batting approach and potential for production.

I doubt anyone really has any problem with that plan. The division comes in when judgement day arrives. If Buck/DD keep him around without the right indications for his productive potential this year, people will be mad.

Now, let's hope he's one of our best players this spring and leaves no doubt that he should be our OD 2B. I think that's incredibly unlikely, but damn if I don't hope it happens.

[Ruzious]

So do you think two throwing E's a year is below average?

That's a bizarre question that has nothing to do with the discussion.

[Scrat1]

He also looked bad on defense.

Roberts did not look like a player in a slump last season. He looked like someone that had no business being on the field.

I'm in this camp.

As Frobby pointed out, he does look stronger this year and I hope he proves he isn't done but I'm pretty skeptical. The odds just aren't in his favor. My concern isn't that the Orioles are giving playing time to a player that, in my opinion, is likely done--through tenure and hard work, Roberts has certainly earned his shot--my concern is that they'll keep trotting him out through all of April and May and into June out of deference. If he isn't producing, the leash should be fairly short.

We've got two pretty capable replacements, both of which may have a future with the team, while Roberts likely does not. I personally want to see Flaherty get 60-70% of the playing time if not more to see if he can be a long term solution.

[Pickles]

So what did I say to you to deserve this?

You said you didn't need stats to evaluate Roberts' performance last year.

I found it ironic as we've had long, painful discussion in which you defend the usage of stats, in all cases it seemed to me.

Like I said, don't get too worked up about it. It was tongue in cheek. I even put an emoticon in there to make it clear. Here's another:

P.S. I missed this. The long, cold winter is over.

[El Gordo]

That's a bizarre question that has nothing to do with the discussion.

Not at all. You said he had a poor arm. I'm saying he has an accurate arm and a good DP %. Those are the two main needs for a 2B arm IMO. So do you think two throwing errors a year is an indication of an inaccurate arm?

[CA-ORIOLE]

You said you didn't need stats to evaluate Roberts' performance last year.

I found it ironic as we've had long, painful discussion in which you defend the usage of stats, in all cases it seemed to me.

Like I said, don't get too worked up about it. It was tongue in cheek. I even put an emoticon in there to make it clear. Here's another:

P.S. I missed this. The long, cold winter is over.

I don't. He had 74 AB's. As a "stat guy" I know that his stats over 74 AB's are a fairly irrelevant point. He looked just as bad as the stats last year. How he looked is more relevant. It's the same thing Frobby and COC told you. I'll try and say things nicer though. Here's a smiley face for you.

[Frobby]

Not at all. You said he had a poor arm. I'm saying he has an accurate arm and a good DP %. Those are the two main needs for a 2B arm IMO. So do you think two throwing errors a year is an indication of an inaccurate arm?

Nothing wrong with the accuracy of Roberts' arm, at least in the past. He doesn't have the best arm strength when his momentum carries him towards 2B and he has to make a throw to 1B.

[Ruzious]

Do you ever get the feeling Steve Melewski lurks on this board? From this morning:

Melewski quote:

I can understand that some fans are disappointed that Brian Roberts has not been able to contribute much to the Orioles over the last few seasons. I can get that some fans doubt he can return to the form he once showed or even close to it. I can get that some fans don't think he can come back at all.

But I don't get some of the almost nasty comments I see from time to time on various message boards.

I find that quite often, there will be a heated topic here and Melewski will post an entry on that topic the same day a thread appears here, even when there is no news event that has triggered a discussion of the topic.

Is there a sports message board in America with a pulse that doesn't have nasty comments?

If he was on any other team with a budget getting paid $10 million, I guarantee you there will be comments filled with vitriol. That's part of being a sports fan that cares about their team winning and developing.

[Ruzious]

Not at all. You said he had a poor arm. I'm saying he has an accurate arm and a good DP %. Those are the two main needs for a 2B arm IMO. So do you think two throwing errors a year is an indication of an inaccurate arm?

He has terrible arm strength. That hurts the team. Accuracy should be a given for any 2nd baseman.

[Ruzious]

And some of the comments in this thread are a very good reason why there is so much vitriol about Roberts. It's probably the biggest reason.

[Pickles]

I don't. He had 74 AB's. As a "stat guy" I know that his stats over 74 AB's are a fairly irrelevant point. He looked just as bad as the stats last year. How he looked is more relevant. It's the same thing Frobby and COC told you. I'll try and say things nicer though. Here's a smiley face for you.

I'll keep that in mind next time we discuss defensive stats.

Like I said, relax. It's a long season. We have many months to disgust each other.

<3