Can you fill out the O's roster for less than $10M?

[ChuckS]

They could and probably will cut some salary.

For ten mil I'm probably resigning Pearce and signing Matt Joyce.

That makes your OF: Jones, Kim/Rickard, Pearce/Joyce. I think it will hit and play slightly better d than last year.

[wildcard]

You dispute that view?

Dispute is probably too strong a word. Joseph offers the O's a lot. If Wieters goes then Joesph is the catcher with the most experience catching the O's staff. He knows the pitchers likes and dislikes well. He knows their pitches and how to be successful in calling a good game with those pitches. He called a good game.

Joseph is good defensively at blocking pitches and catching pitches. His throwing is good enough to hold the position as a good defensive catcher at 35% of steals caught over the last 3 years. That in its self puts Joseph in a very favorable position if Wieters leaves. That position will get him a lot of playing time.

On top of that Joseph's 2015 offensive numbers being close to Wieters numbers makes him the most likely catcher to catch the staff next year. He probably can't effectively catch as many games as Wieters because of size, but he can catch the majority of games. I don't agree with the posters that are focused on his 2016 offense when he caught few games. It didn't allow him to get his timing down IMO.

I believe the O's know this as well as anyone. If Sisco is not ready next spring as many project then I look for the O's to add a veteran catcher to share time with Joseph next year much like happened with Hundley in 2015. Dan Duquette seems to feel that Sisco will help the O's at some point next year. His progress will be followed closely by all.

I am not saying that others are wrong in their projections. Just that I don't agree with them at this point. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[weams]

Dispute is probably too strong a word. Joseph offers the O's a lot. If Wieters goes then Joesph is the catcher with the most experience catching the O's staff. He knows the pitchers likes and dislikes well. He knows their pitches and how to be successful in calling a good game with those pitches. He called a good game.

Joseph is good defensively at blocking pitches and catching pitches. His throwing is good enough to hold the position as a good defensive catcher at 35% of steals caught over the last 3 years. That in its self puts Joseph in a very favorable position if Wieters leaves. That position will get him a lot of playing time.

On top of that Joseph's 2015 offensive numbers being close to Wieters numbers makes him the most likely pitcher to catch the staff next year. He probably can't effective catch as many games as Wieters because of size, but he can catch the majority of games. I don't agree with the posters that are focused on his 2016 offense when he caught few games. It didn't allow him to get his timing down IMO.

I believe the O's know this as well as anyone. If Sisco is not ready next spring as many project then I look for the O's to add a veteran catcher to share time with Joseph next year much like happened with Hundley in 2015. Dan Duquette seems to feel that Sisco will help the O's as some point next year. His progress will be followed closely by all.

Ok. I disagree with most all of what you wrote here. At this point it is the 2015 season that appears to be the aberration in Joseph's career not 2016 as an outlier.

[Camden_yardbird]

To format your roster a bit:

C - Iannetta (2y/6M)

1B - Davis - $23M

2B - Schoop - $3.4M (arb)

SS - Hardy - $14M

3B - Machado - $11.2M (arb)

LF - Kim - $4.2M

CF - Jones - $16.3M

RF - Franklin Gutierrez (1y/4M)

DH - Brandon Moss (2y/18M)

C - Joseph - $1M (arb)

IF - Flaherty - $1.7M (arb)

OF - Rickard

UTIL - Descalso (1y/2.5M)

SP - Tillman - $10.6M (arb)

SP -Gausman - $3.9M (arb)

SP - Jimenez - $13.5M

SP - Bundy? - $2M

SP - Gallardo - $11M

CL - Britton - $11.4M (arb)

SU - O'Day - $7M

SU - Brach - $2.9M (arb)

MR - Givens - pre-arb

MR - Hart

MR - Drake

LR - Miley - $8.92M

------------------------

So that's 7 spots. 1 Catcher, 2 OF plus 2 other bats, and 2 MR.

I filled in what I think is completely doable off season that adds a ton of on base skills to the team. The estimate on Moss may be a bit off and the total is a bit higher than 10M but it's only 15M.

[Aristotelian]

Dispute is probably too strong a word. Joseph offers the O's a lot. If Wieters goes then Joesph is the catcher with the most experience catching the O's staff. He knows the pitchers likes and dislikes well. He knows their pitches and how to be successful in calling a good game with those pitches. He called a good game.

Joseph is good defensively at blocking pitches and catching pitches. His throwing is good enough to hold the position as a good defensive catcher at 35% of steals caught over the last 3 years. That in its self puts Joseph in a very favorable position if Wieters leaves. That position will get him a lot of playing time.

On top of that Joseph's 2015 offensive numbers being close to Wieters numbers makes him the most likely catcher to catch the staff next year. He probably can't effectively catch as many games as Wieters because of size, but he can catch the majority of games. I don't agree with the posters that are focused on his 2016 offense when he caught few games. It didn't allow him to get his timing down IMO.

I believe the O's know this as well as anyone. If Sisco is not ready next spring as many project then I look for the O's to add a veteran catcher to share time with Joseph next year much like happened with Hundley in 2015. Dan Duquette seems to feel that Sisco will help the O's at some point next year. His progress will be followed closely by all.

I am not saying the others are wrong in their projections. Just that I don't agree with them at this point. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Ok. I disagree with most all of what you wrote here. At this point it is the 2015 season that appears to be the aberration in Joseph's career not 2016 as an outlier.

For what it's worth, I agree mostly with wildcard. Joseph had a horrible year offensively last year, but brings so much to the table defensively. He was set back by the injury as well as Buck's refusal to give him any kind of consistent playing time. I'd like to see what he can do, if not as a starter at least as 200+ AB backup. If he hits to his 2014-15 norms, he is a 1.5 WAR guy over 300-400 ABs. If he also saves us $17M and clears the way for Sisco, I am fine with letting Wieters go.

[25 Nuggets]

They could and probably will cut some salary.

For ten mil I'm probably resigning Pearce and signing Matt Joyce.

That makes your OF: Jones, Kim/Rickard, Pearce/Joyce. I think it will hit and play slightly better d than last year.

Joyce would be a priority target for me for his OBP. But that OF defense won't be much better than this season... aka, bad.

[weams]

I am fine with letting Wieters go.

Me too. But I was simply stating hat I believed to be the universal upide evaluation of Joseph. Which is not a strong regular MLB player. Not that he cant be useful. Like any of the guys who make it to the top 800 in the world at something.

[Aristotelian]

Me too. But I was simply stating hat I believed to be the universal upide evaluation of Joseph. Which is not a strong regular MLB player. Not that he cant be useful. Like any of the guys who make it to the top 800 in the world at something.

That is true, journeyman catcher is about right. But that could be a valuable player relative to the cost. He is not much better than replacement level. But you need to have a couple of $500K replacement level guys. 1-1.5 WAR mostly from defense would be just fine from the C position is it doesn't cost us anything and enables to us to upgrade elsewhere.

[Bradysburns]

That is true, journeyman catcher is about right. But that could be a valuable player relative to the cost. He is not much better than replacement level. But you need to have a couple of $500K replacement level guys. 1-1.5 WAR mostly from defense would be just fine from the C position is it doesn't cost us anything and enables to us to upgrade elsewhere.

I personally think that Caleb could be a solid starting catcher. He's shown flashes of above-average-ness at multiple levels. His 2013 season at Bowie was no fluke, IMO.

I would be interested to see what he could do with a full, healthy season. But maybe he's kind of the Reimold of catchers, and will always tantalize but never fully put it together.

Either way, I'd prefer to have a plus defender behind the plate. Maybe he'll "frame" better than Wieters.

[backwardsk]

Cameron Maybin is a guy who may not have his option picked up though he had a very good year in limited time. If you had him you could play him in a corner and wouldn't have to carry a back up CFer.

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[Aristotelian]

Cameron Maybin is a guy who may not have his option picked up though he had a very good year in limited time. If you had him you could play him in a corner and wouldn't have to carry a back up CFer.

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I like Maybin a lot, but I would be surprised if they don't pick up his option. I would be a little worried about buying high on a guy that has been inconsistent over his career and could regress/deteriorate rather quickly, but I like him a lot.

[wildcard]

I like Maybin a lot, but I would be surprised if they don't pick up his option. I would be a little worried about buying high on a guy that has been inconsistent over his career and could regress/deteriorate rather quickly, but I like him a lot.

Sure sounds like the Tigers may not pick up his options. They sound like they will cut payroll and try to get younger.

Maybin had a career year in 2016 for OBP. He has never had an OBP for more than 327 before last year in any year in the majors with at least 40 at bats. So I think the O's have to be careful thinking he is a high OBP guy.

He is a right-handed hit which may not match the O's needs. The O's only have two lefties that are regulars under contract for next year. Davis and Kim. Alvarez and Wieters are free agents and may not be back. The O's may want to fill right field with a left handed hitter.

Maybin's option is for 9m. The O's probably don't want to pay that much so a trade is probably out. His FA value maybe lower.

[backwardsk]

I like Maybin a lot, but I would be surprised if they don't pick up his option. I would be a little worried about buying high on a guy that has been inconsistent over his career and could regress/deteriorate rather quickly, but I like him a lot.

This is what brought up the idea for me.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/10/al-avila-changes-are-coming-to-tigers.html?fv-home=true&post-id=75066