Chris Davis 2019 and beyond

[Lucky_13]

5 minutes ago, Three Run Homer said:

The season is lost competitively, but by keeping Davis in the lineup, Buck is sending a message that the allocation of playing time depends only on salaries and loyalty, not on performance.  I think that message is harmful to team morale and contributes to a lackadaisical attitude among the young players who need to have a fire lit under their butts, like Trey Mancini, Jonathan Schoop and Chance Sisco.   I don't care if the O's win a single game for the rest of the season, but I want their young players to play better.  

I also want DJ Stewart or Ryan Mountcastle to have the opportunity to get playing time later in the season.  Chris Davis is blocking those players.  

And there's the single biggest reason Trumbo needs to be traded for literally anything. With him and Davis on the  roster there is absolutely no flexibility. Trading Trumbo minimizes that a bit and opens up a spot in left field and DH. 

 

[ThomasTomasz]

50 minutes ago, atomic said:

Buck is the main reason guys aren't hustling, guys are playing out of position, Davis. plays every game, people steal when they shouldn't be, why pitchers are left into hit and immediately removed.  Why Davis never bunts.  Why the team's decision on whom pitches in relief are based on the save rule.   So yeah they probably would still be losing but they would be playing baseball the right way.  

You are also forgetting the cookie-cutter approach to pitching- the minimalist windup with the pitcher starting from the stretch and stepping back one small step, to everyone learning the sidestep from the stretch to be quicker to the plate (despite steals being down across the league.)  It's no wonder Arrieta found himself as an ace in Chicago, Davies went from being a projected 5/6 starter to being a middle rotation piece in Milwaukee and Hader being a shutdown relief ace as well.  

I like Buck, he's managed the team very well up to this point, but he's definitely a problem from the influence he seems to have over other managers on other teams.  Even Scoscia, with his tenure in LA, doesn't have that kind of power and influence. 

[Going Underground]

13 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I don’t see any improvement at all. And he’s made attempts to go the opposite way throughout the season, not just recently.   

His strikeout rate was 33% in April, 39% in May, 47% so far in June.   

He hasn’t hit a home run in a month.   He hasn’t hit a double in three weeks.

How much more do we need to see?    I’d bury him deep on the bench.     He hurts the team every game he plays.

I think the team really not having a chance for anything keeps him playing.If they had a chance for a wildcard or something then he would be playing less.He makes too much money and his contract is many years out.Orioles hope he finds himself maybe a little bit and go from there.Dont see it but money changes everything. 

[Frobby]

9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Couple thousand more at bats should do it.

I know you’re just being cynical, but I’m really alarmed that the O’s aren’t taking more drastic action.   Look, in the 15+ years I’ve been posting here, I’ve almost always been the guy saying, don’t overreact, be patient, etc.    I was even saying that when people were going ballistic 2-3 days into the “Davis bats leadoff” experiment.   But anyone who has watched Davis this year knows by now that this isn’t some slump that’s going to go away with more at bats.   He’s not just “not contributing,” he’s actively detracting from the team.   There are literally hundreds of AA players who could outhit Davis right now.    I suppose his contract means that we have to keep him on the team this year and pray for a miracle over the winter, but we sure as hell don’t need to play him everyday, or even half the days.    He needs to be deep on the bench.   

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I know you’re just being cynical, but I’m really alarmed that the O’s aren’t taking more drastic action.   Look, in the 15+ years I’ve been posting here, I’ve almost always been the guy saying, don’t overreact, be patient, etc.    I was even saying that when people were going ballistic 2-3 days into the “Davis bats leadoff” experiment.   But anyone who has watched Davis this year knows by now that this isn’t some slump that’s going to go away with more at bats.   He’s not just “not contributing,” he’s actively detracting from the team.   There are literally hundreds of AA players who could outhit Davis right now.    I suppose his contract means that we have to keep him on the team this year and pray for a miracle over the winter, but we sure as hell don’t need to play him everyday, or even half the days.    He needs to be deep on the bench.   

I may have been being cynical but I'm honest in my belief that we could be looking at years of this.

[Chavez Ravine]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

I may have been being cynical but I'm honest in my belief that we could be looking at years of this.

The running of this team provides lots of precedent to suppprt you.  But crikey, I can’t wrap my nut around the thought. Even the Orioles as we have come to know them wouldn’t do that....would they?

[Hank Scorpio]

8 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I may have been being cynical but I'm honest in my belief that we could be looking at years of this.

I'd say that's very likely. 

[Can_of_corn]

7 minutes ago, Chavez Ravine said:

The running of this team provides lots of precedent to suppprt you.  But crikey, I can’t wrap my nut around the thought. Even the Orioles as we have come to know them wouldn’t do that....would they?

Longest train wreck in history.

[jabba72]

14 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I may have been being cynical but I'm honest in my belief that we could be looking at years of this.

His horrible offense comes in handy when you're shooting for the #1 overall pick, l give him props for that. What cant miss superstars are in the '19 and '20 drafts? 

[Camden_yardbird]

28 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I don’t see any improvement at all. And he’s made attempts to go the opposite way throughout the season, not just recently.   

His strikeout rate was 33% in April, 39% in May, 47% so far in June.   

He hasn’t hit a home run in a month.   He hasn’t hit a double in three weeks.

How much more do we need to see?    I’d bury him deep on the bench.     He hurts the team every game he plays.

Chris spray charts are interesting.  

His spray chart shows that a majority of his singles have gone the opposite way.  Like 13-7.  I'm not defending Davis, but with the shift he really can't get a base hit to RF.

His 5 doubles are situated around center field - nothing down the line, suggesting a lack of bat speed?

What is most interesting though is the giant freaking void of balls hit to the second base side of second base in the shallow outfield (a spit off used in more successful days)  No singles, no doubles, nothing - not even an out.  In fact there is a distinct lack of balls being pulled in any capacity.  I don't know what that means, probably nothing, and his pull/center/OPPO numbers are pretty normal.

 

 

[atomic]

Dean Chance hit .033 in 108 PA appearance in 1967.   He did win 20 games and was an all-star that year.  

[Redskins Rick]

How this for:

Quote

1. Bill Bergen C (.170/.194/.201 avg. WAR* -14.85, in 3228 PA):

My guess is the majority of baseball fans (even really passionate baseball fans) have never heard of Bill Bergen. Probably because he played his career from 1901-11. In 2011, Joe Pawlikowski of Fangraphs wrote about Bergen, calling him the "Worst Hitter in Baseball History". Pawlikowski was dead-on about the catcher. In 11 career seasons, Bergen hit two total home runs and had a wRC+ and OPS+ of 16 and 21, respectively. Bergen struck out 354 more times in his career than he had extra base hits. His best season came with the Cincinnati Reds, in 1903. That season was the only year his batting average was above .200, his wRC+ and OPS+ were 37 and 41... in his BEST season, that's unbelievably bad.

When discussing Bergen, modern-day glove-first catchers, like Jose Molina and Jeff Mathis come to mind. Mathis' career wRC+ (48) is terrible, but he's had almost 2,000 less PAs, in his career, than Bergen and his wRC+ is still 32 points higher than Bergen's. Molina has over 1,000 less PAs, and probably will never reach the number of plate appearances that Bergen had, and put up a much more "respectable" wRC+ of 65.

It's hard for me to understand how the Brooklyn Superbas could not find another primary catcher to replace the negative WAR'ing Bergen. In 1909, Bergen's OPS+ was 1 and his wRC+ was -1, yet he played in 112 games. That season he had 54 total bases and 50 strikeouts in 372 PA. Brooklyn was bad that season, their record was 55-98, but were they really that bad that they couldn't find another catcher? Their back-up catcher in 1909, Doc Marshall, was bad in 156 PAs (56 OPS+), but still nowhere near as horrible as Bergen. Maybe the catcher was incredible at handling a pitching staff, I really don't know, but in all honesty Bergen's long career does not make any sense to me.

https://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2012/7/9/3139176/worst-players-in-baseball-history

 

[Can_of_corn]

8 minutes ago, Camden_yardbird said:

Chris spray charts are interesting.  

His spray chart shows that a majority of his singles have gone the opposite way.  Like 13-7.  I'm not defending Davis, but with the shift he really can't get a base hit to RF.

His 5 doubles are situated around center field - nothing down the line, suggesting a lack of bat speed?

What is most interesting though is the giant freaking void of balls hit to the second base side of second base in the shallow outfield (a spit off used in more successful days)  No singles, no doubles, nothing - not even an out.  In fact there is a distinct lack of balls being pulled in any capacity.  I don't know what that means, probably nothing, and his pull/center/OPPO numbers are pretty normal.

 

 

He hits 36 HR, 28 doubles and a triple a year and  don't care if he singles.   It would still be terrible mind you.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

33 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I know you’re just being cynical, but I’m really alarmed that the O’s aren’t taking more drastic action.   Look, in the 15+ years I’ve been posting here, I’ve almost always been the guy saying, don’t overreact, be patient, etc.    I was even saying that when people were going ballistic 2-3 days into the “Davis bats leadoff” experiment.   But anyone who has watched Davis this year knows by now that this isn’t some slump that’s going to go away with more at bats.   He’s not just “not contributing,” he’s actively detracting from the team.   There are literally hundreds of AA players who could outhit Davis right now.    I suppose his contract means that we have to keep him on the team this year and pray for a miracle over the winter, but we sure as hell don’t need to play him everyday, or even half the days.    He needs to be deep on the bench.   

At a minimum Buck should be benching Davis 2 to 3 days a week.  The one position they have depth (albeit medicore) at is 1B/DH.  There is no good reason for Davis to be on pace to play 146 games.  

[Babypowder]

At this point, if the owner won’t let me cut him and the team isn’t contending, I keep running him out there everyday hoping that one of Davis or the owner loses this weird game of chicken.