Who’s your pick for MVO?

[Legend_Of_Joey]

Unless Means goes and pitches a perfect game, I believe it will be Mancini.

Every game, they give him the most air time, stats, ect

 He is THE face of the franchise this season, has been putting up good numbers and has taken a leadership role.

[Frobby]

10 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Honestly outside of the truly elite not many SPs go 6+ innings anymore so I'm not sure I'd hold that against him. The telling stat for me is that his era is a 1.5 is better than our next best SP (Bundy). He's literally been a lone diamond in a dumpster fire. 

Well, there’s certainly no doubt that he’s been the most valuable member of our pitching staff.   That said, I’m always reluctant to choose someone who plays every fifth day over someone who plays every day, and that’s particularly true when the guy who plays every fifth day isn’t soaking up a ton of innings.     I recognize that pitchers don’t log the innings that they used to, but there are 34 pitchers in the AL who’ve pitched more innings than Means.     So, he’s not saving our bullpen much, except in comparison with the rest of our lousy rotation.    

Again, I’m not saying this as a knock on Means.   I’m thrilled with his season.  But to me this is a point against him in the MVO race.   It doesn’t knock him out of consideration, it’s just one factor to weigh.    

[Tony-OH]

I voted Mancini but I could have gone with Villar as well. I think Villar's lack of effort occasionally and base paths blunders is what shaded me towards Mancini for MVO.

Saying that, if Villar did receive it I would not be upset as he clearly has the best WAR despite being forced to play out of position at SS a lot this year.

[Frobby]

40 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

I voted Mancini but I could have gone with Villar as well. I think Villar's lack of effort occasionally and base paths blunders is what shaded me towards Mancini for MVO.

Saying that, if Villar did receive it I would not be upset as he clearly has the best WAR despite being forced to play out of position at SS a lot this year.

There’s little doubt in my mind that Mancini will win the award given by the local media.   He’s a media favorite (for good reason) and his offensive numbers stack up well.   I don’t think the local media are the most forward-thinking group when it comes to things like weighing offense and defense, etc.    And with Sig coming out and saying the defensive metrics aren’t that reliable, the media have all the justification they need to disregard WAR.

[Roll Tide]

I would think Villar, Alberto, Mancini, and Means would all be in the conversation. Means has my vote for the biggest surprise.

otherwise, it’s a moot point for a team that has lost 100+ games

[Philip]

Means = good pitcher =“oh my god such a rarity”

And a huge helping of Serendipity as well.

he wins.

[DrungoHazewood]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

There’s little doubt in my mind that Mancini will win the award given by the local media.   He’s a media favorite (for good reason) and his offensive numbers stack up well.   I don’t think the local media are the most forward-thinking group when it comes to things like weighing offense and defense, etc.    And with Sig coming out and saying the defensive metrics aren’t that reliable, the media have all the justification they need to disregard WAR.

The old-school media is funny.  They always harp on how defense and pitching and little things win games, then they give the MVP to the guy who led in RBI.

[O's84]

20 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

The old-school media is funny.  They always harp on how defense and pitching and little things win games, then they give the MVP to the guy who led in RBI.

[Aristotelian]

Definitely Villar. Plays non-embarrassing defense at SS and 2B. Mancini is a DH and/or embarrassing OF that negates much, if any, offensive edge he has on Villar.

I would rank them Villar, Means, Mancini, then a close call between Alberto and also Santander.

[Philip]

8 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Definitely Villar. Plays non-embarrassing defense at SS and 2B. Mancini is a DH and/or embarrassing OF that negates much, if any, offensive edge he has on Villar.

I would rank them Villar, Means, Mancini, then a close call between Alberto and also Santander.

Considering his defense is “non-embarrassing” he’s made an awful lot of embarrassing plays this season.

Honestly, I pretty much agree with you, but man, his lapses have been really egregious. Not just his errors, but how many times does he not cover the base when he needs to, Or amble to the ball leisurely because he thinks he has more time than he does? Stuff like that makes the manager wanna jump off a cliff.

[NCRaven]

If anyone is giving a mulligan to Villar for playing out of position at SS when he's better at 2B and dinging Mancini for being a below average outfielder when he's really a first baseman, well...

I voted Mancini.  Villar would be fine with me too.  I agree with FRobby on Means.

[Can_of_corn]

Means but I expect the media to give it to Mancini.

 

[DrungoHazewood]

I don't completely get the starting pitcher playing time argument.  Means hasn't even been in the rotation all year and has faced 588 batters, which is more plate appearances than all but Villar and Mancini.  And yes, position players also have more of a defensive responsibility than pitchers, but neither Villar nor Mancini is a positive in (defense + position).

Also, just realized that base stealers are 0-for-1 with Means on the mound this year.

[Frobby]

On 9/18/2019 at 5:13 PM, DrungoHazewood said:

Also, just realized that base stealers are 0-for-1 with Means on the mound this year.

Wow.   

[DrungoHazewood]

9 hours ago, Frobby said:

Wow.   

That's some Dave Johnson level skills there.  Johnson had, like, 35 stuff.  But an 80 hold runners.  And he's right handed!  In 368 innings base stealers were four-for-17 off Johnson.