Who will be the #19 and #20 Prospects

[Tony-OH]

Who will be the #19 and #20 Prospects

[LookinUp]

No freaking clue at this point. Lol.

[DirtyBird]

McKenna and Zimmerman would be good. I had them 18 and 20.

[ChosenOne21]

Yeah, this is getting difficult. I doubt Tate and McCoy are this high, so that eliminates those two options. Rodriguez and Stauffer would be the sexy pick, but I feel like those guys are too much of an unknown compared to the other options. My gut tells me it's Bannon and Pop because I know Luke loves Bannon and while Pop had TJS, the recovery rate is excellent and he has 8th/9th inning upside and is basically ready. McKenna seems to have hit a wall and I'm not quite a believer in Zimmermann, but I think they're defensible here.

[Frobby]

Interesting choices.    I’m going with McKenna and Zimmermann (two n’s, by the way, like Jordan not Ryan).     They’re sort of opposite sides of the spectrum: McKenna kind of floundered this year and it sounds like he had some attitude issues and technical problems with his approach at the plate.   Zimmermann on the other hand improved just about every aspect of his pitching and used the technology the O’s offered to maximum effect.    So, they’re an interesting pairing.   
 

I kind of like the Bannon/Pop tandem too, but I’ve been under the impression that Tony’s not that high on Bannon, and of course we don’t know what version of Pop we’ll get post-surgery.    But I think either of those guys could develop into major league contributors.   

[7Mo]

15 minutes ago, ChosenOne21 said:

Yeah, this is getting difficult. I doubt Tate and McCoy are this high, so that eliminates those two options. Rodriguez and Stauffer would be the sexy pick, but I feel like those guys are too much of an unknown compared to the other options. My gut tells me it's Bannon and Pop because I know Luke loves Bannon and while Pop had TJS, the recovery rate is excellent and he has 8th/9th inning upside and is basically ready. McKenna seems to have hit a wall and I'm not quite a believer in Zimmermann, but I think they're defensible here.

Not suggesting you're wrong by any means and you're certainly not the only one who doesn't have great confidence in Zimmerman but there is this:

Holt on Zimmermann: “Man, where do I start? No. 1, his fastball got better. No. 2, his curveball got better. No. 3, his changeup got better. Four, his command and approach to attack hitters got better. He overall took everything that we would throw at him and put it to use to make it actionable on field. Just really proud of that guy for the work ethic and willingness to go out and work to improve all facets of his game. Certainly a guy who does fly below the radar. But certainly a guy who is capable of being an impact guy at the big league level at some point.”

After hearing Holt’s very positive comments on Zimmermann, I asked him if maybe this was the pitcher that came the farthest on the farm this year.

“He came over from the Braves, so largely what we had looked at prior to his arrival, he was throwing a lot of two-seam fastballs and changeups down and away,” Holt said. “Kind of indicative of a little more of a Braves/National League style. He basically was able to take more advantage of a four-seam fastball and his changeup, so it allowed him to use more on plate and use more of the plate up and down in the zone.

“As I said, his curveball got much better and his slider was very, very solid and so overall, yes, he made as much improvement as anyone in the organization. It was a testament to his willingness to go and do work and take accurate information and formulate a plan and put it to use.”

[Big Mac]

6 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

Not suggesting you're wrong by any means and you're certainly not the only one who doesn't have great confidence in Zimmerman but there is this:

Holt on Zimmermann: “Man, where do I start? No. 1, his fastball got better. No. 2, his curveball got better. No. 3, his changeup got better. Four, his command and approach to attack hitters got better. He overall took everything that we would throw at him and put it to use to make it actionable on field. Just really proud of that guy for the work ethic and willingness to go out and work to improve all facets of his game. Certainly a guy who does fly below the radar. But certainly a guy who is capable of being an impact guy at the big league level at some point.”

After hearing Holt’s very positive comments on Zimmermann, I asked him if maybe this was the pitcher that came the farthest on the farm this year.

“He came over from the Braves, so largely what we had looked at prior to his arrival, he was throwing a lot of two-seam fastballs and changeups down and away,” Holt said. “Kind of indicative of a little more of a Braves/National League style. He basically was able to take more advantage of a four-seam fastball and his changeup, so it allowed him to use more on plate and use more of the plate up and down in the zone.

“As I said, his curveball got much better and his slider was very, very solid and so overall, yes, he made as much improvement as anyone in the organization. It was a testament to his willingness to go and do work and take accurate information and formulate a plan and put it to use.”

I'm a big believer in Zimmermann.  I had him at 17 on my list (notably in front of Wells and Hanifee) and was tempted to rank him even a little bit higher. 

[sportsfan8703]

We just had two former 2nd rounders go, so I'm going with two former 1st rounders.  People are so down on Tate, I don't get it.  Ok, so he's not a SP, but he showed enough to be a solid reliever at the MLB level.  He also reached that MLB ceiling and showed that he could have success.  So no point in having A ball "relievers" ranked over him.  

Sedlock had a big time bounce back year.  Over a SO an inning across two levels, while logging around 100 IP.  Next year will be a big year for him to see if he can be a SP.  Even if he's not, he's still likely got a solid chance at being a MR in the MLB.  

Harvey, Tate, Sedlock, could be the core of our bullpen when we compete again.  

[Big Mac]

3 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We just had two former 2nd rounders go, so I'm going with two former 1st rounders.  People are so down on Tate, I don't get it.  Ok, so he's not a SP, but he showed enough to be a solid reliever at the MLB level.  He also reached that MLB ceiling and showed that he could have success.  So no point in having A ball "relievers" ranked over him.  

Sedlock had a big time bounce back year.  Over a SO an inning across two levels, while logging around 100 IP.  Next year will be a big year for him to see if he can be a SP.  Even if he's not, he's still likely got a solid chance at being a MR in the MLB.  

Harvey, Tate, Sedlock, could be the core of our bullpen when we compete again.  

Did he though?  He put up a 6.43 ERA and a 5.17 FIP in 21 ML IP.  I think he showed flashes and there's a reasonable chance he could improve, but I see a middle relief ceiling with a strong likelihood that he is nothing more than a AAAA pitcher. 

[DirtyBird]

Tony has definitely stopped trying to be as tricky with the choices.

[Ruzious]

1 hour ago, 7Mo said:

Not suggesting you're wrong by any means and you're certainly not the only one who doesn't have great confidence in Zimmerman but there is this:

Holt on Zimmermann: “Man, where do I start? No. 1, his fastball got better. No. 2, his curveball got better. No. 3, his changeup got better. Four, his command and approach to attack hitters got better. He overall took everything that we would throw at him and put it to use to make it actionable on field. Just really proud of that guy for the work ethic and willingness to go out and work to improve all facets of his game. Certainly a guy who does fly below the radar. But certainly a guy who is capable of being an impact guy at the big league level at some point.”

After hearing Holt’s very positive comments on Zimmermann, I asked him if maybe this was the pitcher that came the farthest on the farm this year.

“He came over from the Braves, so largely what we had looked at prior to his arrival, he was throwing a lot of two-seam fastballs and changeups down and away,” Holt said. “Kind of indicative of a little more of a Braves/National League style. He basically was able to take more advantage of a four-seam fastball and his changeup, so it allowed him to use more on plate and use more of the plate up and down in the zone.

“As I said, his curveball got much better and his slider was very, very solid and so overall, yes, he made as much improvement as anyone in the organization. It was a testament to his willingness to go and do work and take accurate information and formulate a plan and put it to use.”

This is big, because the O's got a guy who was essentially a non-prospect with the Braves, and on the O's watch - he's become a prospect.  That gives me hope.  

[7Mo]

1 minute ago, Ruzious said:

This is big, because the O's got a guy who was essentially a non-prospect with the Braves, and on the O's watch - he's become a prospect.  That gives me hope.  

Agreed. Good point. 

[Tony-OH]

36 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We just had two former 2nd rounders go, so I'm going with two former 1st rounders.  People are so down on Tate, I don't get it.  Ok, so he's not a SP, but he showed enough to be a solid reliever at the MLB level.  He also reached that MLB ceiling and showed that he could have success.  So no point in having A ball "relievers" ranked over him.  

Sedlock had a big time bounce back year.  Over a SO an inning across two levels, while logging around 100 IP.  Next year will be a big year for him to see if he can be a SP.  Even if he's not, he's still likely got a solid chance at being a MR in the MLB.  

Harvey, Tate, Sedlock, could be the core of our bullpen when we compete again.  

Tate is basically a sinker changeup pitcher who throws a terribly inconsistent slider. He was scored upon in 6 of the 9 outings in which he threw 18 pitches or more. He's a guy who was never consistently good in the minors and he was a guy who was never consistently good in the majors. While he did flash good stuff at times, and did have some good outings, he's similar to Tanner Scott in that he's a bit of a box of chocolates. 

I'd like to hope that he can put it all together and be more consistent now that he's moved to the pen, and that's why he's going to still be on the list, but he's a 6th inning/middle relief guy for me until he can prove he can be consistent with his stuff. He also needs to ditch that slider or get better at not leaving it in the middle of the plate. Same goes for the fastball/sinker when it straightens out.

He very well may end up better than some of the A-ball guys we'll have above him, but they all have the potential to be starters so if I gotta have one guy I'll take the younger one and hope he develops into something more than a 40 relief pitcher that believe Tate is at this time.

[Tony-OH]

20 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Tony has definitely stopped trying to be as tricky with the choices.

Hahah. I decided at this point to not repeat names which probably makes it easier but also gives you guys more players to discuss.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Tate is basically a sinker changeup pitcher who throws a terribly inconsistent slider. He was scored upon in 6 of the 9 outings in which he threw 18 pitches or more. He's a guy who was never consistently good in the minors and he was a guy who was never consistently good in the majors. While he did flash good stuff at times, and did have some good outings, he's similar to Tanner Scott in that he's a bit of a box of chocolates. 

I'd like to hope that he can put it all together and be more consistent now that he's moved to the pen, and that's why he's going to still be on the list, but he's a 6th inning/middle relief guy for me until he can prove he can be consistent with his stuff. He also needs to ditch that slider or get better at not leaving it in the middle of the plate. Same goes for the fastball/sinker when it straightens out.

He very well may end up better than some of the A-ball guys we'll have above him, but they all have the potential to be starters so if I gotta have one guy I'll take the younger one and hope he develops into something more than a 40 relief pitcher that believe Tate is at this time.

I hate to give support to Moose but if Tate was a fourth round pick no one would be talking about him.

Of course I don't think teams fall into that trap much these days.