Calling Elias incompetent is unfair

[Roll Tide]

3 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

You say it's a stupid risk but what if Elias knew he had 2 or more teams pretty interested?

If he waits, or lets the other teams continue to slow play him, he's gotta tender and then deal with whatever the arb figure winds up being.

If he outrights, he forces their hand.

 

It has already been mentioned that the Arb money is not guaranteed. So even at 11 Million he can be cut in spring training.

[Roll Tide]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'll admit that is is possible he turned down more at the deadline that he can get now.  I just don't think he turned down anything that would actually aid the rebuild in a meaningful way.

Do you think the Cashner return did? just curious, I'd argue that even a similar return is better than nothing.

[NCRaven]

1 hour ago, weams said:

I tear down an old fixer upper. I think the wiring in an addition is satisfactory. But I'm taking it sown to the studs and rewiring all the rest of the house. I'll do the addition too. 

Sure.  But the wiring has salvage value.  You don’t just throw it in the dumpster.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Do you think the Cashner return did? just curious, I'd argue that even a similar return is better than nothing.

I think the Cashner trade was about dumping his salary.

[Roll Tide]

4 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

Absolutely he did. And he's projected at 1.8 WAR.

But no matter. I can say all day what my house is worth. But what's the true value?

What someone will pay for it.

By Who? Fangraphs?

So even at 1.8 he's worth more than the 10.4 number.

How would you project 1.8 when he's produced 2.7 and 4.0. He is in his prime at 29.

I'd bet a pretty healthy amount that he outperforms 1.8!

[7Mo]

2 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

It has already been mentioned that the Arb money is not guaranteed. So even at 11 Million he can be cut in spring training.

Yes, and that's a good point. A few days ago, I asked if it was dirty pool to tender a guy and then cut him in spring training.

And Tony felt like the "cut in ST part" meant that Elias was forcing the hand of interested teams.

But either way, if the market has said he has no value at the arb figure, he wouldn't have more value in ST

[Roll Tide]

Just now, 7Mo said:

Yes, and that's a good point. A few days ago, I asked if it was dirty pool to tender a guy and then cut him in spring training.

And Tony felt like the "cut in ST part" meant that Elias was forcing the hand of interested teams.

But either way, if the market has said he has no value at the arb figure, he wouldn't have more value in ST

Demand is controlled by need & availability. The arb figure isnt a given as I've already mentioned and Value is created by demand.

If one or more of the big spenders lost their SS or 2B for the season in the spring it would certainly effect Villar's value

[7Mo]

1 minute ago, Roll Tide said:

By Who? Fangraphs?

So even at 1.8 he's worth more than the 10.4 number.

How would you project 1.8 when he's produced 2.7 and 4.0. He is in his prime at 29.

I'd bet a pretty healthy amount that he outperforms 1.8!

I understand you'd make that bet.

But 29 other teams aren't...yet.

[Roll Tide]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think the Cashner trade was about dumping his salary.

I agree ...But if one of the lottery tickets hits you have a ton of value. In this case you don't even have that!

[Roll Tide]

1 minute ago, 7Mo said:

I understand you'd make that bet.

But 29 other teams aren't...yet.

I agree that Elias has yet to be offered what it would take.

[7Mo]

1 minute ago, Roll Tide said:

Demand is controlled by need & availability. The arb figure isnt a given as I've already mentioned and Value is created by demand.

If one or more of the big spenders lost their SS or 2B for the season in the spring it would certainly effect Villar's value

Definitely could. Unfortunately Villar isn't the only available middle infielder. Maybe a team wants a more reliable fielder at a lower salary........like we do.

[Roll Tide]

Just now, 7Mo said:

Definitely could. Unfortunately Villar isn't the only available middle infielder. Maybe a team wants a more reliable fielder at a lower salary........like we do.

All scenarios are possible. We could do this all day.

[7Mo]

3 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I agree ...But if one of the lottery tickets hits you have a ton of value. In this case you don't even have that!

Maybe we get that by Monday. Two 17 year olds who won't be well known for years. 

[7Mo]

Just now, Roll Tide said:

All scenarios are possible. We could do this all day.

We pretty much have.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Roll Tide said:

Strong opinions from a guy that has 111 posts in 8 years that is here using his handle to advertise his Facebook Blog site.

I really hate it when a poster dismisses another poster’s opinion based on how many posts that poster has made.    It discourages those who lurk and rarely post from posting at all.   I’m thoroughly against that.