No more argument to play Chris Davis

[CarrRun49]

2 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

 

Would you be concerned about these side effects long term ?

If I couldn't poop for a long time, I think that would eventually be a problem.

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Once again, no one accused him of an overdose.  That is just something you are making up.

Secondly, yea, gatekeeping.  To suggest that folks can only relate to things they have personally experienced is ridiculous. 

You mentioned this "We don't know how much and how often he was taking the medication.  Is it OK with you if he was exceeding the proper dosage?" 

What else could you have been implying?

Can you relate to someone that is Bipolar for their irrational behavior? I can sympathize but can't relate! I can sympathize with someone being in a wheel chair but can't relate. ETC ETC ETC.

Dealing with this as a child, my parents were told that I was not interested in school, a screw off, didn't want to pay attention, or incorrigible. Not one thing about that was/is true!

As I quoted before, there was/is no cure for the condition. Applying for medical exemption every year is another stupid thing done by the front offfice of MLB.

I also quoted why the doctor would want to change from a short term medication that requires taking doses 1-3 times per day.

Quote

Take this medication by mouth with or without food as directed by your doctor, usually 1 to 3 times a day. The first dose is usually taken when you wake up in the morning. If more doses are prescribed, take them as directed by your doctor, usually 4-6 hours apart.

To an extended release that requires 1 dose per day in the morning

Oh and look.....

Quote

It’s important to work with your doctor to find the dose that’s right for you. The recommended starting dose for Vyvanse is 30 mg once daily in the morning. Your doctor may, if needed, periodically increase or decrease it to help control Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD) symptoms and manage side effects. The doctor may sometimes stop treatment to see if Vyvanse is still right for you.

So basically, they change doses an frequency periodically to determine if the drug is still working.

 

 

 

 

[Can_of_corn]

If by overdose you mean any dose over what is prescribed then you are correct, I was implying that.  If by overdose you mean the actual definition of overdose:

Quote

an excessive and dangerous dose of a drug.

You are incorrect.

I assumed you meant the latter. 

I was imply that he may have been trying to get a competitive advantage, not commit self harm.

[DrungoHazewood]

10 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Applying for medical exemption every year is another stupid thing done by the front offfice of MLB.

15-20 years ago MLB went through a very public shaming because they didn't pay attention to the impacts of performance enhancing drugs on their players and the game. They put a system in place, after a lot of fits and starts, that was negotiated as part of the CBA and the players agreed to.  Whether or not having to reapply for a therapeutic exemption is reasonable, or if it is stupid, those are the rules.  Davis and/or his agent knew about the rules, or most certainly should have known about them.

I don't like the speed limit, but I know that the law says I have to obey, and if I choose not to I may get caught and be fined.  Pete Rose knew there was a ban on gambling, he violated that rule, and was suspended indefinitely.  This is how a reasonably civil society works.  There are rules that the governed have some kind of small input into, and then you have to play by those rules.  If Scott Boras thinks that his client has been singled out or improperly punished I'm sure he will not hesitate for a minute in stating that loudly, repeatedly and on the record.  That he hasn't indicates to me that he and most everyone else knows Davis or his representative should have applied for the exemption, didn't, and that's their fault.

[interloper]

I was thinking the other night Mullins is maybe the only guy I would have considered Davis pinch hitting for. Mullins has looked incredibly overmatched by... well, everything, really - and not that Davis hasn't, but he actually has put the ball in play this year. That said, it's the only time I'd consider having him bat. I would probably still have Davis sub in for Nunez defensively late in a game, but even that is close. 

Just speaking in a vacuum, Hyde is certainly running out of legitimate ways to get Davis into a game. I feel for Hyde because you don't want to disrespect one of the only veterans on your club by completely gluing him to the bench, assuming he's working hard otherwise. But even Ben McDonald had some light criticisms for him in that PH AB, saying that he needs to "get the swing started" after he kind of breezily swung through a fastball super late.

 

[GuidoSarducci]

18 hours ago, SteveA said:

I usually TRY to see if I can come up with the rationale for a managerial decision before I condemn it out of hand.   So here is what I am coming up with:

If we assume Iglesias couldn't play because of the quad (which is a dubious assumption because he had played the two days before and DHed once when he couldn't play the field)...

Then our options were Mullins, Holaday, and Davis.

Down 1 with one out in the 9th, out chances of stringing together multiple hits to score were getting low.   It would take 3 singles, or a walk and 2 singles, or a single and an extrabase hit, and we only had one out left to play with.

So maybe Hyde concluded our best chance to tie the game was to hit a HR.

Based on seeing Davis throughout June camp, in BP and intrasquad and exhibition games, plus BP during the season, maybe Hyde honestly thought that Davis had the best chance of the three guys of putting a bat on a ball and hitting it out of the park,

There, that's the best I can come up with.

Also remember, Chris Davis drew a walk to leadoff in the 9th against the Phillies last week when the O's were down by 1, and he did (eventually) cross home plate to tie up the game.   So there's that.   

Hyde might have been thinking that Davis somehow walks, then Alberto and Santander have two chances between them to try to tie up the game (if Alberto doesn't ground into double play)

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I have no first hand knowledge of Davis' condition or his medical requirements.  All I know is that he apparently needs a medicine to function, that medicine is on a banned list by MLB and requires an exemption, and he didn't follow the process to get that. That's his fault, unless someone can come up with a set of unusual and heretofore undocumented externalities that made it impossible for him to do that.

How about this?

 

Quote

According to sources familiar with the situation, Davis was previously diagnosed with ADHD and had an exemption to use Adderall when he played with the Texas Rangers.

Players must re-apply for the exemption annually — it's believed Davis did so in 2012 with the Orioles — but Davis' request was rejected. It's unclear why.

I've already posted a link that shows that there is no cure for ADHD!

Why would they reject the request for a condition that the player had that is permanent?

 

Quote

With pressure mounting, Orioles slugger Chris Davis was apparently having so much difficulty combating his ADD/ADHD issue to the point where it was hard for him to concentrate, and hard to even pick up the baseball as it zoomed toward him. Davis is said to have told friends that’s what led him to make the mistake that’s cost him 25 games, and cost his team, too.

Davis knew he no longer had a waiver from MLB to take the stimulant Adderall.

or

 

Quote

Davis may have felt desperate. Davis told friends it got to the point that he “couldn’t see the baseball,” that it was “a blur” and that he was starting to feel “naked” at the plate as the pressure mounted in a year with a lot going on.

Can you relate to this CORN??? @Can_of_corn

 

Quote

While Davis had the TUE as a Ranger, as was originally prescribed by his hometown doctor, MLB’s JDA panel ruled after interviewing him sometime prior to the ’13 that he would no longer have baseball’s approval for the drug he’d long taken.

WHY THERE IS NO CURE AND HE HAD A MEDICAL DIAGNOSIS????

 

Quote

Standard treatments for ADHD in adults typically involve medication, education, skills training and psychological counseling. A combination of these is often the most effective treatment. These treatments can help manage many symptoms of ADHD , but they don't cure it.Jun 22, 2019

Adult attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD ...

www.mayoclinic.org › adult-adhd › drc-20350883

 

 

Was it a way for MLB to get back at the Angelos for the ongoing feud with MLB??? Thats as rationale as any other reason that I could find!

 

Quote

DA rulings aren’t available, but MLB may have had some general concern about the large number of players taking Adderall (it has been just over 100 in recent years, representing a much greater percentage of players using Adderall than the general population), causing them to take a close look at cases. There’s no reason sluggers would be examined any more closely, but MLB certainly wants no doubts surrounding the few players who can get close to records or league leadership. Unfortunately, it isn’t easy to tell at first meeting who needs the drug, and who doesn’t. Maybe this case could re-raise a debate.

Valid point here ..... Davis was diagnosed by his doctor and had been using the drug for a long time.

Quote

Players can re-apply each year for a TUE but Davis apparently decided he was unlikely to get a different result this year from the JDA, so he passed on applying

more

Quote

ADD/ADHD is known to rear its head when pressure strikes, and Davis was said to be feeling it from all sides. Too many failures at the plate early didn’t help, either. And while he has 26 home runs and seemed on his way to a possible third straight 30-homer season, he was batting .197, the lowest mark among qualifiers in the majors. As the outs added up, he was feeling alone at the plate, straining to see the blur.

Obviously if you cant clearly see an object you cant hit it ... Especially one that travels 90+ MPH

 

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/why-did-davis-do-it-thanks-to-condition-ball-began-to-look-like-blur/

[Roll Tide]

15 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

15-20 years ago MLB went through a very public shaming because they didn't pay attention to the impacts of performance enhancing drugs on their players and the game. They put a system in place, after a lot of fits and starts, that was negotiated as part of the CBA and the players agreed to.  Whether or not having to reapply for a therapeutic exemption is reasonable, or if it is stupid, those are the rules.  Davis and/or his agent knew about the rules, or most certainly should have known about them.

I don't like the speed limit, but I know that the law says I have to obey, and if I choose not to I may get caught and be fined.  Pete Rose knew there was a ban on gambling, he violated that rule, and was suspended indefinitely.  This is how a reasonably civil society works.  There are rules that the governed have some kind of small input into, and then you have to play by those rules.  If Scott Boras thinks that his client has been singled out or improperly punished I'm sure he will not hesitate for a minute in stating that loudly, repeatedly and on the record.  That he hasn't indicates to me that he and most everyone else knows Davis or his representative should have applied for the exemption, didn't, and that's their fault.

Someone perhaps you earlier mentioned player safety .... Perhaps CORN?

Is it safe to stand in the batters box for Davis of all he can see of the ball is a blur?

 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I've already posted a link that shows that there is no cure for ADHD!

Why would they reject the request for a condition that the player had that is permanent?

 

Can you relate to this CORN??? @Can_of_corn

 

 

Because they didn't ask for one?  Because the last time they gave him one he didn't follow the guidelines? 

I'm betting I could find a MD that would diagnose me with ADHD for a  couple thousand dollars.  (Not saying Davis did this but MLB needs to have a more stringent review process then a prescription).

Can I relate to this?  Sure I can. You put me up at the plate against a 95 MPH fastball I'd feel the same way, especially if I wasn't wearing my glasses.

[DrungoHazewood]

7 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Someone perhaps you earlier mentioned player safety .... Perhaps CORN?

Is it safe to stand in the batters box for Davis of all he can see of the ball is a blur?

 

I don't have any idea what that has to do with him failing to apply for a therapeutic exemption.  Is your point here really that if you don't apply you should be allowed to at any moment? I don't really care either way, but I don't see what good it does to argue that the rules shouldn't apply to Chris Davis.

[DrungoHazewood]

17 minutes ago, GuidoSarducci said:

Also remember, Chris Davis drew a walk to leadoff in the 9th against the Phillies last week when the O's were down by 1, and he did (eventually) cross home plate to tie up the game.   So there's that.  

Daniel Cabrera hit .009 in his professional career.  1-for-106.  Based on his time with the O's in interleague he'd often just stand there and take three called strikes.  Struck out in 97 of his 126 PAs.

He walked nine times as a pro.  That's kind of how I see a Chris Davis walk.  Sometimes the pitcher just won't hit his spots four times in seven pitches, even if the batter is not trying.

[Can_of_corn]

15 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Because they didn't ask for one?  Because the last time they gave him one he didn't follow the guidelines? 

I'm betting I could find a MD that would diagnose me with ADHD for a  couple thousand dollars.  (Not saying Davis did this but MLB needs to have a more stringent review process then a prescription).

Can I relate to this?  Sure I can. You put me up at the plate against a 95 MPH fastball I'd feel the same way, especially if I wasn't wearing my glasses.

You know what I can't relate to?  Getting caught cheating, knowing you were going to be subjected to additional testing and cheating again.  And in so doing letting down your teammates in their best chance for a pennant in a generation.

I can't relate to that at all.  I  can relate to cheating once, but twice? 

[Roll Tide]

4 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I don't have any idea what that has to do with him failing to apply for a therapeutic exemption.  Is your point here really that if you don't apply you should be allowed to at any moment? I don't really care either way, but I don't see what good it does to argue that the rules shouldn't apply to Chris Davis.

He applied and received an exemption due to a diagnosis of ADHD by his regular medical doctor in Texas. I am not going to look for the article again quote it.

So as @Can_of_corn suggested he did not go to a random doctor with a few thousand dollars.

For whatever reason they turned him down....No one provides that answer in any of the articles that I could find.

 

 

This is my point! Received an exemption due to a diagnosed medical condition that is not curable! Why would he need to apply again?

Another dumb MLB policy!

 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Roll Tide said:

He applied and received an exemption due to a diagnosis of ADHD by his regular medical doctor in Texas. I am not going to look for the article again quote it.

So as @Can_of_corn suggested he did not go to a random doctor with a few thousand dollars.

For whatever reason they turned him down....No one provides that answer in any of the articles that I could find.

 

 

This is my point! Received an exemption due to a diagnosed medical condition that is not curable! Why would he need to apply again?

Another dumb MLB policy!

 

I'd say the fact that they changed his medication shows the process is warranted.

Didn't you admit that dosages can very widely over time?  Shouldn't MLB stay on top of that?  Doesn't Davis have people that can do this for him so it isn't a personal burden?

I did not suggest that Davis specifically went to a random doctor, you know this and are being disingenuous. 

 

[Roll Tide]

18 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Because they didn't ask for one? 1)  Because the last time they gave him one he didn't follow the guidelines? 

2) I'm betting I could find a MD that would diagnose me with ADHD for a  couple thousand dollars.  (Not saying Davis did this but MLB needs to have a more stringent review process then a prescription).

Can I relate to this?  Sure I can. You put me up at the plate against a 95 MPH fastball I'd feel the same way, especially if I wasn't wearing my glasses.

1) What guideline didnt he follow?

2) So you either are thinking he is faking his condition or you aren't? Which is it?

3) How so? I wouldn't get in the box with a guy throwing 90+ because I cant hit it. And I am more likely to be drilled by the ball than hit it.