The Catching Situation

[HowAboutThat]

54 minutes ago, Legend_Of_Joey said:

Considering neither is doing either one well at all and defense can help a pitcher...

Hahaha I just said that...

[BohKnowsBmore]

48 minutes ago, Philip said:

In fairness to Joey, having good defense and no offense is better than being terrible at both.

Not sure how many times this has to be said, but they’re both plus bats relative to the catcher position. 
 

unless you’re fixating on a minuscule ST sample size. 

[HowAboutThat]

35 minutes ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

Not sure how many times this has to be said, but they’re both plus bats relative to the catcher position. 
 

unless you’re fixating on a minuscule ST sample size. 

I went to baseball savant and looked up Sisco and Severino. There weren’t many stats on Sisco, for some reason, but of the eleven offensive stats listed, Severino was exactly league average in one, above in two others, and dreadful in all the others. He’s not good on offense.

The stats I saw on Sisco included a 6th percentile sprint speed, and a 19 percentile framing( which is actually better than Severino’s14 percentile framing) One of his comps is Robinson Chirinos, who hits like I do, but is a competent defender.

[Frobby]

4 hours ago, Philip said:

I went to baseball savant and looked up Sisco and Severino. There weren’t many stats on Sisco, for some reason, but of the eleven offensive stats listed, Severino was exactly league average in one, above in two others, and dreadful in all the others. He’s not good on offense.

The stats I saw on Sisco included a 6th percentile sprint speed, and a 19 percentile framing( which is actually better than Severino’s14 percentile framing) One of his comps is Robinson Chirinos, who hits like I do, but is a competent defender.

I’m looking at wOBA, Fangraphs’ best measure of offense along with wRC+.    In 2019, the average wOBA for a catcher was .303.   Of 68 catchers with at least 100 PA, Severino was 25th at .316, Sisco 23rd at .319.    In 2020, the average was .305.   Of 58 catchers with at least 50 PA (shorter season so I used a lower threshold), Severino was 24th at .312, Sisco was 18th at .335.

So, I think it’s fair to say they’ve been above average offensively for a catcher, especially Sisco.    Defense is another story entirely.

Neither has hit well this spring, but based on the allocation of playing time, I’d be surprised if either were not on the OD roster.   Severino has 29 PA, Sisco 22, Wynns 12, Ciuffo 7.    

[jabba72]

12 hours ago, Frobby said:

I’m looking at wOBA, Fangraphs’ best measure of offense along with wRC+.    In 2019, the average wOBA for a catcher was .303.   Of 68 catchers with at least 100 PA, Severino was 25th at .316, Sisco 23rd at .319.    In 2020, the average was .305.   Of 58 catchers with at least 50 PA (shorter season so I used a lower threshold), Severino was 24th at .312, Sisco was 18th at .335.

So, I think it’s fair to say they’ve been above average offensively for a catcher, especially Sisco.    Defense is another story entirely.

Neither has hit well this spring, but based on the allocation of playing time, I’d be surprised if either were not on the OD roster.   Severino has 29 PA, Sisco 22, Wynns 12, Ciuffo 7.    

I dont think they're the black hole some make them out to be. Maybe on holding baserunners they are, but you cant have everything. 

[Can_of_corn]

7 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

I dont think they're the black hole some make them out to be. Maybe on holding baserunners they are, but you cant have everything. 

I was, and still am, a supporter of an offensive first catcher, I'm just not sure Sisco's offensive is good enough to make up for the glove.  It worries me that he seems to start every season strong and then his numbers go into a steady decline.

With Severino it's that he's looked downright lazy behind the plate the last couple of seasons.   I don't care if you run out every ground ball but you need to get down and smother pitches in the dirt for your pitcher.

[HowAboutThat]

41 minutes ago, jabba72 said:

I dont think they're the black hole some make them out to be. Maybe on holding baserunners they are, but you cant have everything. 

On the contrary, regarding offense, they are exactly the black hole some make them out to be. Frobby kindly pointed out that in one category, they are above average, but it’s clear that the defense is so bad relative to what is available, that the difference in offense is not enough to warrant keeping them over someone who is more defensively competent. 

[Frobby]

34 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I was, and still am, a supporter of an offensive first catcher, I'm just not sure Sisco's offensive is good enough to make up for the glove.  It worries me that he seems to start every season strong and then his numbers go into a steady decline.

With Severino it's that he's looked downright lazy behind the plate the last couple of seasons.   I don't care if you run out every ground ball but you need to get down and smother pitches in the dirt for your pitcher.

I share your concerns.    I’m still kinda hoping Sisco finds another gear offensively.   He’s got a great eye but misses a lot of hittable pitches.   If he could improve that just a little you’d have a pretty nice offense-first catcher.   

Of course, I don’t expect him to be playing catcher much for us in a year.    
 

[Tony-OH]

I'm fairly certain Elias will be watching the waiver wire for catchers, but if none are available, they're going to go with Severino and Sisco. 

[eddie83]

Sevy was impressive today..... rifled a throw into right center on a wild pitch that looked like a line drive to Hays. It was not even remotely close to the base. 
 

Then a high fastball popped out of his mitt - passed ball- to allow a run to score. Hyde can’t be happy. 

[BRobinsonfan]

32 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Sevy was impressive today..... rifled a throw into right center on a wild pitch that looked like a line drive to Hays. It was not even remotely close to the base. 
 

Then a high fastball popped out of his mitt - passed ball- to allow a run to score. Hyde can’t be happy. 

He's working on some new ways of catching and throwing the ball... that's what spring training is for.  

 

 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, BRobinsonfan said:

He's working on some new ways of catching and throwing the ball... that's what spring training is for.  

 

 

He was just showing off his arm strength to make Chance look bad.

[Legend_Of_Joey]

48 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Sevy was impressive today..... rifled a throw into right center on a wild pitch that looked like a line drive to Hays. It was not even remotely close to the base. 
 

Then a high fastball popped out of his mitt - passed ball- to allow a run to score. Hyde can’t be happy. 

 

14 minutes ago, BRobinsonfan said:

He's working on some new ways of catching and throwing the ball... that's what spring training is for.  

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He was just showing off his arm strength to make Chance look bad.

Maybe he was just practicing for when Manfred moves 2nd base to the warning track.

[HowAboutThat]

If Sevi is the best we have, then good help us. And if his offense is good enough to make up for his defense, well, I’m not seeing it.

Flahrt was our emergency catcher. I wouldn’t mind seeing if he can still put on the gear.

Seriously, do Sisco/Severino REALLY hit well enough to make up for that defense?

[SteveA]

11 minutes ago, Philip said:

If Sevi is the best we have, then good help us. And if his offense is good enough to make up for his defense, well, I’m not seeing it.

Flahrt was our emergency catcher. I wouldn’t mind seeing if he can still put on the gear.

Seriously, do Sisco/Severino REALLY hit well enough to make up for that defense?

Ryan Flaherty is an advance scout and developmental coach for the San Diego Padres now.

And he's married to Nick Markakis' wife's sister.

The things you can learn on Wikipedia.   Some of them are even true.