The second guessing Hyde thread.

[Hank Scorpio]

I have to keep reminding myself that a .500 record is gravy. 

[Moshagge3]

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If only Hyde had not gotten Lyles sick!

Hyde isn't responsible for Lyles getting sick, but he was well aware that Lyles was sick when he decided to save his three best relievers for Game 2.

[Sports Guy]

5 minutes ago, Moshagge3 said:

The plan for Hall is just all over the map. Call him up to start a fairly big game. Demote him immediately and announce he's going to be a reliever, just for this month, so he can leverage his few remaining innings to help the big club. Pitch him on Saturday just for ten pitches in a blowout. Bring him back on one day's rest for a critical inning with nobody warming behind him.

And don't forget the 1 inning start coming out of the break.  That was the start of his downfall.  I don't know if that threw off his routine and he got out of sync after that or not but that is when it started to go downhill.

I don't mind the plan of putting him in the pen.  His IP were limited and they wanted to get value out of him.

That thought was fine.  The problem is, he started to suck and it became pretty apparent he wasn't ready this year.

They have forced this.  We have seen diminished stuff and he's not even that electric in short stints.  They should just shut him down to make sure he doesn't try to do something and end up hurting himself.

He isn't going to help the big league club in all likelihood, although its possible he gives us a few good outings.  But that possibility isn't worth playing him right now.  You can't rely on him.

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, Moshagge3 said:

Hyde isn't responsible for Lyles getting sick, but he was well aware that Lyles was sick when he decided to save his three best relievers for Game 2.

I don't think he should have had Hall in the game.  I don't really think its fair to question anything else.  Maybe you don't bring in Vespi earlier in this game too but thats defensible.

[Moshagge3]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don't think he should have had Hall in the game.  I don't really think its fair to question anything else.  Maybe you don't bring in Vespi earlier in this game too but thats defensible.

If you're not bringing in Hall, then you're bringing in one of the top-tier relievers (assuming Akin was Plan B for Game 2 all along) so we don't really disagree.

[Moose Milligan]

Count me in as putting in Hall as a bad idea. At this point I think he should only be in games in a big deficit or with a huge lead. Bringing him in a playoff implication game with a high leverage situation isn’t optimal. 
 

But let’s not forget that this is what we wanted. We all clamored for Rutschman to be up earlier than he was. Then Stowers. No one asked for Vavra but we all got excited when he arrived. Pitches hissy fits for Hall and Henderson. 
 

So while I do agree that using Hall there wasn’t great, it would be ignorant to think a guy like that wouldn’t ever have to come in a close and tight game when we’re in a playoff chase. 

It just sucks that he looks so completely lost. But Hyde didn’t put him in a place to succeed. 
 

I hate to say it because this team has been resilient all year but these next two days are most likely the season from a playoffs perspective. 
 

Was hoping for a split today, didn’t expect to see a letdown like this. This has been terrible. 
 

But Hyde seems to get his team to come back after bad and ugly losses. We’ll see. 

[RZNJ]

Hall was lights out the other day.  Hyde put him in a game we were losing. Makes sense unless you never want to put him into true high leverage game that we’re winning by 1-3 runs.

[Aristotelian]

Hyde had a terrible day in hindsight. Pretty much all the buttons he pushed backfired or didn't work out. I will say Hall pitched fine his last time out, and no one in the game thread said Hall was a bad idea until the meltdown was well underway. As it turned out we didn't score anyway. Probably the biggest issue was Henderson at 2B but again I see the thinking behind it. 

[Sports Guy]

11 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Count me in as putting in Hall as a bad idea. At this point I think he should only be in games in a big deficit or with a huge lead. Bringing him in a playoff implication game with a high leverage situation isn’t optimal. 
 

But let’s not forget that this is what we wanted. We all clamored for Rutschman to be up earlier than he was. Then Stowers. No one asked for Vavra but we all got excited when he arrived. Pitches hissy fits for Hall and Henderson. 
 

So while I do agree that using Hall there wasn’t great, it would be ignorant to think a guy like that wouldn’t ever have to come in a close and tight game when we’re in a playoff chase. 

It just sucks that he looks so completely lost. But Hyde didn’t put him in a place to succeed. 
 

I hate to say it because this team has been resilient all year but these next two days are most likely the season from a playoffs perspective. 
 

Was hoping for a split today, didn’t expect to see a letdown like this. This has been terrible. 
 

But Hyde seems to get his team to come back after bad and ugly losses. We’ll see. 

I wanted Hall up 2 months ago, when he was pitching well.

He hasn't pitched well for 6 weeks.  He shouldn't be here. 

[ShoelesJoe]

In hindsight really wish Hyde had gone nuclear on the ump over the Mountcastle strike three call in game one. It was clearly a blown call on a day where the team was sleepwalking. Seeing their manager’s head explode might have been the wake up call they needed.

On a related subject — this is twice in the last month where the Orioles had huge, season defining games against AL East opponents and both times they just crapped the bed. If Hyde can’t get his guys fired up in a playoff race then maybe he isn’t the one to lead the team going forward. 

[SteveA]

4 minutes ago, ShoelesJoe said:

In hindsight really wish Hyde had gone nuclear on the ump over the Mountcastle strike three call in game one. It was clearly a blown call on a day where the team was sleepwalking. Seeing their manager’s head explode might have been the wake up call they needed.

On a related subject — this is twice in the last month where the Orioles had huge, season defining games against AL East opponents and both times they just crapped the bed. If Hyde can’t get his guys fired up in a playoff race then maybe he isn’t the one to lead the team going forward. 

You really think today's losses have a lot to do with "not being fired up" ?

I think mainly we were beaten by a better team.   A starter we were relying on vomited himself out of a start, and Toronto had better hitters and better pitchers than us today.   We made some key mistakes in game 1, but I don't think they had anything to do with how "fired up" we were.

[vab]

Hall is just not that good. He can be but it’s just too inconsistent at this point. He’ll probably find a role and become useful player at some point but that’s probably 2 or 3 stops down the road. They need to trade him while they still can. They’re not all going to work out, folks. 

[eddie83]

Hyde was asked postgame about Vespi instead of pushing Akin. Brought up his pitch count from 2 days ago. 
 

Timing is everything. Voth didn’t go deep  2 days ago and Lyles gets sick.  

[SteveA]

2 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Hyde was asked postgame about Vespi instead of pushing Akin. Brought up his pitch count from 2 days ago. 
 

Timing is everything. Voth didn’t go deep  2 days ago and Lyles gets sick.  

What about Vespit's pitch count Saturday + Sunday (41)?

[bpilktree]

1 hour ago, Moshagge3 said:

Hyde isn't responsible for Lyles getting sick, but he was well aware that Lyles was sick when he decided to save his three best relievers for Game 2.

Which is probably why he didn’t use Akin in the 9th and had to go to Hall.