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Jorge Lopez keeps improving

wildcard

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Moose Milligan Hangout Grand Counsel

Moose Milligan

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1 hour ago, Ruzious said:

I'm sure the O's are well aware of his complete collapses after 4 innings, but... so far they have chosen not to do anything about it:  Here are his OPS's given up by inning:

1st:: .517

2nd:  .620

3rd:  .632

4th:  .691

5th:  1.396

6th:  1.133 

  

 

That's good research, thanks for that.

They've got to be aware, but I'm sure they also think that they can tease out better performances from him in the 5th and 6th innings.  I wouldn't be surprised if that's what they're aiming for...if that's the case, whatever they're doing certainly hasn't worked.

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wildcard
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Lopez made 6 starts in May and had a 3.68 ERA in 29.1 IP   His last 2 starts have been 6 IP.   Two other starts were 5 innings or more.   His WHIP in May was still quite high at 1.43 so he still has w

owknows
owknows

To nobody in particular. Wildcard is a bit of an optimist. I think most people understand that. But there is a subset of the forum that has turned Wildcard's optimism into somewhat of a meme

Just Regular
Just Regular

Is that measured 1st percentile like his spin rate is exactly MLB average (i.e., 50th percentile of all fastballs)? If it is just "lowest spin", that might be a feature, not a bug.   As I underst

Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

Posted
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1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

That's good research, thanks for that.

They've got to be aware, but I'm sure they also think that they can tease out better performances from him in the 5th and 6th innings.  I wouldn't be surprised if that's what they're aiming for...if that's the case, whatever they're doing certainly hasn't worked.

I'm not sure why they seem to think he can do it when basically no one else in baseball can.  There are reasons guys don't throw complete games anymore.  You can't just keep throwing guys out there past the point of them being effective and hope that suddenly they can be effective deeper into games.  I mean I guess you can do it but you end up with a 1396 OPS allowed.

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'm not sure why they seem to think he can do it when basically no one else in baseball can.  There are reasons guys don't throw complete games anymore.  You can't just keep throwing guys out there past the point of them being effective and hope that suddenly they can be effective deeper into games.  I mean I guess you can do it but you end up with a 1396 OPS allowed.

It is very difficult to routinely yank a starting pitcher after four innings without stressing the bullpen.   I was one of the first people to question leaving him in for the fifth inning, but I’ve come around to thinking they need to steer a middle course:  if he’s pitching well, and the O’s have a decent lead, leave him out there as long as you can.   If he’s pitching well and the game is close, leave him out there but yank him the minute there are signs of trouble.  

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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1 minute ago, Frobby said:

It is very difficult to routinely yank a starting pitcher after four innings without stressing the bullpen.   I was one of the first people to question leaving him in for the fifth inning, but I’ve come around to thinking they need to steer a middle course:  if he’s pitching well, and the O’s have a decent lead, leave him out there as long as you can.   If he’s pitching well and the game is close, leave him out there but yank him the minute there are signs of trouble.  

If you know that is the strategy going in and you plan for it why would it cause added stress?

I think it is less stressful to pull him after four than it is to get a guy up and throwing to come in with runners on after four and a third.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

It is very difficult to routinely yank a starting pitcher after four innings without stressing the bullpen.   I was one of the first people to question leaving him in for the fifth inning, but I’ve come around to thinking they need to steer a middle course:  if he’s pitching well, and the O’s have a decent lead, leave him out there as long as you can.   If he’s pitching well and the game is close, leave him out there but yank him the minute there are signs of trouble.  

I don’t think using him as an opener is a bad thing and I don’t think it taxes your pen IF you are able to get good innings out of the other starters AND you build your pen correctly.

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wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

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In April Lopez was terrible in the 5th.   He has improved in that area in May. In 6 May starts he completed 5 innings in 4 of them.   He went 6 innings in his last two starts.    That is improvement.  Though its too early to know if it will continue.

I agree that BB/9 and the WHIP numbers don't support that has  improved those areas.  Frobby points out that he is not allowing as many homers in May.   

I think the improvement that I am seeing is that it was really hard to watch in the 5th in May.   But now he is going deeper in games.   He is still capable of blowing up early like he did against the Yankees on May 15 but that is not the trend overall.

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LTO's Major Leaguer

LTO's

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19 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

the WHIP is an important rate stat.

WHIP is not a very important stat in terms of projectability. I doubt the O's FO is even glancing at it. Like BA for a hitter, it's dependent on a lot of variables outside of the player's control. Bloop basehits, groundballs against the shift, shoddy defense etc. can contribute to a high WHIP. The walk rate which you have mentioned is extremely important and should not be overlooked. I tend to agree more with you and SG in terms of how to view Lopez but he did show modest improvements in May and he did it against good offenses with a subpar team behind him. Especially behind the plate. In a perfect world, he's a bullpen guy but the O's don't have anyone to take his place. If anybody should lose their spot it's Harvey. 

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Moose Milligan Hangout Grand Counsel

Moose Milligan

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2 hours ago, LTO's said:

WHIP is not a very important stat in terms of projectability. I doubt the O's FO is even glancing at it. Like BA for a hitter, it's dependent on a lot of variables outside of the player's control. Bloop basehits, groundballs against the shift, shoddy defense etc. can contribute to a high WHIP. The walk rate which you have mentioned is extremely important and should not be overlooked. I tend to agree more with you and SG in terms of how to view Lopez but he did show modest improvements in May and he did it against good offenses with a subpar team behind him. Especially behind the plate. In a perfect world, he's a bullpen guy but the O's don't have anyone to take his place. If anybody should lose their spot it's Harvey. 

I see where you're coming from in regards to WHIP not being important in regards to projectability but it does account for walks.  Which as you mentioned that I mentioned is important and shouldn't be overlooked.  

You're correct that bloop hits, etc, can drive a WHIP up, I agree with you there.

I agree that he's a bullpen guy in a perfect world...or if they had a guy that could handle the 3rd and 4th times through the lineup, Lopez could be a good opener.

 

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