Dilon Tate Is Bringing The Heat!

[Redskins Rick]

22 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

I don't even know what you're arguing for or against there - seems like you're doing it for the sake of arguing - though Paige would make an outstanding swing coach.  

and I thought that was CoC's role here. LOL

 

[spiritof66]

39 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

I don't even know what you're arguing for or against there - seems like you're doing it for the sake of arguing - though Paige would make an outstanding swing coach.  

The Orioles could use a don't-swing coach. Any of those around?

[Sports Guy]

47 minutes ago, Philip said:

No, my contention is based on other awful trades Dan made. I am not postulating on nothing, and anyone who can read and write should know that.

It is also based on human nature: given two guys with equal track records, it is not just logical but expected that you’re going to have more interest in the one with the better pedigree.

Also, given two guys, one with a shiny draft slot and the other with slightly better performance than the other, or who is slightly younger, it is logical that the draft Pedegree would influence the decision, especially if you’re in a hurry,And your organization doesn’t involve any meaningful advanced analysts.

So it should be clear to almost anyone(don’t you love being exceptional?) that my contention is entirely plausible.

Plausible yes?  You treating it like a fact?  No.

And DD had a mixed record on trades. Certainly felt some of them weren’t great great but I blame PA and Buck for more of that than Duq.  Buck was the real GM and he was pretty bad.

[Philip]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

Plausible yes?  You treating it like a fact?  No.

And DD had a mixed record on trades. Certainly felt some of them weren’t great great but I blame PA and Buck for more of that than Duq.  Buck was the real GM and he was pretty bad.

Are you still here? 
 

[Sports Guy]

31 minutes ago, Philip said:

Sure I understand that, though SG does not.

When we are on the outside looking in, we have to make assumptions based on the available evidence, however sparse, and there is some available evidence to wit, human nature, as I said, Lack of any meaningful Statisticians on staff at the time, a time crunch, and the chance to present a first round draft pick to the public instead of a less glamorous choice, even if that less glamorous choice might have better performance.

Any reasonable third-party would accept that I am basing my contention on something concrete.

You have no evidence!!!!  Your point is he only took Tate because he was a top 5 pick.  You have zero to back that up.  

[Frobby]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Plausible yes?  You treating it like a fact?  No.

And DD had a mixed record on trades. Certainly felt some of them weren’t great great but I blame PA and Buck for more of that than Duq.  Buck was the real GM and he was pretty bad.

That is also speculation.   I don’t like making excuses for Dan.   

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, Philip said:

Are you still here? 
 

Yes, I’m here to pick apart your awful assertions.

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, Frobby said:

That is also speculation.   I don’t like making excuses for Dan.   

Yes it is speculation based off factual evidence that supports it, namely that we know Buck had PAs ear and was more respected than Dan was (by ownership)

 

[Philip]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

You have no evidence!!!!  Your point is he only took Tate because he was a top 5 pick.  You have zero to back that up.  

Look, dear friend, I have shared my reasons, and I did not present those reasons as anything except the only thing we have on which to judge. My contention, for the umpteenth time, is entirely defensible, and also for the umpteenth time I am not presenting it as fact.

And as others have pointed out, it is entirely fruitless to be contending on this point, right or wrong, we will never know and right or wrong Dan is gone, so go ahead and grind your teeth shake your fist at the heavens and tell your wife that I am Spreading a false gospel, I don’t care, and probably neither does anybody else.

 

[Three Run Homer]

16 minutes ago, spiritof66 said:

The Orioles could use a don't-swing coach. Any of those around?

DJ Stewart may be looking for a job soon.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Yes it is speculation based off factual evidence that supports it, namely that we know Buck had PAs ear and was more respected than Dan was (by ownership)

 

Shrug.   I think Dan had plenty of cred with ownership in 2012-14.   I’m sure he lost some when he tried to bolt for Toronto.    But to me I’ve never had the sense that it impacted trades much.  I put the Feldman, Norris and Parra trades squarely on Dan’s shoulders, as well as the 2018 deadline deals.    Also the Miller trade, which most people (including you) liked but I didn’t.   

I think Buck (or Brady) was more involved in some of the decisions about free agents, including our own players that we re-signed.   
 

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Shrug.   I think Dan had plenty of cred with ownership in 2012-14.   I’m sure he lost some when he tried to bolt for Toronto.    But to me I’ve never had the sense that it impacted trades much.  I put the Feldman, Norris and Parra trades squarely on Dan’s shoulders, as well as the 2018 deadline deals.    Also the Miller trade, which most people (including you) liked but I didn’t.   

I think Buck (or Brady) was more involved in some of the decisions about free agents, including our own players that we re-signed.   
 

Well, those were good trades, so that would be good for him.

And yes, the Miller trade was good and one you always make in that situation.

I think trades were done by him...I think moves made were ones he wouldn't have done if he had full authority.  Not all of them but some of them.  Buck was an aging manager who kept failing to win a title and he saw that team as a chance to win one.  He held onto that thought and hope for way too long but PA loved him and did what he wanted.

[Hallas]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Yes it is speculation based off factual evidence that supports it, namely that we know Buck had PAs ear and was more respected than Dan was (by ownership)

 

It's a big jump to go from "Buck was more respected than Dan," to "Buck had the power to effect/veto trades."  Hardly what I'd call a smoking gun.

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, Hallas said:

It's a big jump to go from "Buck was more respected than Dan," to "Buck had the power to effect/veto trades."  Hardly what I'd call a smoking gun.

Think its pretty clear he was involved in trade thoughts/discussions.  I  am not saying he was on the man on the phone with the other GMs but I do think he would talk to PA and tell him what he needed an why he did.  

I am of the opinion that Buck was one of the first and maybe only people (outside of Flanny and Brady) in positions of power with the team that PA actually respected. 

[LocoChris]

Trading was not Dan's strong suit. That said I was happy with the Miller trade. Miller was a shut down reliever, and we were in "win now" mode.