Here lies the problem....

[SrMeowMeow]

BB mentioned risk taking.

Sheets should be our target now.

If Sheets had been healthy the last several years, he would be getting more than Burnett got.

Instead, he will be lucky to get 3 guaranteed years at this point.

That is a deal we should jump all over...3/36-40...with a 4th year option.

He will be hard pressed to beat that offer IMO.

Whether you get rid of BRob, et al or not doesn't matter...Sheets is a guy that can head your rotation for the next 3-4 years and you can acquire him at a very reasonable cost in comparison to his ability.

I'm torn on Sheets and whether there's a reasonable chance of him still being a rotation candidate, let alone an ace, in years three and four. But I'd be really happy to see him signed just because we're so desperate.

Here's my dream (meaning cheapest) rotation for 2009:

Guthrie

Homer Bailey

D-Cab

Rich Hill

Matt Albers

I posted in another thread that hitting on a Kyle Lohse on a one-year deal won't help us at all - they'll walk for big bucks in FA if they succeed and if they bust, who cares. I think our targets should be high upside pitchers like Bailey, Hill and even D-Cab, with multiple years remaining under team control, who can best use the wide-open rotation we have to take a pressure-free year to get ML experience. If even one of those three put it together, we'd have added a long-term piece.

[TJ Wrangler]

First let me say I too probably would not have exceed $20 million per year. So I have no problem with the O's not signing him. I also want to stress that this thread is not intended to be an Andy MacPhail bashing session. That being said I do need to point out again that in this day and age the business model AM has used in the past, the methodical way he deals with tasks, and his general overall lack of moves over tha past 11 months may not be the best to get this team out of the situation where it is.

Let's first take into consideration that AM has never signed a major free agent. His style as we have just witnessed is to sit back and wait. Instead of being aggressive in the pursuit we make a decent offer 2 weeks ago and do nothing to attempt to convince the player to sign here. He had to know the threshold was $20 million and his offer was not going to get the job done. Why do nothing except sit and hope???

I'll be the first to give him credit for the 2 trades he made 11 months ago. At the same time you have to take into consideration he traded two big chips. This was something that no other GMs as far back as Pat Gillick were allowed to do with the exception of Syd Thrifts fire sale which amounted to squat. The current state this team is in we cannot stand on two deals that involved 2 of our star players. More needs to be done and it hasn't.

We hear the need to build from the ground up. That's all in good, but can be accomplished the same time as reloading the major league team via trades, waiver claims, free agent signings, signing of international talent. We're not multi tasking. Another problem with the building from the ground up is by the time the suspects become (or if they become) major league ready your current productive players will be ready to leave.

The current front office thinks small. The fact we're considering Mark Hendrickson for our rotation is a major joke. The contracts we've offered to Looper, Redding and the Japan pitchers are very lowballish. This organization can afford a whole lot more investment in quality players from the $$$ side than the Minnesota teams of MacPhail.

MacPhail is also not a risk taker. In the same division we need to take some risks in hopes of catching lightning in a bottle. Is there anyone who would rather have Hendrickson over a year of Bartolo Colon???

Fianlly I don't think AM sees the entire picture. My question is quite simple... Who is our starting infield for 2010??? No one in the farm that's for sure. Who's in the rotation? Will Arrieta, Tillman and Matsuz become another Liz, Olsen, and Penn??? Hopefully not but what are the plans if they're not?

Again I really not as frustrated about losing Tex as most here are. My concern is THE PLAN and how we're not doing enough to make up for a Tex signing. By the way...don't think the $20 million we put on the line for Tex will be used for other players.

Sorry for the vent....

Well that makes two sources that suggest AM is not the best man for the job. Great post. I really hope this opens some eyes that it could be more of the same.

I think maybe an all out firesale is the best thing at this point.

[Pruke]

How are the draft prospects for 2010? I'm willing to bet we can get a chance at the #1 pick!

[hihop07]

I'm torn on Sheets and whether there's a reasonable chance of him still being a rotation candidate, let alone an ace, in years three and four. But I'd be really happy to see him signed just because we're so desperate.

Here's my dream (meaning cheapest) rotation for 2009:

Guthrie

Homer Bailey

D-Cab

Rich Hill

Matt Albers

I posted in another thread that hitting on a Kyle Lohse on a one-year deal won't help us at all - they'll walk for big bucks in FA if they succeed and if they bust, who cares. I think our targets should be high upside pitchers like Bailey, Hill and even D-Cab, with multiple years remaining under team control, who can best use the wide-open rotation we have to take a pressure-free year to get ML experience. If even one of those three put it together, we'd have added a long-term piece.

AHEM! D-Cab is gone. And how the heck are we getting Bailey and Hill?

[SrMeowMeow]

Well that makes two sources that suggest AM is not the best man for the job. Great post. I really hope this opens some eyes that it could be more of the same.

I think maybe an all out firesale is the best thing at this point.

What do you mean by "sources"? Two people? And who was the other?

[geschinger]

In 1998 the O's were the fourth most valuable franchise in baseball according to Forbes. We were behind the Yanks, Tribe, and Braves. The Red Sox were 9th.

Estimated value was $350,000,000.

The 2008 list has us at 18th, with a value of $388,000,000.

That is a very poor return over 10 years.

During those 10 years we have a had a losing record every year, we have had constant turmoil in the front office, and we have become less attractive to potential free agents who are looking to go to a team that can be competitive.

In sports you build the value of your franchise by building the brand. The O's have done an extremely poor job of brand building, and the fallout is that we have been unable to compete on the field, and over the last few years we have been unable to compete in the free agent market.

The one constant in those ten years, Peter Angelos.

To be fair, they had a brand new cash cow stadium courtesy of the tax payers that inflated their market standing. Since then, most other teams have received their own tax payer funded venues that evened the playing field. The Orioles have dropped further than they should have but there was no way they were going to remain anywhere near the top 5.

[SrMeowMeow]

AHEM! D-Cab is gone. And how the heck are we getting Bailey and Hill?

LOL! Yeah, I know he's gone.

Ideally, we'd trade for them. Although kidnapping is on my list too :clap3:

I don't know if they're available or if I'd pay the asking price if they are. I know I'd've paid D-Cab his arbitration money. I'm just saying these are the players we should target, over one-year reclamation projects and long-term FA deals. Low value, high risk/reward guys who other teams can't afford to let pitch through their problems.

[TJ Wrangler]

What do you mean by "sources"? Two people? And who was the other?

I made a post the other day saying similar things about AM coming from my source, and I know Bigbird and I don't have the same source, because mine is outside of the organization.

[TJ Wrangler]

Ideally, we'd trade for them. Although kidnapping is on my list too :clap3

I'll drive...:laughlol:

[SrMeowMeow]

I made a post the other day saying similar things about AM coming from my source, and I know Bigbird and I don't have the same source, because mine is outside of the organization.

I hate to argue with a kidnapping buddy, but I don't think bigbird was sourcing this...it reads like a straight-up opinion post.

[TJ Wrangler]

I hate to argue with a kidnapping buddy, but I don't think bigbird was sourcing this...it reads like a straight-up opinion post.

His source has always seemed to not like MacPhail, so it wouldn't surprise me if he was basing his opinion a little bit off of what he knows.

[TyCobb]

20+ million a year for Tex is stupid.

He probably had his two best hitting seasons. Will be in the 130-150 OPS+ range for a few more years.

Dunn is projected to have a wRC of 112 next season. Tex is projected to have a wRC of 119.9. Dunn is going to go for a much better contract. Put Dunn at DH.

[MarylandTerp08]

Well that sucks for you.

His reaction to reading your post.

[TJ Wrangler]

20+ million a year for Tex is stupid.

He probably had his two best hitting seasons. Will be in the 130-150 OPS+ range for a few more years.

Dunn is projected to have a wRC of 112 next season. Tex is projected to have a wRC of 119.9. Dunn is going to go for a much better contract. Put Dunn at DH.

In my opinion, we probably won't express the slightest bit of interest in Dunn. If I were Dunn, I wouldn't want to come here anyways. He's not the hometown hero, and he'll have to perform at a level to make everyone forget about the hometown hero. Most fans probably won't look past the .230-.240 average and 150 strikeouts, so he'll become unpopular here. If I were Dunn, I'd pass, and I don't think the Orioles would go after him anyways.

[Col. Claypool]

I don't think you'd get what you think. I think Ripken is a guy who would be all about reestablishing the Oriole Way. I see no reason to think he'd be the type of guy to go hog wild in the FA marketplace.

I would love to find out. Ripken has said before that he has specific ideas on how to run a franchise. I have no idea what he would do, but I would trust him to make the right moves. Angelos won't own this team forever and I hope that Cal has a part in whatever group eventually takes over. For now, though, I hope that they can maximize the return for their tradable pieces.