Giving Dan Duquette his due

[Sports Guy]

44 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Dan made the trades.

Not really 

[Sports Guy]

40 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

For Machado and Britton at their lowest value point

Thanks to PA and Buck

[wildcard]

11 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Not to distract from the thread, but Duquette did not find Chen.   Before Duquette was hired, Buck Showalter spoke at some banquet and identified Chen as a pitcher the O’s were looking at seriously.  So, I’ll give DD credit for signing Chen, but not for finding him.  

I remember MacPhail  folks scouting Chen before Duquette was with the O's.

[LTO's]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Thanks to PA and Buck

Wrong

[DirtyBird]

15 minutes ago, Bahama O's Fan said:

Didn't he have Trumbo already signed as a replacement for Davis?

When we had both Mancini and Christian Walker in the organization

[Sports Guy]

3 minutes ago, LTO's said:

Wrong

Zero chance either of them would have allowed DD trade those guys.  They both had more power, especially after the Duq/Toronto thing.

Maybe Duq didn’t want to move them either, who knows but if he did, they wouldn’t have let him.

[LTO's]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

Zero chance either of them would have allowed DD trade those guys.  They both had more power, especially after the Duq/Toronto thing.

Maybe Duq didn’t want to move them either, who knows but if he did, they wouldn’t have let him.

We don't truly know any of this. You're guessing. I find it odd that they would keep a GM around with no power and allow him to do the 2018 sell off. But my point is that we do know that DD was permitted to explore trades for Britton in 2017. And the trade he had on the table was terrible but was nixed by PA. So it's not a given that if DD would've sold off earlier, the deals would've been better. 

[Sports Guy]

8 minutes ago, LTO's said:

We don't truly know any of this. You're guessing. I find it odd that they would keep a GM around with no power and allow him to do the 2018 sell off. But my point is that we do know that DD was permitted to explore trades for Britton in 2017. And the trade he had on the table was terrible but was nixed by PA. So it's not a given that if DD would've sold off earlier, the deals would've been better. 

How do we know that about Britton?  I don’t recall anything in 2017?

 

[Frobby]

20 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

When we had both Mancini and Christian Walker in the organization

GMs (or owners) often don’t trust their own prospects to develop into good major leaguers.  I think one of the most underrated aspects of a good organization is the ability to discern which of its minor leaguers can be successful in the majors.   Tampa, LAD and Houston are all very good at that.   

[Aristotelian]

4 hours ago, wildcard said:

4+ years after Dan  Duquette and his staff left the O's here are the players on the major league roster that were acquired on his watch:

11 Pitchers - 12* if you count Mychal Givens

Grayson Rodriguez,  DL Hall, John Means, Dean Kremer, Felix Bautista, Mike Baumann, Dillon Tate, Keegan Akin, Nick Vespi, Bruce Zimmermann, Drew Rom

*Would Mychal Givens have signed with the the O's if he didn't have history with them? 

5 Position Players

Ryan Mountcastle, Cedric Mullins, Austin Hays, Anthony Santander, Ryan McKenna

Mike Elias must value them or they would not still be here.

Davis contract, Trumbo contract, Hardy contract, Cobb contract... The rebuild has been painful and Duquette was the one who put us in that position. Ownership likely pressured Duquette and influenced his strategy and it sounds like Brady/Peter made the warehouse culture pretty toxic, so it's not all his fault, but his signatures were on all the contracts.

It's good that Kremer has turned into a legit option but that's pretty much the bare minimum we should have gotten back for a player like Manny.

I'm very bullish on Grayson but bearish on Hall. After those two you have Sedlock, Stewart, and Harvey... Gunnar alone is worth more than that group. 

[RVAOsFan]

DD did some good things, as for the rest of this thread, sheesh, has Spring Training started yet?

[LTO's]

13 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

How do we know that about Britton?  I don’t recall anything in 2017?

 

Had an offer on the table from Hou that had Colin Moran as a headliner.  Was nixed because of medical issues. 

https://www.camdenchat.com/2017/8/31/16234234/orioles-trade-rumors-zach-britton-astros-colin-moran

[interloper]

4 hours ago, DirtyBird said:

And Chris Davis

Chris Davis will be paid more by the O’s in ‘23 than any on the list.

An epic derail one post into the thread. Some fans cannot get over their Chris Davis hangup. 

Feel bad for @wildcard who had a nice original point that there are a lot of players **on the 40-man roster** (i.e.: not Chris Davis) Elias did NOT jettison simply because they weren't "his" guys. 

Edited February 7, 2023 by interloper

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, LTO's said:

Had an offer on the table from Hou that had Colin Moran as a headliner.  Was nixed because of medical issues. 

https://www.camdenchat.com/2017/8/31/16234234/orioles-trade-rumors-zach-britton-astros-colin-moran

Oh right, I do remember that.

Few things:

 

1) Britton was injured that year and was going to be expensive the next year, so the value was only so high.

2) We have no idea who else was in the trade. Just because players aren’t/weren’t top 100 guys doesn’t mean they don’t end up being very good players. What if Cristian Javier was a guy they identified (not even sure if he was in the org at that time but the point remains the same)? 

 

[Frobby]

I see Duquette as a mixed bag, neither all good nor all bad.  I do find it interesting that, despite having some success in his various stops, he went 9 years without a job in MLB after Boston fired him, and he’s been unable to land another position in the 4+ years since being fired by the Orioles.  That suggests he’s not the easiest guy to work with, regardless of whatever other merits he has.  At this point, I think time probably has passed him by.