John Angelos continues to remind us how awful he is

[Going Underground]

Good to see the two teams with the lowest payrolls have the highest hot dog prices.

The Miami Marlins have the cheapest hot dog prices in the league, costing $3. They are followed by the Atlanta Braves ($3.99), Minnesota Twins ($3.99), Milwaukee Brewers ($4) and Seattle Mariners ($4).

On the opposite side, the Baltimore Orioles have the most expensive hot dog in baseball at $8.25. The Orioles are followed by the Oakland Athletics ($7.79), St. Louis Cardinals ($7.75), San Francisco Giants ($7.75)  and San Diego Padres ($7.75).

 

[glenn__davis]

41 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

Keep hearing about what John wants to do outside the stadium but have heard little about improvements in the stadium. It needs some improvements. Scoreboard and out of town scoreboard need upgrades. Some toilets don't work and some sinks continuously run. Some seats are misaligned, so if you are tall and sit behind the misaligned seat good luck. Some seats where the rows become bigger have the cupholders in the middle of your seat. Some seats don't face the pitchers mound and some lower concouse seats under the overhang ,you can't see fly balls. But don't hear about this but how many restaurants and other revenue products for the club they can put into the stadium.

They need to start with the sound system.  It's terrible and should be a (relatively) cheap fix.

[OriolesMagic83]

6 hours ago, vab said:

Elias can probably keep this thing going by trading pieces of this young core at the right time and continuing to stock the talent pipeline that he has built. The question is would he want to stick around for that. 

Yeah, that would be a hard decision.  Stay with the O's and be nickel and dimed to death or go to a large market and have the resources to build a top farm team AND a $250 million or more payroll.

[Orioles5258]

25 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

Good to see the two teams with the lowest payrolls have the highest hot dog prices.

The Miami Marlins have the cheapest hot dog prices in the league, costing $3. They are followed by the Atlanta Braves ($3.99), Minnesota Twins ($3.99), Milwaukee Brewers ($4) and Seattle Mariners ($4).

On the opposite side, the Baltimore Orioles have the most expensive hot dog in baseball at $8.25. The Orioles are followed by the Oakland Athletics ($7.79), St. Louis Cardinals ($7.75), San Francisco Giants ($7.75)  and San Diego Padres ($7.75).

 

They have a $4.10 hot dog thats actually pretty good and allow fans to bring in food.

Oriole Park Food Guide | Baltimore Orioles (mlb.com) 

[OriolesMagic83]

37 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

Going to an Oriole game at Camden Yards is not as cheap as it once was. A regular hot dog is the highest in MLB and a beer is tied for second in MLB. A box of popcorn is $8.00  Tickets in the first few rows of box seats are $115.00 and over depending on the team . I thought he said he wants to keep prices affordable in a city like Baltimore.  We are not NY.

“We’re going to have to raise the prices here — dramatically,” Angelos told The Times in terms of what he saw as the only way for the Orioles to retain their collection of young stars.

Yeah, can't cut into that owner's fee.

[Going Underground]

3 minutes ago, Orioles5258 said:

They have a $4.10 hot dog thats actually pretty good and allow fans to bring in food.

Oriole Park Food Guide | Baltimore Orioles (mlb.com) 

Agreed,they have that $4.10 booth around the stadium for soda,hot dogs,etc. I think every MLB stadium allows you to bring food in. Used to be two that didn't but I think all do know. I think MLB is one of the few that allow food in. Minor league games usually don't. 

[tntoriole]

1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:

While I agree with your post in spirit, MLB won't NOT approve of an owner because they're thrifty and a douchebag.

This is the thing that's obnoxious...if Tampa can do these things, there's no reason we can't.  

It just sucks to have a cheesedick owner like this who's inserted himself into the conversation about this team a few times this year...when we should all just be enjoying everything and not worried about the future.

True … but maybe a douchebag whose douchebag old man engaged in a lengthy legal battle with Washington and MLB , who refuses to commit to stsying in Baltimore and who is a PR nightmare.. .. and who is not already an owner.  The surviving spouses and then sons inheriting property rights to an MLB franchise  do not automatically inherit MLB approval as an owner and i suspect could be required to sell if not meeting ownership approval. 

[DrungoHazewood]

The man isn't terribly bright, is he? 

Does he think we're so dumb that we we don't understand supply and demand (I'd have to raise prices hugely to pay for players!) or does he just not understand supply and demand? Obviously if he raised prices a lot, fewer people would come to games and revenues would likely be flat.

Unless he's not setting prices optimally now. But why would such an astute businessman do that?

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Hallas said:

Lol at whining about signing players when your rev share intake alone has been higher than the actual team payroll for years.

Yea, last year Forbes estimated that the O's profit was over $60M and the player payroll was about $30M.

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

The man isn't terribly bright, is he? 

Does he think we're so dumb that we we don't understand supply and demand (I'd have to raise prices hugely to pay for players!) or does he just not understand supply and demand? Obviously if he raised prices a lot, fewer people would come to games and revenues would likely be flat.

Unless he's not setting prices optimally now. But why would such an astute businessman do that?

I think what he is trying to do is to get fans to pressure the State to up their offer for stadium renovations.

 

 

[DrungoHazewood]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

I think what he is trying to do is to get fans to pressure the State to up their offer for stadium renovations.

 

 

I don't know, that's a bit too complicated for him to have come up with on his own. Don't you think?

Also, doesn't he know that the fans think he's an idiot and won't go to bat for him? Unless maybe he can pull the "moving' to Nashville unless you write me a bigger check" card.

[emmett16]

5 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Aside from an apparent ally in the Governor's mansion.

MD is broke, looking at a 1BB deficit by 2028, but he wants to pass out $600MM to a petulant child.  Not sure how that is going to work. 

Gov. Wes Moore: Maryland must reckon with structural challenges facing state economy, budget - WTOP News

 

[wildcard]

John Angelos is either very, very smart or very, very lucky.

I don't think too many people would disagree that Peter Angelos loves Baltimore.  Born and raised here he became rich in Baltimore with a successful law firm winning asbestos cases.   Then used some of that money to become majority owner of the O's and keep it in Baltimore.  He wanted to win the World Series in the worst way.   Came close in 1996-7 and in 2014 but never realize his baseball dream.  

The MLB system allowed rich clubs to buy up the good players outspending the mid and small market teams by a large margin.   Peter got the team up to 167m by overspending on players while stopping spending on international, scouting and the minor leagues.   The O's lost high draft choices in  order to sign Free Agents.   It didn't work.

What did happen to Peter was that MLB came and took half of the drawing area when they put the Nationals in Washington.     Where he had an attendance of 3M at one point, after the Nationals came the attandance drop to half that.  He fought it hard.  Even doing a major no-no in suing MLB in court.  Something that owners are just never supposed to do. And not making friends doing it.

This is the environment that John Angelos took over in 2018.   Team was bad and expensive. MLB was mad at the O's ownership.  The GM and Manager had to go.

So he had Duquette start to tear the team down before he left.  Tried to stop the bleeding.  Then in the fall of 2018 he interviewed for a new GM.   Mike Elias was one of the interviewee.  Elias told him he had a way to win a World Series vs New York, Boston and the others while lowering player payroll.

All it would would cost John was to allow Elias to build a first class player development, analytics and scouting system including international.   John bought it.   Winning the World Series and raking in the money by building the team on the cheap.   Like Houston and Tampa but on a Tampa budget.

Instead of spending on Free Agents, trading players as they get close to Free Agency and restocking the minors.

And now 4 years later its working.  John stayed the course on the rebuild.  Didn't fold when the losses built up year after year.  And now he has a first place team, the best farm system and the 2nd lowest payroll in MLB.   Smart, smart move hiring Mike Elias and staying out of his way as he built what he had promised.

But John still has a problem.   He wants a legacy of building more than a baseball team.   He wants to build an entertainment environment like Atlanta has.  He wants to bring that to Baltimore and he wants the lasting credit for doing it.

Yes, he puts his foot in his mouth trying to explain it to the public.  Trying to tell people what Elias had told him is the plan.  Would it be better if he kept quiet and let the Elias plan play out.  Yes, probably.  But has messy as it was to lose for years to get to have a playoff team, John may go through some more mess trying to get to his state of the art entertainment environment in downtown  Baltimore.

Looking at where the O's are now is John smart or lucky.   I don't think we can say that the state of the O's is anything but going where John and Elias planned it would go.  Over the next few years the dream of a World Series might even be realized.

Edited August 21, 2023 by wildcard

[tntoriole]

39 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

Yeah, that would be a hard decision.  Stay with the O's and be nickel and dimed to death or go to a large market and have the resources to build a top farm team AND a $250 million or more payroll.

So the teams above 250 million payroll in 2023 are Mets, Yankees, Padres with Dodgers and Rangers just under 250. 
 

Which of those teams owners and markets are going to want an Elias type rebuild?  Adding and signing big name free agents or highvaluebig risk trades have not been demonstrated by Elias in Houston or here. 
 

None of those organizations are currently in top 5 farm systems either.  Mets are 11th and MFYs 21st 

[tntoriole]

12 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think what he is trying to do is to get fans to pressure the State to up their offer for stadium renovations.

 

 

Or what?