The Orioles Bullpen, They can fix it

[Il BuonO]

I’m not a fan of set roles in the pen. However, Wells has closed before and looked good last night. Flaherty has pitched in some big games with the Cardinals. Either of them is preferable to Cano. Cano in spot duty vs RHB. And get rid of Fujinami and Lopez, they’re awful.

Bullpen fixed.

[Aristotelian]

2 minutes ago, Il BuonO said:

I’m not a fan of set roles in the pen. However, Wells has closed before and looked good last night. Flaherty has pitched in some big games with the Cardinals. Either of them is preferable to Cano. Cano in spot duty vs RHB. And get rid of Fujinami and Lopez, they’re awful.

Bullpen fixed.

Both could close when they are on. So could Cano. Problem is, Wells and Flaherty have been pitching like garbage as starters, and Wells' numbers in the minors weren't great. I agree we should be trying them out in increasingly higher leverage but I don't trust either of them more than Cano right now. 

Even based on eye test Wells was hit hard in his appearance despite the good result. 

[Bird Lady]

As much as I hate it, I think tonight needs to be Means and Flaherty only. Let the others rest, and hope for the best because the other pitchers have nothing left right now, and bringing them in night after night is only making things worse.

Edited September 23, 2023 by Bird Lady

[ScGO's]

47 minutes ago, Bird Lady said:

As much as I hate it, I think tonight needs to be Means and Flaherty only. Let the others rest, and hope for the best because the other pitchers have nothing left right now, and bringing them in night after night is only making things worse.

Irvin has to be on this team today. Use the IL rule; Lopez needs to be gone. If they want to sign him to a milb deal this winter, cool, but needs to be off the team NOW.

Also, give me Vespi for Baumann at this point. 

I have been all for everything Elias has done for this team up until the trade deadline this year (and maybe it was more John Angelos than Mike Elias); we needed at least a good starter and a great bullpen piece. We got Fuji and Flaherty; Elias also picked up Webb and Lopez to try to save some face; Lopez is terrible and Webb is starting come back to Earth. We needed an impact guy, and Elias swung and missed.

That was the intention of this thread; Elias shit the bed for the first time (it happens to the best of us, just make the adjustment), and now he's trying to figure out how to clean up the mess.

I think the pieces are there, especially with Wells back in the mix; however, even without any off days, I have not been happy with Hyde's management of the pen.  If Hyde and Elias would have started using the model in my 1st post at the beginning of the Indians series, I think we are up 2-0 in this Series.

I also feel our best chance to win the WS is if we follow this Bullpen model AND Bautista returns in full form for the playoffs. If the bullpen stays on this course, I don't think we can hold leads in late pressure situations in a 5 or 7 game series

 

 

[OriolesMagic83]

On 9/22/2023 at 1:11 AM, Malike said:

This might be deceptive. How many relief pitchers has Tampa used this year? How many relief pitchers have the O's used? I don't have the information nor the desire to dig at 1 a.m. but just because they pitched more innings, doesn't mean they've been used more if they've used more pitchers than we have.

Edit:

We've used 26 relievers, including guys like Givens, Garrett, Bazardo, McCann, McKenna and Josh Lester. 

Tampa has used 33 this season.

Is it bad that I would rather have McKenna pitch than Fuji or Lopez?

[Billy F-Face3]

After the previous 2 games, I think we have learned that the best thing to do without Bautista available is simply play the matchups like it was the middle innings. Cano is best used as the set up man in the 8th inning, but lately it would be best to limit his exposure to facing left handed batters. Bring in a left handed pitcher like Perez, Coulombe, or Hall to face left handed batters.

Guys we can use to match up in the 9th could possibly be Hall, Perez, or Flaherty. Maybe I was just persuaded by another board member, but I actually think Flaherty might be actually prove to be good in short bursts and limed doses. Plus he has experience being in big moments throughout his career.

But with that said, I think it all comes down to their each individual pitch mix and stuff, and the batters that they might be matched up against. I think Hyde, Analytics, and the pitching coaches will know this information the best and be able to plan accordingly.

[OriolesMagic83]

I agree with matchups in the 8th and 9th, but you can't do matchups the whole game.  That's how the bullpen got in this shape.  Hyde needs to use one of the lower leverage guys to get at least 2 innings in most games the starter leaves in the 5th or 6th. 

[Aristotelian]

4 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

After the previous 2 games, I think we have learned that the best thing to do without Bautista available is simply play the matchups like it was the middle innings. Cano is best used as the set up man in the 8th inning, but lately it would be best to limit his exposure to facing left handed batters. Bring in a left handed pitcher like Perez, Coulombe, or Hall to face left handed batters.

Guys we can use to match up in the 9th could possibly be Hall, Perez, or Flaherty. Maybe I was just persuaded by another board member, but I actually think Flaherty might be actually prove to be good in short bursts and limed doses. Plus he has experience being in big moments throughout his career.

But with that said, I think it all comes down to their each individual pitch mix and stuff, and the batters that they might be matched up against. I think Hyde, Analytics, and the pitching coaches will know this information the best and be able to plan accordingly.

I agree with using a committee approach but one thing to be aware of is pinch hitters. I noticed last night Cano ended up facing two lefties due to pinch hitters coming off the bench. Fortunately he got the job done. 

[Sports Guy]

40 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

I agree with using a committee approach but one thing to be aware of is pinch hitters. I noticed last night Cano ended up facing two lefties due to pinch hitters coming off the bench. Fortunately he got the job done. 

As Drungo recently showed, the average pinch hitter OPS is below 700.

 

[RZNJ]

Hard to believe, judging by his results in the minors, but Tyler Wells is emerging as a late inning, possible closer, high leverage reliever.   Jorge Lopez and Fuji are on the outside looking in.   Cano, looking very good his last two times out.  Hall has earned trust.  So here’s how it looks.

Tyler Wells (closer)

Cano

Perez

Webb

Coulombe

Hall

 

That’s 6 trusted relievers.  I can’t put Flaherty in there yet.   One of the starters probably gets used out of the pen as a long man for the playoffs.  All signs point to Kremer as of today.

[Il BuonO]

5 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Hard to believe, judging by his results in the minors, but Tyler Wells is emerging as a late inning, possible closer, high leverage reliever.   Jorge Lopez and Fuji are on the outside looking in.   Cano, looking very good his last two times out.  Hall has earned trust.  So here’s how it looks.

Tyler Wells (closer)

Cano

Perez

Webb

Coulombe

Hall

That’s 6 trusted relievers.  I can’t put Flaherty in there yet.   One of the starters probably gets used out of the pen as a long man for the playoffs.  All signs point to Kremer as of today.

Glad to see another poster shares my thoughts about Wells. 

As far as Lopez and Fujinami. The outside is exactly where they should reside.