Sarris @The Athletic: Burnes #1, G-Rod #6

[Conway12]

https://www.thebaltimorebanner.com/sports/orioles-mlb/orioles-grayson-rodriguez-new-slider-JLYL3ORB4RFWROMRETPVIUVFRQ/

He's got a "new" slider that Statcast calls a cutter. Andy Kostka had a good article on the subject. 

[Conway12]

4 minutes ago, Conway12 said:

https://www.thebaltimorebanner.com/sports/orioles-mlb/orioles-grayson-rodriguez-new-slider-JLYL3ORB4RFWROMRETPVIUVFRQ/

He's got a "new" slider that Statcast calls a cutter. Andy Kostka had a good article on the subject. 

 

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

I thought going into the season Grayson Rodriguez had a good shot to be the Orioles best starter even with Burnes and Bradish on the team. If Bradish can return back to form the Orioles starting rotation might feature three ace-like pitchers. I've never seen that in my lifetime watching Orioles baseball.

If your screen name was OsFsnSinceThe70s, you would have.  However, the early 80’s staff had some pretty awesome starters.   

[CaptainRedbeard]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

What is the ranking Moose?  Is Sarris saying Burnes is the best and GRod is the 6th best overall starter or is it Stuff+?

Rankings for fantasy baseball, which of course for pitchers is pretty close to real baseball, but Burnes and Grayson benefit from being higher-K, pitching in OPACY and having the Orioles’ offense. 

[CaptainRedbeard]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

What is the ranking Moose?  Is Sarris saying Burnes is the best and GRod is the 6th best overall starter or is it Stuff+?

Rankings for fantasy baseball, which of course for pitchers is pretty close to real baseball, but Burnes and Grayson benefit from being higher-K, pitching in OPACY and having the Orioles’ offense. 

[interloper]

I've really been impressed with Grayson's ability to just consistently have a good start. He's not really out there blowing guys away and that's fine. He put the 99 in his pocket and is focusing on the change up and I love that. 99 is fun and all, but if 96 works by all means do that instead. 

[Just Regular]

Burnes and Grayson are an interesting compare/contrast for best Ace.

Burnes (and Bradish) are ~500k college arms who have achieved amazing heights in their careers.     Gausman, Cole and the Philadelphia guys are really the only ones in Burnes' class.     Wheeler and Burnes production is quite similar, with Burnes ~4.5 years younger.

Grayson is the classic lightning bolt in his arm kind of profile, and hopefully what we are seeing now is him putting it all together.     Some chance they will see each other on opposite sides somewhere down the line.

[Satyr3206]

19 minutes ago, Frobby said:

If your screen name was OsFsnSinceThe70s, you would have.  However, the early 80’s staff had some pretty awesome starters.   

I really liked Boddicker. I wonder how a pitcher like him would do today?

[Philip]

I’m interested in an article about which pitches are easiest to throw, with the least amount of stress on the body. That would minimize arm injuries, I bet. A terrific pitch that ruins an arm quickly isn’t a good thing. I wonder if a big part of why Nolan Ryan and Fergie Jenkins etc were so reliable was because their pitches were just simpler? It’s the contortion, and not the strength, that rips up an arm.
Whatever GRod is throwing, I sincerely hope he’ll  Limit use of the complicated stuff.

[Frobby]

Just now, Satyr3206 said:

I really liked Boddicker. I wonder how a pitcher like him would do today?

Well, if his FB was the same today, probably not very well.  But if it was the same relative to the league as it was then, he’d probably be very good.  Very heady pitcher.  

[clapdiddy]

1 minute ago, Philip said:

I’m interested in an article about which pitches are easiest to throw, with the least amount of stress on the body. That would minimize arm injuries, I bet. A terrific pitch that ruins an arm quickly isn’t a good thing. I wonder if a big part of why Nolan Ryan and Fergie Jenkins etc were so reliable was because their pitches were just simpler? It’s the contortion, and not the strength, that rips up an arm.
Whatever GRod is throwing, I sincerely hope he’ll  Limit use of the complicated stuff.

I think the game has changed so much since Ryan and Jenkins were pitching.   They didn't have all the technology that's around now used to work on hitting and pitching.   I think Ryan's raw stuff could play today for sure, but would he have the same effectiveness?

[Satyr3206]

1 minute ago, Philip said:

I’m interested in an article about which pitches are easiest to throw, with the least amount of stress on the body. That would minimize arm injuries, I bet. A terrific pitch that ruins an arm quickly isn’t a good thing. I wonder if a big part of why Nolan Ryan and Fergie Jenkins etc were so reliable was because their pitches were just simpler? It’s the contortion, and not the strength, that rips up an arm.
Whatever GRod is throwing, I sincerely hope he’ll  Limit use of the complicated stuff.

FB and Change are the easiest. Slider, Curve, and Splitter are the hardest to me. Screwballs are hard too but I haven't seen one in a while.

[Aristotelian]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Here’s a quote from Grayson after his Tuesday start:

"Fastball command wasn't really there," he said. "I thought that could have been a lot better. But being able to pitch with the off-speed was a big step forward, being able to land stuff for strikes. Also, put guys away with sliders in the dirt."

He hasn’t ditched the slider.   Maybe he’s just throwing it differently?   
 

My understanding is that cutter and slider are essentially the same pitch thrown at different velocities. Similar action, similar spin. Fangraphs "Pitch Type" has him abandoning the slider but with lower velo on the cutter, but "Pitch Info Pitch Type" has him still throwing 5% sliders but higher velo. So, just depends what coding system is being used. Sounds like in Grayson's mind he is still throwing a hard slider but it may be ticking up in velo.

[Aristotelian]

20 minutes ago, Philip said:

I’m interested in an article about which pitches are easiest to throw, with the least amount of stress on the body. That would minimize arm injuries, I bet. A terrific pitch that ruins an arm quickly isn’t a good thing. I wonder if a big part of why Nolan Ryan and Fergie Jenkins etc were so reliable was because their pitches were just simpler? It’s the contortion, and not the strength, that rips up an arm.
Whatever GRod is throwing, I sincerely hope he’ll  Limit use of the complicated stuff.

Didn't Duquette attempt to ditch the cutter in the minors to prevent arm injuries? Not sure if that did any good but I recall that being the thinking.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Aristotelian said:

Didn't Duquette attempt to ditch the cutter in the minors to prevent arm injuries? Not sure if that did any good but I recall that being the thinking.

I think it was more about preserving fastball velocity.