Roch: AM isn't putting on a show for the fans by making offers he secretly hopes are turned down

[Dipper9]

Sure, he can defend himself. But, when considering the platform he has, he may want to defend himself in at least a moderately professional way instead of resorting to name-calling and picking fights. To me, that sounds like how a person would defend himself if he couldn't come up with an intellectual way to do so. It's pretty pathetic really.

My only issue with Roch and Cunningham and the like is they always resort to referring to us as some kids playing on their parents' computer, or something to that effect. Most of us are VERY knowledgeable baseball fans and most of the ideas we come up with are pretty sound. Just because we don't write for MASN or have a radio talk show doesn't mean we are immature kids who don't know any better. Its THAT comeback that Roch and Cunningham use so often that really irritates me!

[SoBo]

I think that you're looking at Pena or Lee at 1st. I just got a feeling that Pena is that guy. He's played well against us and in OPACY and has a good glove. And he's not SO old to believe he can't reverse that batting avg and make it respectable.

[TiredofLosing20]

What would they cut access to? It's never local media that is breaking big Orioles' news. It's not like they get alot of interviews with AM or PA. I doubt they would keep them out of the media room after games. Also, how would it look if the Sun wrote a fair piece on one of those issues and the O's responded by limiting access? The report doesn't have to be mean spirited towards the O's, it just has to point out their clear deficiencies.

So you don't think the O's could make the Sun writers lives more difficult? I am sure they can do it in non-obvious ways.

I agree it would be difficult to cut the Sun out completely but they could certainly re-direct quotes and the interviews they do get.

Either way, I think they all journalists (especially sports) walk a fine line between critic and shill.

[TonySoprano]

Roch's good people.

I think he probably realized he went a bit too far, then removed the whole thing.

from the comments section

I do need a thicker skin, as a fewer readers have not-so-tactfully pointed out. Agreed. Must be the early-morning hour. I get way too cranky and sensitive. My bad. - Roch

[weams]

What would they cut access to? It's never local media that is breaking big Orioles' news. It's not like they get alot of interviews with AM or PA. I doubt they would keep them out of the media room after games. Also, how would it look if the Sun wrote a fair piece on one of those issues and the O's responded by limiting access? The report doesn't have to be mean spirited towards the O's, it just has to point out their clear deficiencies.

100 percent correct.

[Peace21]

I don't think it is MacPhail that is the main issue. I believe it has to do with one person and one person only and that is Peter Angelos. Look at how many lowball offers this team has handed out to players in the past 13-14 years. Other GM's have done the same thing, remember the lowball offer to Delgado way back when and the offer we made to Tex and to many other players. It is the owner who doesn't want to spend what it would take to land top talent. He wouldn't even want to pay a pitcher top dollar. MacPhail is the perfect GM for Peter though. The man is slow and drags things out. I have talked to people within the game and they say MacPhail is very hard to deal with. And it makes sense, because AM won't pay up because he and PA are on the same page.

[Dipper9]

I don't think it is MacPhail that is the main issue. I believe it has to do with one person and one person only and that is Peter Angelos. Look at how many lowball offers this team has handed out to players in the past 13-14 years. Other GM's have done the same thing, remember the lowball offer to Delgado way back when and the offer we made to Tex and to many other players. It is the owner who doesn't want to spend what it would take to land top talent. He wouldn't even want to pay a pitcher top dollar. MacPhail is the perfect GM for Peter though. The man is slow and drags things out. I have talked to people within the game and they say MacPhail is very hard to deal with. And it makes sense, because AM won't pay up because he and PA are on the same page.

That's not how I remember it at all. I thought we made a good offer to Delgado and he was ready to accept before taking the Mets deal. How about the fact that we made a great offer to Vladdy and HE was ready to accept before deciding on the Angels and their Latino community? We had the highest offer to Konerko but he took less to stay in Chicago. The low-ball offers have been primarily in the MacPhail Era.

[Peace21]

That's not how I remember it at all. I thought we made a good offer to Delgado and he was ready to accept before taking the Mets deal. How about the fact that we made a great offer to Vladdy and HE was ready to accept before deciding on the Angels and their Latino community? We had the highest offer to Konerko but he took less to stay in Chicago. The low-ball offers have been primarily in the MacPhail Era.

I thought Delgado was offered something like, 3/30. Right?

[weams]

That's not how I remember it at all. I thought we made a good offer to Delgado and he was ready to accept before taking the Mets deal. How about the fact that we made a great offer to Vladdy and HE was ready to accept before deciding on the Angels and their Latino community? We had the highest offer to Konerko but he took less to stay in Chicago. The low-ball offers have been primarily in the MacPhail Era.

Well. If he doesn't do well with this year's budget...we will get to see with someone else next year. So I guess the Andy haters ought to root against us doing well this year.

[Dipper9]

Well. If he doesn't do well with this year's budget...we will get to see with someone else next year. So I guess the Andy haters ought to root against us doing well this year.

That's the thing Weams. I'm not a Andy hater. I want nothing more than for him to prove me wrong. I will gladly admit I was an ass and that he had a plan together the whole time.

But what he has shown me SO FAR in his Baltimore tenure does not convince me that he will make this team competitive by April.

[SoBo]

I don't think it is MacPhail that is the main issue. I believe it has to do with one person and one person only and that is Peter Angelos. Look at how many lowball offers this team has handed out to players in the past 13-14 years. Other GM's have done the same thing, remember the lowball offer to Delgado way back when and the offer we made to Tex and to many other players. It is the owner who doesn't want to spend what it would take to land top talent. He wouldn't even want to pay a pitcher top dollar. MacPhail is the perfect GM for Peter though. The man is slow and drags things out. I have talked to people within the game and they say MacPhail is very hard to deal with. And it makes sense, because AM won't pay up because he and PA are on the same page.

My secondary hope when PA brought in AM was that he wanted AM to clean up the balance sheet and make the O's look like an attractive buying opportunity. I would say he's done that. Doesn't mean he's going to sell. But if he wanted to, I'd say the O's look a lot better than they did when AM arrived.

[Peace21]

My secondary hope when PA brought in AM was that he wanted AM to clean up the balance sheet and make the O's look like an attractive buying opportunity. I would say he's done that. Doesn't mean he's going to sell. But if he wanted to, I'd say the O's look a lot better than they did when AM arrived.

Deep down, do you really think Angelos would sell this team? Even if the right offer came along?

[Stotle]

My only issue with Roch and Cunningham and the like is they always resort to referring to us as some kids playing on their parents' computer, or something to that effect. Most of us are VERY knowledgeable baseball fans and most of the ideas we come up with are pretty sound. Just because we don't write for MASN or have a radio talk show doesn't mean we are immature kids who don't know any better. Its THAT comeback that Roch and Cunningham use so often that really irritates me!

I'm sure he's a nice guy, a good fan, and I have enjoyed his coverage when I do check in. But I agree with the above. He is insultingly dismissive on the whole -- and while I understand that a majority of any sports fanbase probably deserves to be insultingly dismissed you owe it to your readership to do you best to distinguish the legit critiques and questions about the org from the unsophisticated loud-mouths.

[SoBo]

Deep down, do you really think Angelos would sell this team? Even if the right offer came along?

Not at this point. But one can hope.

[weams]

Not at this point. But one can hope.

Think here a second. Who can afford to buy the Orioles without being Eli Jacobs broke.

Baltimore Orioles

Jacobs, along with Larry Lucchino (a holdover from the previous ownership), Sargent Shriver and his eldest son Bobby, announced their purchase of the Baltimore Orioles from the estate of the late Edward Bennett Williams for $70 million on December 6, 1988. The transaction was unanimously approved by the American League (AL) franchise owners just over four months later on April 18, 1989, two weeks into the new baseball season. The owner of 87% of the ballclub, Jacobs became the chairman of the board, with Lucchino managing the organization.

In his 1994 book The Baltimore Orioles: Forty Years of Magic from 33rd Street to Camden Yards, Ted Patterson made the following observation of the new majority owner:

“ Jacobs was a New Yorker with a flat personality who found it awkward being in the public eye. Winning and losing seemed inconsequential. He used the Orioles as a vehicle to entertain and impress high rollers in government, business, and entertainment.[1] ”

In the first year of the Jacobs regime, the Orioles nearly shocked the baseball world by transforming itself from the worst team in Major League Baseball with a 54–107 record in 1988 to one that fell short of winning the AL Eastern Division title by two games. Unfortunately for the franchise, the tragic neglect of its scouting department and farm system, which actually began under Williams, would continue as Jacobs was reluctant to spend any money on improving the operations. On the field, the team seemed to revolve around Cal Ripken, Jr. and not much else. The only positive was the opening of Oriole Park at Camden Yards in April, 1992 creating new revenue streams for the Orioles.

[edit] Bankruptcy

Even before the gates to Camden Yards opened for business, Jacobs found his investment empire drowning in debt. The first signs of trouble surfaced in 1991 when Jacobs attempted to sell the Orioles for $200 million. He failed to attract any buyers, even after lowering his price to $160 million.

His heavily leveraged financial situation collapsed in 1992. After Memorex Telex emerged from Chapter 11 reorganization in February, his 35% interest was wiped out. The restructuring of Triangle Pacific forced him to surrender most of his 97% stake to bondholders in November. In between, he was sued by four lending establishments (Mercantile-Safe Deposit & Trust Co. of Baltimore, Manufacturers & Traders Trust Co., The Berkshire Bank of New York City and Banca Commerciale Italiana of Milan) for defaulting on outstanding loans totaling about $36.4 million. Even his $2 million home in Owings Mills, Maryland was seized when he failed to make mortgage payments.

When seven banks filed petitions to force him into bankruptcy in March 1993, Jacobs had to relinquish the Orioles. At an auction held in bankruptcy court in New York on August 2, 1993, the ballclub was sold for $173 million to a group of Baltimore investors led by Peter Angelos. The sale was unanimously approved by the AL club owners two months later on October 4.[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eli_Jacobs

this is not a franchise that prints money. It has to Be Bill Gates.