According to Jones...

[Can_of_corn]

But none of that necessarily means they are making a profit. And just because the Nats are asking for more money doesn't mean MASN is profitable. MASN may be cashflow positive, which would allow them to pay the Nats more, but that's a big difference from being profitable.

They are receiving monthly payments from every cable subscriber in their zone of influence. They received a cash infusion to start the network. From what I understand the content is extremely sparse aside from O's/Nats games.

There is no way they are not turning a profit.

Please give me your reasoning as to why they may not be profitable.

[El Gordo]

The bottom line is that with or without Fielder, success still depends on pitching. Of course Fielder makes the Orioles better. But without improved pitching, he alone doesn't put the Orioles in the playoffs.

Fielder only becomes relevant for the O's, if his price approaches his true worth in terms of future production, which is around 18 M per at best, IMO.

[kklovestheravens]

I agree with the importance of both of these. However from what I have read over the years it is my opinion that the ownership group has used the O's/MASN as a cash cow. So I do feel the money is there.

I do like the direction that DD seems to be taking the FO. That to me is more encouraging than anything I have seen from this team in years. Here's hoping it continues.

However if I was given a choice of Fielder or continued MiL/Scouting/acquisition/Development/FO improvements. Well I'll take the improvements please.

after 14 years of losing, we deserve both a competitive team on the field and a great scouting, development, front office infrastructure, etc. off if as well, don't you think?

[Capn Vivi]

He will be next season as will a number of other potential TOR's. Suppose Britton, Matusz, and Arrieta, combine to for 40 W's this season. Wouldn't you rather spend 15 M on him and have spent 8 M on Cespedes. Fielder is 25 M that may or may not be of any value to us. If Britton, Matusz, and Arrieta continue to disappoint, you will see a sale at the trade deadline and next fall, that would make a 25 M investment in him now, absurd.

Here are a few notable FA pitchers that, assuming nothing changes, should be available in the 2012-13 offseason:

Zack Greinke

Matt Cain

Cole Hamels

Shaun Marcum

Jonathan Sanchez

Shaun Marcum is the only one here who will be over 30. Given Duquette's reluctance to commit over 3 years to any FA pitcher, what exactly is the likelihood any of these guys will be calling Baltimore home in 2013? I would predict none, short of an off year by one of them.

The best way for the O's to solidfy their rotation is through their young staff and trades. All other options are just unrealistic. If we're going to spend big bucks on a FA, it's likely to be a hitter.

[El Gordo]

I never tried to make the case that Fielder was a good or logical signing. I said he could be very relevant if he was signed. You said he was irrelevant whether the young pitching blossomed or not.

He is at his current price. We can use that money in better ways, regardless of how the Cavalry fairs.

[El Gordo]

Here are a few notable FA pitchers that, assuming nothing changes, should be available in the 2012-13 offseason:

Zack Greinke

Matt Cain

Cole Hamels

Shaun Marcum

Jonathan Sanchez

Shaun Marcum is the only one here who will be over 30. Given Duquette's reluctance to commit over 3 years to any FA pitcher, what exactly is the likelihood any of these guys will be calling Baltimore home in 2013? I would predict none, short of an off year by one of them.

The best way for the O's to solidfy their rotation is through their young staff and trades. All other options are just unrealistic. If we're going to spend big bucks on a FA, it's likely to be a hitter.

The key word here is reluctance. If the Cavalry put up 40 W's in 2012, I think one of those FA SP's will be the exception that proves the rule. Or it least should be.

[BrunoCherrytown]

They are receiving monthly payments from every cable subscriber in their zone of influence. They received a cash infusion to start the network. From what I understand the content is extremely sparse aside from O's/Nats games.

There is no way they are not turning a profit.

Please give me your reasoning as to why they may not be profitable.

What was the NY Times figure for MASN Gross Rev...I think it was like $157-$158 million.

So let's use that for spittballing.

So if both the O's and Nats were getting $29 million for TV rights say that leaves them with $100 million to work with regarding salaries, infrastructure, equipment, programming, legal, etc. etc.

And then take what's left over and give the O's 87% or 86% of it. If that NY Times article is correct in its estimates, that is where the discussion of profits would fall in. And then you have every other year to go into it as well.

MASN isn't producing Boardwalk Empire so i'm not quite sure their costs are massively cumbersome after you take the rights fees out. But i'm in Florida and only see MASN through the baseball package so I don't know.

But to get to that $56-ish million estimate from the OP (from other thread) for MASN profits you'd need about $70 million in additional costs to come out of that $100 million chunk leaving a total Net of $30 millionish...and that I believe to be on the light side by a good bit if you believe the NY Times estimates.

If say the Net was $60 million off the original $158 figure that would give Angelos+Owners +O's a TV rights + MASN revenue stream of $81.2 million. And, of course, they are majority owners of the TV network so there is asset value there. It's like the Yankees, as has been widely reported, lose money on their team payroll and costs, but make their profits off of YES. And then the more successful the Yankees are, and the higher the ratings go, the higher the value of YES and Yankees. So it's a symbiotic relationship of sorts. Although with the forced subscription dues how much ratings can impact the value of MASN I don't know, but highers ones obviously drive that mark up to some degree. And if they put other programming on the channel that drives higher ratings the value could go up even further.

[OsLuvrInKy]

after 14 years of losing, we deserve both a competitive team on the field and a great scouting, development, front office infrastructure, etc. off if as well, don't you think?

Yes I do think we deserve both. I stated "If I was given the choice of one or the other"

[Great8]

According to AJ:

10 @SimplyAJ10 1m

Just seen a fun thing in orioleshangout. Hahaha never did that from what I remember. But ok. That's how y'all work. A Bad decision was made

[Nick The Stick]

From the man himself:

10 @SimplyAJ10 1m

Just seen a fun thing in orioleshangout. Hahaha never did that from what I remember. But ok. That's how y'all work. A Bad decision was made

[MarkakisFan21]

Lol Jones basically just said whoever made this thread is a liar.

[PrivateO]

From the man himself:

10 @SimplyAJ10 1m

Just seen a fun thing in orioleshangout. Hahaha never did that from what I remember. But ok. That's how y'all work. A Bad decision was made

Ohhh..........busted......

[El Gordo]

We are having two different discussions. A real one and the one you are having.

How is it benificial to to sign Fielder for 7M a year more than his true worth. You are talking about Fielder's value in the abstract. Sure it would be great to have his production in our lineup next season regardless of what else happens. But in the real conversation you don't want to have, he costs way more than he is worth. The team is at a crossraods this season, IMO if nit in yours. If the SP doesn't show promise, they will go into a major rebuild starting at the trade deadline. How stupid in that case, would it be to have shackled yourself to 7-8years at 25M per?

[OrioleMagic]

Just guessing... because I know no one. LOL I think StrawDog made that bad decision. Common sense dictates that insider information must stay inside if the goal is ever to be reached. I hope no damage was done by this thread.

[crissfan172]

And so ends the sad tale of Strawdawg.