Gold Glove announcement tonight...scouts perspective ( Update - All 3 Orioles win)

[Loophole]

I love Adam, I'm happy for him, but I feel like each GG is just another excuse to not work on his holes. And it basically kills my dream of signing Bourn and moving him to LF.

[VeveJones007]

Ehh, I'm not much for generalities of this nature. They are pretty blatant logical fallacies as far as I'm concerned. They do little to advance any dialogue, adress issues or resolve a problems imo. If you have something on somebody then call them out directly and make your specific point(s).

Well said. It was top of mind for me and I didn't take the time to provide more details to enhance the point and communicate it to others with evidence or more clarity.

On another note, Alex Gordon just cost the Royals $500,000 by winning this gold glove. It's crazy that a player's compensation could be tied in such a heavy way to a rather arbitrary award.

[Il BuonO]

I love Adam, I'm happy for him, but I feel like each GG is just another excuse to not work on his holes. And it basically kills my dream of signing Bourn and moving him to LF.

Exactly. I stated this in a previous thread, but differently in that even being considered for a GG was going to reinforce his bad habits. Winning one will cement it. He makes some spectacular plays because of his athleticism, but I've also seen him blow some Cans of Corn. Of course, that was in between blowing bubbles.

[jofalfa]

Reynolds got snubbed. ...

Seriously. Gold glove, gold toe, gold dance moves.

[VeveJones007]

Exactly. I stated this in a previous thread, but differently in that even being considered for a GG was going to reinforce his bad habits. Winning one will cement it. He makes some spectacular plays because of his athleticism, but I've also seen him blow some Cans of Corn. Of course, that was in between blowing bubbles.

But he's always blowing bubbles, even on the spectacular plays. I think this is a classic correlation does not equal causality issue.

[scOtt]

Continuing with my theme of being on topic, these awards will cost the O's $100k (75k for Hardy and 25k for Jones).

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8574862/gold-glove-awards-baltimore-orioles-win-3-mike-trout-los-angeles-angels-snubbed

I guess that means we can put to bed any thoughts of spending on Josh Hamilton. Darn it! Off topic again.

Surprising about Matt not getting a bonus. I asked Roch about all star/GG bonuses last year or the year before. He said he couldn't be sure because the contracts aren't totally public, but he thought a bonus was pretty standard. Almost like part of the basic contract given any player.

And congrats to all three! Especially JJ. I expected him to get snubbed again, even if he did deserve it most.

[sangar]

Congrats to all three Orioles....all deserving....2012 magic lives on. Look, Trout only played 2/3rd of the season in CF....played 30 games or so in left....this is the first year the award goes to a specific OF spot and just not the best 3 OFs....not as controversial as some assume....

I think this is a reasonable perspective. Game to game, Trout is easily the better defender. But, the fact is Jones started 161 games in center, while Trout started 108.

[Il BuonO]

But he's always blowing bubbles, even on the spectacular plays. I think this is a classic correlation does not equal causality issue.

Um, it's a joke.

[Loophole]

Even if you're gonna disqualify Trout because of PT, it's not like there isn't still an argument for Jackson or Span above Jones.

[Annie]

Seriously. Gold glove, gold toe, gold dance moves.

I'd love to just see bloopers of that video :laughlol:

also, like how they cut from reynolds right before he got crazy with the dance moves :2yay-thumb:

[scOtt]

From Roch:

Buck on Markakis:

Showalter noted that Nick Markakis, who won a Gold Glove in right field last year, would have received the same honor this season if he had stayed healthy.

"Once you win one of these things, all of a sudden people are aware of how good you are and how hard you worked at being good," Showalter said. "It's hard to unseat the champion. You have to beat the heck out of him. Nick didn't get unseated. A fastball hit him in the thumb, and that's why he didn't win it. That's how he got unseated.

[MurphDogg]

Surprising about Matt not getting a bonus. I asked Roch about all star/GG bonuses last year or the year before. He said he couldn't be sure because the contracts aren't totally public, but he thought a bonus was pretty standard. Almost like part of the basic contract given any player.

And congrats to all three! Especially JJ. I expected him to get snubbed again, even if he did deserve it most.

They are standard in free agent contracts, not necessarily true of contracts where the player is under team control. With no player leverage, the team has no incentive to offer a bonus.

[Moose Milligan]

From Roch:

Buck on Markakis:

Showalter noted that Nick Markakis, who won a Gold Glove in right field last year, would have received the same honor this season if he had stayed healthy.

"Once you win one of these things, all of a sudden people are aware of how good you are and how hard you worked at being good," Showalter said. "It's hard to unseat the champion. You have to beat the heck out of him. Nick didn't get unseated. A fastball hit him in the thumb, and that's why he didn't win it. That's how he got unseated.

Buck, also explaining how Jones won his.

[UpstateNYfan]

I find it remarkable that so many here are so unhappy that AJ got a second GG. There were years that the O's never received recognition for anything because of their lowly team record. I am glad for them all. It is voted managers and coaches. Which is more accurate than the All Star voting in my opinion. So just enjoy it and don't tarnish it just because you don't agree. I think AJ had a difficult year this year often having strangers to his right and left. He was always there right next to Davis when he was in right field, even on routine fly balls. Is he perfect? No. Is Trout better? Most likely (haven't seen him much except on highlight reels).

Maybe just once in a while when the O's do get some positive recognition some OHers could put their biases and hatred (yes hatred) aside and enjoy it with the team and organization.

[ShaneDawg85]

I find it remarkable that so many here are so unhappy that AJ got a second GG. There were years that the O's never received recognition for anything because of their lowly team record. I am glad for them all. It is voted managers and coaches. Which is more accurate than the All Star voting in my opinion. So just enjoy it and don't tarnish it just because you don't agree. I think AJ had a difficult year this year often having strangers to his right and left. He was always there right next to Davis when he was in right field, even on routine fly balls. Is he perfect? No. Is Trout better? Most likely (haven't seen him much except on highlight reels).

Maybe just once in a while when the O's do get some positive recognition some OHers could put their biases and hatred (yes hatred) aside and enjoy it with the team and organization.

Managers and coaches make mistakes every single night across two leagues, so that doesn't really go for much in my book. End of the day there is no perfect system in baseball:

1. The fans vote for the All Star starters, they vote in guys based on reputation and pure love even when not deserving.

2. Managers and coaches vote the Gold Gloves, guys like Rafael Palmeiro win despite not even playing 40 games at a position.

3. Writers vote for the Hall, and their egos and agendas get in the way of deserving candidates getting in.

Frankly, I don't think there is any one system that is more accurate than other, because there will always be discrepancies, controversies, votes that could have/should have gone the other way, and somebody disagreeing with a decision. I didn't think Adam Jones should have won the award this year. I think there are reasons that he won over a more deserving candidate in Trout that go far beyond defense. That said, I'm not going to root for him any less as an Oriole because of it.