If the Blue Jays land Dickey...

[scOtt]

Indeed!

I'm pretty comfortable with where we're at now, especially in regards to the offense and bullpen- I think 85-88 wins sounds about right with what we have already. I'll just feel a lot better if DD goes out and gets us another proven SP like Saunders, Edwin Jackson or Chris Capuano. I think one of Hammel, Chen, or Miguel probably falters next year, and I think we need someone else in place to protect against that.

This is why I kinda hope we don't get Dickey. We'd have to give up a LOT of pitching. I mean, if you have a deal to get him, minus Bundy, you have to do it. The reigning Cy Young. But it would decimate our farm system and probably the ML rotation too. We'd have holes. We would still need Saunders or equiv.

e: HATE seeing him go to TOR tho! He murdered us this past year. Was it a one-hitter?

[DrinkinWithFermi]

This is why I kinda hope we don't get Dickey. We'd have to give up a LOT of pitching. I mean, if you have a deal to get him, minus Bundy, you have to do it. The reigning Cy Young. But it would decimate our farm system and probably the ML rotation too. We'd have holes. We would still need Saunders or equiv.

e: HATE seeing him go to TOR tho!

LOL, that's one of the greatest Reason For Edits that I've ever seen. Jays are gonna be narsty, no doubt.

Yeah, I wish we could get our mitts on him. If we could get him to sign an extension, I would trade one of Arrieta/Britton/Matusz, Schoop, and one or two more mid-level prospects. In a heartbeat.

Unfortunately, our "mid-level" prospects are low level prospects in other organizations.

[SteveO]

Indeed!

I'm pretty comfortable with where we're at now, especially in regards to the offense and bullpen- I think 85-88 wins sounds about right with what we have already. I'll just feel a lot better if DD goes out and gets us another proven SP like Saunders, Edwin Jackson or Chris Capuano. I think one of Hammel, Chen, or Miguel probably falters next year, and I think we need someone else in place to protect against that.

Would like to see them sign another SP also. I am not in favor of sending most of your pitching depth to obtain a 38y.o guy even if he is a knuckleballer and reigning Cy Young. Personally would be happier signing on of the guys mentioned, preferably the one you get with the shortest commitment.

I would also like to see a bat added. Think a MOO is unlikely at this point but would be happy with a guy like Morse who can provide some 1B depth or a guy like Hairston who could play the field if need be and DH.

My biggest concern is seeing the O's continue to build toward a better scouting and player development system. To that end DD has done a great job IMO. I think a lot of people fail to realize that part of the reason Toronto has been able to make the moves they have is the scouting and development system they have in place. That should be our first priority also IMO.

I would like to see another playoff run and am still hopeful. If the take a slight step back record wise and miss the playoffs but make headway in terms of development and scouting that is a trade off I am more than willing to live with for a year or so. Long term stability should be the goal.

[scOtt]

Would like to see them sign another SP also. I am not in favor of sending most of your pitching depth to obtain a 38y.o guy even if he is a knuckleballer and reigning Cy Young. Personally would be happier signing on of the guys mentioned, preferably the one you get with the shortest commitment.

I would also like to see a bat added. Think a MOO is unlikely at this point but would be happy with a guy like Morse who can provide some 1B depth or a guy like Hairston who could play the field if need be and DH.

My biggest concern is seeing the O's continue to build toward a better scouting and player development system. To that end DD has done a great job IMO. I think a lot of people fail to realize that part of the reason Toronto has been able to make the moves they have is the scouting and development system they have in place. That should be our first priority also IMO.

I would like to see another playoff run and am still hopeful. If the take a slight step back record wise and miss the playoffs but make headway in terms of development and scouting that is a trade off I am more than willing to live with for a year or so. Long term stability should be the goal.

Last year kind of fooled everyone. We weren't supposed to be near that good. But we were. To me, 2nd year of DD, this is when we're supposed to approach the playoffs. Easily .500 and pushing for more. Let's face it, Dan inherited a terrible team. And not to demean MacPhail, he left a good foundation to build from. But Dan worked some miracles last year. Or lucked into them. But he has done so many positive things, all thru the organization. Scouting MGon, signing Chen for arb-money, finding McLouth and hopefully Mr. Jackson, 50+ man 25 man roster. AM was so low-key. Dan just makes moves. Throw crap at the wall and see if it sticks.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Last year kind of fooled everyone. We weren't supposed to be near that good. But we were. To me, 2nd year of DD, this is when we're supposed to approach the playoffs. Easily .500 and pushing for more. Let's face it, Dan inherited a terrible team. And not to demean MacPhail, he left a good foundation to build from. But Dan worked some miracles last year. Or lucked into them. But he has done so many positive things, all thru the organization. Scouting MGon, signing Chen for arb-money, finding McLouth and hopefully Mr. Jackson, 50+ man 25 man roster. AM was so low-key. Dan just makes moves. Throw crap at the wall and see if it sticks.

Jackson is going to be money, mark my words. Career .381 OBP vs. LHPs. And before the"SSS!" crowd shows up, it should be noted that he's had well over 700 PAs vs. LHPs:

.283/.381/.436

Another DD gem in the making.

[Bradysburns]

If they get Dickey, it seems like they could be pushing the karma envelope. The baseball gods on the old HD might just zap them with horrible chemistry, or a rash of injuries or something... At some point, the people on the team must feel like, wow, we must have really sucked last year if they're adding all this talent. Maybe I don't really belong here... And then blammo... Jays win 87 games and miss the playoffs. One can always hope.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Last year kind of fooled everyone. We weren't supposed to be near that good. But we were. To me, 2nd year of DD, this is when we're supposed to approach the playoffs. Easily .500 and pushing for more. Let's face it, Dan inherited a terrible team. And not to demean MacPhail, he left a good foundation to build from. But Dan worked some miracles last year. Or lucked into them. But he has done so many positive things, all thru the organization. Scouting MGon, signing Chen for arb-money, finding McLouth and hopefully Mr. Jackson, 50+ man 25 man roster. AM was so low-key. Dan just makes moves. Throw crap at the wall and see if it sticks.

Jackson is going to be money, mark my words. Career .381 OBP vs. LHPs. And before the"SSS!" crowd shows up, it should be noted that he's had well over 700 PAs vs. LHPs:

.283/.381/.436

Another DD gem in the making.

[GoldGlove21]

Last year kind of fooled everyone. We weren't supposed to be near that good. But we were. To me, 2nd year of DD, this is when we're supposed to approach the playoffs. Easily .500 and pushing for more. Let's face it, Dan inherited a terrible team. And not to demean MacPhail, he left a good foundation to build from. But Dan worked some miracles last year. Or lucked into them. But he has done so many positive things, all thru the organization. Scouting MGon, signing Chen for arb-money, finding McLouth and hopefully Mr. Jackson, 50+ man 25 man roster. AM was so low-key. Dan just makes moves. Throw crap at the wall and see if it sticks.

I got to disagree with you here. Who did DD bring in that took us from terrible to great? By my count, he added Chen, Hammel, Ayala, Lindstrom, McClouth, Saunders, Betemit, Flaherty, Nick Johnson and Chavez. Like MacPhail DD did a good deal of his work through trades. I think he brought in solid players, but I think he might have got lucky as well (same with MacPhail's deals).

With that said, I hate giving DD all the credit or a pass moving forward. Much of the heart of the Orioles playoff team came from moves MacPhail made. We fielded a playoff team in 2012, but what does that mean for 2013? Nothing if you consider that other teams are getting better while we are standing pat up to this point. I will like to see how the Orioles do in 2013 and 2014 before I label DD as the savior to MacPhail's "poor product".

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Jackson is going to be money, mark my words. Career .381 OBP vs. LHPs. And before the"SSS!" crowd shows up, it should be noted that he's had well over 700 PAs vs. LHPs:

.283/.381/.436

Another DD gem in the making.

Based on his previous history, his respectable 2012 AAA stats and the role he'll probably end up in as MEAT's platoon partner, I could definitely see him end up as this year's McLouth.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

I got to disagree with you here. Who did DD bring in that took us from terrible to great? By my count, he added Chen, Hammel, Ayala, Lindstrom, McClouth, Saunders, Betemit, Flaherty, Nick Johnson and Chavez. Like MacPhail DD did a good deal of his work through trades. I think he brought in solid players, but I think he might have got lucky as well (same with MacPhail's deals).

With that said, I hate giving DD all the credit or a pass moving forward. Much of the heart of the Orioles playoff team came from moves MacPhail made. We fielded a playoff team in 2012, but what does that mean for 2013? Nothing if you consider that other teams are getting better while we are standing pat up to this point. I will like to see how the Orioles do in 2013 and 2014 before I label DD as the savior to MacPhail's "poor product".

Remove Hammel, Chen, Betemit, and McLouth from the 2012 roster, and you end up with our 15th straight losing season. DD gets a lot of credit for finding value where others did not.

[scOtt]

I got to disagree with you here. Who did DD bring in that took us from terrible to great? By my count, he added Chen, Hammel, Ayala, Lindstrom, McClouth, Saunders, Betemit, Flaherty, Nick Johnson and Chavez. Like MacPhail DD did a good deal of his work through trades. I think he brought in solid players, but I think he might have got lucky as well (same with MacPhail's deals).

With that said, I hate giving DD all the credit or a pass moving forward. Much of the heart of the Orioles playoff team came from moves MacPhail made. We fielded a playoff team in 2012, but what does that mean for 2013? Nothing if you consider that other teams are getting better while we are standing pat up to this point. I will like to see how the Orioles do in 2013 and 2014 before I label DD as the savior to MacPhail's "poor product".

Other teams are getting better, but I think we have a pretty strong team too. Not traditional in the least but ready to go to war.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

Other teams are getting better, but I think we have a pretty strong team too. Not traditional in the least but ready to go to war.

I think this is a good point. The Orioles are a single unit, a team in every sense of the word, and that certainly can make an enormous difference when you're good but not necessarily great- see Baltimore Orioles, 2012. The lack of that mindset, on the other hand, can sink even the most talented collections of players- see Boston Red Sox, 2012.

[25 Nuggets]

I'll be interested to see who the Blue Jays give up for Dickey.

[Guest hutch]

We don't have that. We have Bundy, Gausman, Schoop, and a bunch of low level prospects. I'm positive that part of Duquette's plan is to build a system that will rival the Rays' and Jays' systems.

Duquette has neither money to spend, nor prospect depth to trade from. His main usable assets are some former pitching prospects that have all failed multiple times in the majors, but still have some possible future value. Not much going for him.

This thread has reminded me to trust in DD. He has a plan, but he only has certain assets to work with. He has kicked international scouting into overdrive, and he already has Chen and MiGo (One of my favorites) to show for it.

Hopefully a few of the BMatz/Britton/Jake group get it together this year. If we get them together, add them to Hammel, Chen, MiGo, Tillman, develop Bundy/Gausman, and continue to stock our system, there's no where this team can't go.

I'm hearing good things about Schoop, and him slotting in at third base is not a problem for me at all. I think Flaherty could develop to be the 2B of the future, CD is very young still, and Machado looks great.

We're set up to compete for the next x number of years, and hopefully not blowing money on players like Hamilton will enable us to resign our studs when they hit free agency.

Bottom line: We don't need to blow the farm for Dickey. We've got talent and hopefully are building a nasty farm system, and I'm confident in DD and Buck. Bring on the Jays!

[Snutchy]

Remove Hammel, Chen, Betemit, and McLouth from the 2012 roster, and you end up with our 15th straight losing season. DD gets a lot of credit for finding value where others did not.

Don't forget Teagarden with his bajillion game winning hits.