For What it's worth.....

[Bloopandablast]

Unfortunately, I doubt Belkast's source will allow him to reveal anymore. My guess is the deal would contain Peralta OR Miller and a couple of others.

I think the first guy is "smoke". The question is whether the second guy is "mirrors" or "fire".

[Mike B]

What I have heard the Cubs have offered Gallegher,Veal and Cedeno.

Not enough IMO.

[Harry Carry]

In your opinion what is enough.

[RShack]

If I am not mistaken, just a few years ago Cedeno was one of the top prospects in baseball, as well. Why does no one seem to be interested in getting him? Has he really proven that he can't contribute at the major league level? Maybe I'm wrong but has he really had that large of a sample size of major league at bats that we can predict with certainty that he won't be anything special? Frankly, I was excited when I heard the O's might be getting him in a trade. I think the Cubs would be stupid not to give him another chance. His numbers in the minors were ridiculous. Given, I know nothing about the park he was playing in or anything of the sort.

I agree with you. Maybe Lou hates him for some reason. (With Lou, I don't think it has to be an especially good reason either.) The only single thing I like about trading BRob to the Cubs is getting him as the small-change part of the deal, and seeing if he can replace BRob. Maybe he'll never amount to anything, but the upside seems big and not terribly unlikely.

[Mike B]

Wow... I would love a Peralta and Miller deal over anything else I've heard concerning the Cubs, since half their farm system is supposedly untouchable.

Would do backflips if that was the Indian's deal.

I like Peralta's offensive game. The problem with him is that he is like Tejeda at shortstop. I think he is really a third baseman at this point. I had read that their interest in ROberts is because they wantt him for second allowinfg them to move Cabrera who is a magician with the glove to SS and Peralta to third. Barfield would be a nice throw in as he is young and pretty good on D. Miller, Guittierez, and Barfield. Franklin Guittierez plays left field for us giving us an excellent defensive outfield and all good young hitters. PAyton could go back to the Indians.

[owl]

Tell us again, why isn't Cedeno starting for the Cubs?

Because for better or worse, Lou really likes Theriot. (Unfortunately) his '07 was really seen as a success and because of that he has the job to lose. I think there's almost a consensus that this is the Cubs biggest weakness and many of them would much rather give Cedeno a shot.

[davearm]

I like Peralta's offensive game. The problem with him is that he is like Tejeda at shortstop. I think he is really a third baseman at this point. I had read that their interest in ROberts is because they wantt him for second allowinfg them to move Cabrera who is a magician with the glove to SS and Peralta to third. Barfield would be a nice throw in as he is young and pretty good on D. Miller, Guittierez, and Barfield. Franklin Guittierez plays left field for us giving us an excellent defensive outfield and all good young hitters. PAyton could go back to the Indians.

Gutierrez is even worse than Murton, who 90% of folks here don't see a need for.

[Mike B]

In your opinion what is enough.

I think Roberts gives you the final piece you are looking for. He allows you to move Soriano down in the lineup and makes you a favorite to get to the Series. That should cost you. Pie or Colvin need to be in the deal. Colvin, Cedeno, Gallagher and Veal for Roberts and Payton.

[Harry Carry]

In my opinoin Cedeno has more ability then Theriot.He really played well in winter ball to. He runs better he has a better arm more power and much more range then Theriot.I would rather trade Theriot then Cedeno thats just my opinion.Theriot is what people call a grinder he gets most out of his ability and thats why Lou loves the kid.All Ronnie needs is consistent playing time and thats why I hope he goes to you guys so he could prove he has the talent to play everyday in the big leagues all he needs is playing time to grow and he is still only 25.

[Harry Carry]

I would make that deal right now Colvin,Gallagher.Veal and Cedeno for Roberts and Payton.Like I said its time to win it all.

[Terps23]

As far as I know,there are no Indians scouts at your ST games,only Cubs scouts and next week Orioles scouts will be at Cubs ST games

That may just mean that the Indians offer is set with the players offered, whereas the Cubs offer may be three specific guys and one player out of maybe three or four that we get to choose from.

If we go with the Cubs offer it would make sense to scout out those three or four players we can choose from and find the best fit. If the Indians offer is, say, Peralta and Miller, we don't have a need to scout out those guys.

[hoosiers]

Gutierrez is even worse than Murton, who 90% of folks here don't see a need for.

This is not true at all.

If you line up their stats by age, it's simply not a true statement.

You are on fire tonight, Dave. First, it's nonsense Cedeno is a backup, when he is. Now this untruth.

[davearm]

This is not true at all.

If you line up their stats by age, it's simply not a true statement.

You are on fire tonight, Dave. First, it's nonsense Cedeno is a backup, when he is. Now this untruth.

What's nonsense is that the O's should/would not want a particular player because he's a backup on his current team. (And more to the point, that the O's should/would not want Cubs' backups -- Cedeno, Murton, Patterson -- but should be all over Indians' backups -- Marte, Barfield, Gutierrez.)

Cedeno is head and shoulders better than any other MI the O's could put at SS or 2B.

Murton is immediately the O's 3rd or 4th best hitter.

Patterson is a better leadoff candidate than anyone else the O's have.

Viewing these players' values based on how they stack up in the Cubs' system, and not how they would stack up if they were in the O's system, is utterly foolish.

And give me Murton over Gutierrez any day.

[hoosiers]

What's nonsense is that the O's should/would not want a particular player because he's a backup on his current team. (And more to the point, that the O's should/would not want Cubs' backups -- Cedeno, Murton, Patterson -- but should be all over Indians' backups -- Marte, Barfield, Gutierrez.)

Cedeno is head and shoulders better than any other MI the O's could put at SS or 2B.

Murton is immediately the O's 3rd or 4th best hitter.

Patterson is a better leadoff candidate than anyone else the O's have.

Viewing these players' values based on how they stack up in the Cubs' system, and not how they would stack up if they were in the O's system, is utterly foolish.

And give me Murton over Gutierrez any day.

Don't get mad at me for your posting mistakes.

Line up the Murton/Gutierrez comps by age and explain how much worse Gutierrez is.

Tell me again why the Cubs don't start Cedeno? He's not good enough.

[hoosiers]

Gutierrez is even worse than Murton, who 90% of folks here don't see a need for.

I posted this at least a few weeks ago:

Well, according to baseball reference, Murton has produced an OPS+ of 132, 104 and 100 in his age 23-25 seasons. Gutierrez is a year younger and had an OPS+ of 67 and 103 in his 23 and 24 seasons. In other words, with both guys getting about 250 at-bats in 2007, Gutierrez had a higher OPS+ while a year younger.

Gutierrez was the Indians sixth rated prospect in 2006 according to BA. BA noted that Gutierrez "lost so much development time" to injuries during his rise in the minors and also said Gutierrez was the "best defensive outfielder" in the system according to Cleveland officials. BA noted that Gutierrez had the range to play CF in 2006.

Any assertion that Murton is a "better hitter" is open to question, IMO, while Gutierrez seems to be much better defensively and very possibly the better all-around player. One question is whether Gutierrez can provide such production over 500 at-bats. Murton had that great half season in 2005 and may have more offensive upside, but has not shown that for two seasons. To date, Murton has shown a much better w/k ratio.