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Drum beat a little louder for Cubs deal

wildcard

By wildcard
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section18 All-Star

section18

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Something has apparently caused this trade to hit a major snag. Is there division among the front office people and ownership? There is no way we would have negotiated for over three months with a team without reaching an agreement or basically just told the Cubs there will not be a deal because we don't match up with you. There has been no statement like that from either side.

If we are trying to squeeze the Cubs for a triple AAA fifth player in a 5 for 2 or 5 for 1 deal I think we are making a mistake. We know that Angelos likes Roberts as do most Oriole fans. I have had mixed feelings about this trade as well but agree with our rebuilding effort and will trade Roberts for the right package. The right package should include, as I have stated on here numerous times, at least two major league players that can start for the Orioles right away like Pie and Marshall. The others should be triple AAA level and double AA level especially if we are including Payton.

The latest rumored proposals of Gallagher (already sent down), Cedeno (rumored to be released soon -hitting questionable) and Veal (unproven with mixed reviews) does not work. If you choose between Patterson ( mixed reviews also about defense and hitting) and Cedeno who do you take? We got two starters/regulars back in each of the Bedard and Tejada deals along with others. Jones and Sherrill (Seattle) and Scott, Albers and Sarfate (Houston). Five ML ready players so far for two of our players. I don't think it is unreasonable to get 2 ML ready players back from the Cubs if we complete a trade with them. Some might argue Cedeno or Patterson and Gallagher can be regulars with us. It's possible. Am I impressed with the current rumored package coming back from the Cubs? Yes and No. I think Pie and Marshall need to be in the deal along with Patterson or Cedeno and Ceda or Marquis. I would be happy with a 4 for 2 deal of Pie, Marshall, Cedeno and Marquis for Roberts and Payton with the Cubs paying part of Marquis salary.

Marquis would be our #1, with Guthrie #2, Cabrera #3. Marshall #4 and Loewen #5. They probably would want to alternate a right hander and a left hander in this mix with Marshall or Loewen being #3 and Cabrera #4 with the other left hander #5. Trachsel can be insurance if Loewen falters and could be a long man in the pen if needed.

If this deal doesn't happen before Opening Day it will sometime in April. AM was being cautious about seeing these players perform in ST before making the deal. I say it will happen unless the Cubs panic and lower their standards getting Lopez as insurance in case DeRosa has recurring issues.

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zff4 Major Leaguer

zff4

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They also have to look out for what's best for the franchise.

Consider that what's "fair" or "good enough" in the NL Central may not be in a club's long term interest in the AL East. If we were in the NL this deal will probably be done, but we're not. AM needs the offer to make sense in the context of our division - we're painfully aware of what "good enough" in the AL East means.

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FO2020 AAA

FO2020

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Actually, it appears that you do agree with my assessment. I didn't mention Pie.

I was suggesting that if the 4th player were Ceda or Colvin, I believe it would have worked. Cedeno, Gallagher, Veal, and Ceda/Colvin. Is that overpaying? I don't know, maybe. The point is if Hendry believes that the Cubs have a better shot at returning to the playoffs and advancing in them with Roberts than without him and if whether the inclusion of a Ceda or Colvin as the fourth name in the package is the maker or breaker of the deal, is hanging on to Ceda or Colvin worth it? That's the real question, IMO.

No, actually I don't agree. Because you said that Cub fans don't want Hendry to spend minor league players to land a top leadoff man. And the only players that I have really heard Cub fans saying they WOULD NOT trade is Pie and Hill (both major leaguers, not minor leaguers). I know people have said they wouldn't trade Ceda, Veal AND Colvin, meaning, all three for Roberts. I'm of that opinion too, I wouldn't trade all three, or overpay with prospects. But if AM is saying, Ceda or no deal, and he'd take Gallagher, Cedeno, EPatt and Ceda, Veal OR Colvin, I would do it.

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Wingman AA

Wingman

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Before we all say it's over...

Please remember how many of us were "sure" we weren't going to sign Wieters either.

I'm not saying I think the trade is going to happen, but until the season starts I'm not going to leave the door open...

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Cubsfan Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Cubsfan

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:rolleyes: The difference between the two arguments is that the Cubs offer is a reasonable offer and the other is a deal that no person in the world will make.

I think the Orioles have seriously overvalued Roberts in this situation. In my opinion there are only 7 outcomes that can come of this decision.

1. A contending team has an injury at 2B and trades for Roberts

2. Somehow convince Roberts that the Orioles will be competitive in his lifetime and resign him

3. Let him walk as a free agent and maybe get 2 picks for him.

4. Roberts gets injured and his stock plummets.

5. Roberts declines and his stock plummets.

6. Roberts is filthy and his FA asking price skyrockets to somewhere around 5 years at 12 million a pop.

7. Roberts stays the same and one of Sean Gallagher, Donnie Veal, or Ronny Cedeno turns into a serious impact player.

You could insert the point about the Cubs players in any point. I for one am not salty about not getting him. We have bigger needs and to all the people who are saying he fits the need of what we missed in the playoffs last year you must not have been watching because Ted Lilly and Rich Hill sure didnt keep us in games. Last time I checked Brian Roberts wasnt a top notch starter.

I hope he has a good year for yall! I will be watching closely becuase I have him on a lot of my fantasy teams!! :)

To answer your outcomes:

1. This is a possibility, but not very likely since 2B can usually be covered with an internal option on a contending team. (i.e. Ojeda for Hudson)

2. I would think this is the most unlikely since Roberts has hinted that he would like to play for a winner. The O's have a long road to go especially in the AL East with the free spending Red Sox and Yankees.

3. Possible, but I would think he would be traded before his contract expires.

4. Always a possibility, but he has been healthy in the past.

5. I don't see a dramatic downturn, since he has been a solid, consistent player for most of his career.

6. Not likely. His numbers have always been good and there's no reason to think that they will become phenomenal at this stage.

7. Roberts will probably stay the same, but Cedeno won't get the chance to prove himself with the Cubs. I think Gallagher and Veal will become decent major league pitchers, but I'm not sure I would label either one an "impact" player.

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Number5 Hangout Grand Counsel

Number5

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No, actually I don't agree. Because you said that Cub fans don't want Hendry to spend minor league players to land a top leadoff man. And the only players that I have really heard Cub fans saying they WOULD NOT trade is Pie and Hill (both major leaguers, not minor leaguers). I know people have said they wouldn't trade Ceda, Veal AND Colvin, meaning, all three for Roberts. I'm of that opinion too, I wouldn't trade all three, or overpay with prospects. But if AM is saying, Ceda or no deal, and he'd take Gallagher, Cedeno, EPatt and Ceda, Veal OR Colvin, I would do it.

Good, we are in total agreement. Hendry should have made the offer. I'm not really sure what you are arguing about.

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WebLink21 Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

WebLink21

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I don't want them all to leave. Just the ones who spout off dumb crap like "I hope you enjoy last place finishes" and "Marshall and Cedeno is more than fair value for BRob."

Agreed. I should have clarified. There are some that I have grown to really enjoy reading on here.

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