Strong Dominican presence in O's Camp

[Number5]

I'm not sure that I understand the relevance of an American player's ancestry.

[FlipTheBird]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

In 2011 before Dan took over the O's had 4 Dominican players in ST.  This year they have 10.   9 out of the 10 have been acquired in the last two years.   You say its a coincidence.    OK...............

It's absolutely a coincidence. You're reaching on an epic scale. You ignored CoC's legitimate questions.

[FlipTheBird]

5 minutes ago, wildcard said:

My opinion see Dan is just try to find talent that is undervalued and over the last two years he see Dominicans as fitting that model.

 

9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And do we know that is actually the case?  Did he avoid them in Montreal and Boston?

Or is this an ownership driven directive?

I can't give you argument any weight, WC, when your response to three actual questions was just to restate your completely baseless opinion as if it were fact.

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, Number5 said:

I'm not sure that I understand the relevance of an American player's ancestry.

I don't know what you are referring to.

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, FlipTheBird said:

 

I can't give you argument any weight, WC, when your response to three actual questions was just to restate your completely baseless opinion as if it were fact.

OK

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't know what you are referring to.

I don't remember this many Dominican players being in the O's Camp before.  Its a hot bed of baseball.

Ubaldo Jimenez, Welington Castillo, Jayson Aquino, Jesus Liranzo, Gabriel Ynao, Aneury Tavarez, Richard Rodriguez,Yermin Mercedes, Audry Perez, Francisco Pena and of course Manny Machado's parents are Dominican and he is playing on the Dominican National Team.

Other Nationality  on the roster

Hyun Soo Kim - Korea

Vidal Nuno - Born in California but of Mexico heritage

Jonathan Schoop - Curacao

Daniel Alvarez, Robert Andino (born in Florida) - Cuba

Anthony Santander - Venezuela

Jason Garcia was both born in New York.  Does anyone know his heritage?

[FlipTheBird]

5 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't know what you are referring to.

I believe he's referencing Jason Garcia... who you're presumably counting as a distinctly Latin player (in the same vein as say, a Wellington Castillo), despite his having been born in the Bronx and raised entirely in the United States.

He certainly still has Latin ancestry, and it could well be a part of his home culture (I honestly have no idea what Jason Garcia does off the baseball field), but he's not in the same basket as a guy that grew up in the Dominican and is playing baseball here now.

[Number5]

3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't know what you are referring to.

You listed several American players with ancestral roots in certain Latin American countries.  That has nothing to do with whether they are domestic or international players. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, FlipTheBird said:

I believe he's referencing Jason Garcia... who you're presumably counting as a distinctly Latin player (in the same vein as say, a Wellington Castillo), despite his having been born in the Bronx and raised entirely in the United States.

He certainly still has Latin ancestry, and it could well be a part of his home culture (I honestly have no idea what Jason Garcia does off the baseball field), but he's not in the same basket as a guy that grew up in the Dominican and is playing baseball here now.

I have a friend who is fourth generation Mexican-American.  Her granddaughter has more ancestors born US citizens than I do. 

[FlipTheBird]

Just now, Number5 said:

You listed several American players with ancestral roots in certain Latin American countries.  That has nothing to do with whether they are domestic or international players. 

This.

And, if we're going to talk diversity and the O's, didn't we (very briefly, because none of them were very good) have a United Nations of sorts in our starting rotation in the early 2000s? Bedard, Bruce Chen, Damian Moss for a hot minute (ugh), Daniel Cabrera, etc.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

This.

And, if we're going to talk diversity and the O's, didn't we (very briefly, because none of them were very good) have a United Nations of sorts in our starting rotation in the early 2000s? Bedard, Bruce Chen, Damian Moss for a hot minute (ugh), Daniel Cabrera, etc.

Guthrie is of Japanese ancestry.

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, FlipTheBird said:

I believe he's referencing Jason Garcia... who you're presumably counting as a distinctly Latin player (in the same vein as say, a Wellington Castillo), despite his having been born in the Bronx and raised entirely in the United States.

He certainly still has Latin ancestry, and it could well be a part of his home culture (I honestly have no idea what Jason Garcia does off the baseball field), but he's not in the same basket as a guy that grew up in the Dominican and is playing baseball here now.

I started this a thread just looking at where foreign players in camp are from.  I didn't know where Garcia was from but his name is Latin.  Jason Emilio Garcia.  Just was curious.

[Frobby]

28 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And do we know that is actually the case?  Did he avoid them in Montreal and Boston?

Well, he signed a kid named Vladimir Guerrero while he was in Montreal....

But really, it's not whether you sign Dominican kids, it's whether you sign the ones that require large bonuses.    We have two teams in the Dominican Summer League, staffed with mostly Dominican players.   But when you scan the roster, they skew much older than some of the other teams, which tells you we've been going for the cheaper, late-developing guys.    While I'm not following all the details of the CBA, I think the international spending caps will level the playing field somewhat.  

[PaulFolk]

31 minutes ago, wildcard said:

This is a discussion about whether Dan is finding Dominican players as an under valued commodity.   Its not political.  There is not reason to be uncomfortable.

As already mentioned by RZNJ, Dan does not like sign 16 year Latin players to bonuses.  He likes to seeing them develop some and then picking them up.   O's scouts still identify players are  talented.

But why would these players be an undervalued commodity simply because of their nationality? There's no other common thread that links them. Their nationality is irrelevant to their baseball skills. It's like saying, "Oh, the Orioles have a lot of players with blue eyes. Clearly Duquette sees blue-eyed players as an undervalued commodity."

[Number5]

We're all very different people.  We're not Watusi, we're not Spartans, we're Americans.  With a capital "A", huh?  And you know what that means?  Do you?  It means that our ancestors got kicked out of every decent country in the world.