Home runs while batting 9th

[Frobby]

David Laurila’s Sunday column for Fangraphs is always a must-read for me.  Today he had this tidbit:

“Mike Bordick and Rick Dempsey are the all-time leaders in home runs while batting ninth, with 42 each.”

41 of Dempsey’s 42 homers while bating 9th came as an Oriole, including 10 a season from 1984 to 1986.    33 of Bordick’s 42 came as an O.

Dempsey hit 96 career homers (75 for the Birds), Bordick 91 (61).

 

[Sports Guy]

And then they went on to but be subpar analysts…coincidence?

[spiritof66]

2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

And then they went on to but be subpar analysts…coincidence?

Palmer hit only 3 HRS, all when batting ninth, so the HRs when batting ninth/analyst quality correlation holds up there, as far as I'm concerned

[Oriole1940]

It would be interesting to know how many HRs the opposition has hit vs. Oriole pitching  in the 9th inning.  Maybe just me, but I always scream at the Oriole pitching when the 8th or 9th batters in the lineup get on base vs, them.  It is like they do not know they are supposed to get those guys out, but seems like they pitch  to  them as if they were the cleanup hitter and walk waaaay too many of them.    I know that with pitchers not batting in the AL, the 9th batter in the lineup is usually better than back  in the day.  But still, they are batting there in the lineup for a reason.  

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, Oriole1940 said:

It would be interesting to know how many HRs the opposition has hit vs. Oriole pitching  in the 9th inning.  Maybe just me, but I always scream at the Oriole pitching when the 8th or 9th batters in the lineup get on base vs, them.  It is like they do not know they are supposed to get those guys out, but seems like they pitch  to  them as if they were the cleanup hitter and walk waaaay too many of them.    I know that with pitchers not batting in the AL, the 9th batter in the lineup is usually better than back  in the day.  But still, they are batting there in the lineup for a reason.  

Last year the O’s yielded 18 homers to the 9th hitter in the lineup, 2nd highest in the league (Cleveland).   At least they allowed fewer homers there than at any other spot.  They allowed 40 homers to the opponents’ cleanup hitter.

[Moose Milligan]

It figures the Orioles have the two all-time best at something that's completely meaningless.

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

It figures the Orioles have the two all-time best at something that's completely meaningless.

For bad hitters, they were pretty good.   And played on some good teams.  

[LA2]

This is reaching pretty far back, but the #9 hitter I remember dreading was Butch Hobson, who played the majority of his games (1975-1982) as a third baseman for the Red Sox.

I just looked up the stats: batting ninth, Hobson had career totals in 667 at-bats of 26 homers, 26 doubles, 8 triples, and 123 RBIs. The slash line was .274 / .334 / .454 / .788. He also batted 7th and 8th a lot (211 and 192 games, respectively), but the fact that he batted ninth so often shows how strong the Boston lineup of that time was.

 

[Frobby]

I wouldn’t have remembered that he batted 9th that much.  Looking back at his BB-ref page, I was surprised to see that he was a career -0.1 rWAR, 91 OPS+ player.  I guess he’s one of those guys whose stats looked good because he played in Fenway, but who really wasn’t that good.   But I remember him as a pretty solid player.  

[DrungoHazewood]

Former Oriole Charles Johnson had 534 PAs in the #9 spot and OPS'd .955, which is the highest 9th place OPS (min 500 PAs) since 1900.

Wes Farrell, the pitcher who should have been put in the Hall of Fame instead of his brother Rick, had an .811 OPS in 1247 PAs hitting 9th.  4th-best on the list.  His managers apparently batted him 9th by tradition, as there were years like 1931 when he had the highest OPS on his team but almost exclusively hit 9th.  In '31 he had a team-best .994 OPS and was third on the Indians with 9 homers in just 128 PAs but batted 9th in 125 of those PAs.

Bill Mueller had a .948 OPS in 794 PAs batting 8th.  In the old, old days it was customary to bat the catcher 8th, and HOFer Gabby Hartnett had 1630 PAs in the eighth spot with an .898 OPS.  Roy Campanella hit 8th almost 1000 times with an .873.

[LA2]

Whenever Mark Belanger batted first, which he did in 144 games, it sort of felt like we had a #10 hitter in the lineup.

[LA2]

On 1/15/2022 at 6:56 AM, Frobby said:

I wouldn’t have remembered that he batted 9th that much.  Looking back at his BB-ref page, I was surprised to see that he was a career -0.1 rWAR, 91 OPS+ player.  I guess he’s one of those guys whose stats looked good because he played in Fenway, but who really wasn’t that good.   But I remember him as a pretty solid player.  

Yes, I recall feeling back then that he faded quickly. Two impactful seasons at an early age and then crippling injuries. I remember that at a certain point he just couldn't make the throw to first anymore.

[jabba72]

45 minutes ago, LA2 said:

Whenever Mark Belanger batted first, which he did in 144 games, it sort of felt like we had a #10 hitter in the lineup.

Kind of defies logic why he was batting 1st. I'd like to know Earls thinking on doing this 144 games, if those took place in Baltimore. 

[DrungoHazewood]

16 hours ago, jabba72 said:

Kind of defies logic why he was batting 1st. I'd like to know Earls thinking on doing this 144 games, if those took place in Baltimore. 

He batted leadoff:

21 games in 1969, and had a .333 OBP in the role.  That was also the year he had a .351 OBP overall.
14 times in 1970, and actually had a .411 OBP.  Although his overall that year was just .303.
10 times in '71.
13 in '72. Twice in '73.
17 times in '74 despite an overall .598 OPS.  Handful of times in '75-76.
Never in '77.
24 times in '78, with an overall .213/.299/.250 line. Al Bumbry was hurt most of the year.
Just a handful of times the rest of his career.

So I'd say it justified in '69, perhaps even in 1970 because of his performance in prior year.  But it's hard to imagine many cases where he was a reasonable choice to lead off after that.  In 1978 when he led off 24 times they had 10 other players with 100+ PAs and a higher OBP.  He had 130 PAs batting 1st or 2nd in '78 with an overall OPS of .549.
 

[Just Regular]

1 hour ago, DrungoHazewood said:

So I'd say it justified in '69, perhaps even in 1970 because of his performance in prior year.

Goes to Belanger B-Ref.

1969-70 = age 25-26....check!

Though... in looking more closely at the whole career, he actually had a better run from 29-34.   Was 1976 Earl's Go-Go year?   That was a few years before my earliest memories of the '79 Series and that bad man Tekulve.   In 1976, Belanger at 32 attempted 44 steals (27/17), OPS+'d 100 and had a 6.5 WAR season.