The Final Straw? Elias to Trade Mancini

[Hank Scorpio]

5 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

If we can get anything for Mancini we absolutely should. I love the guy but he is more of a liability to the rebuild than anything. 

HOW DARE YOU!?!?!??!! 

[Ohfan67]

1 hour ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

We have become the joke of mlb and just a pass through for winning franchises, makes me sick. Mancini is a leader and role model for fans of all ages. Mancini is about more than baseball to me. 

Have become? Where were you from 1998 - 2011? Do you remember how the organization treated Davey Johnson? We don't even know the contract basics of Hyde and Elias. The Orioles haven't been a model franchise in decades. Like before a lot of posters were born. They have been an oddly and poorly run franchise since at least the late 90s. They even screwed up starting their own sports channel. We are fans of a pretty pathetic sports franchise. 

 

But trying to trade Mancini is not a bad move. The team already has the younger, cheaper version of Mancini. His name is Mountcastle. They are completely redundant. Mancini's health history/feel good story is the only reason the O's didn't part ways with him in the offseason (IMO). You can be mad at the O's, but they have guaranteed that Mancini will make at least 7.375 million dollars in 2022. By the way, I think there's a very good chance that Mancini will be mediocre this year, no one will want to trade for him, and he will spend the entire year with the Orioles.  If by some miracle Mancini replicates his 2019 season, then the O's will get something decent for Mancini and Trey will get a decent contract from someone next offseason. But I think that is really unlikely. 

[Tony-OH]

Sure, will the contingent of fans that love the players be upset a bit, sure, but will an unprecedented backlash occur that cause fans to turn on Elias, I highly doubt that.

Whatever fans that are left are diehards and honestly, giving Trey a chance to play for a contending team while he's still got a chance to be somewhat productive is a good thing. 

Right now, I'm not trading him unless we can get at least a decent prospect (preferably a starting pitching prospect) because we don't have any one that can replicate his potential offense at DH until Stowers or for some reason Diaz or Neustrom look ready. At that point, assuming there are no injuries (and we're talking about Hays and Santander in corner outfield positions) we will need his PAs and then it time to kinda move him to a contender for whatever we can get. 

The best case scenario is Mancini hits really well and a contender suddenly needs a bat. Universal DH opens up 15 more potential jobs for him so that's actually a good thing for his value.

While I still think going to arbitration with him is silly, I'm assuming making him as cheap as possible makes him even more attractive on the trad market.

At the end of the day, it's very doubtful Mancini is on this team past 2022. 

He's a team leader and has been a good Orioles on some bad teams, but he has no future role on this team with his skillset.

 

[JimGinSP]

IDK, I watched that O’s Yankees exhibition game the other night and it looked like Mancini and Odor (our veteran influences) each needed a support dog on the play they botched in right!

(sorry ….. too soon?)

This RF redux is not helping Mancini’s trade value.

[Sports Guy]

Trey isn’t the type of player that will be more worth more in July than he is now.

Tanner Scott is that type of guy.

I think you could get a few pitchers like we got in the Bundy deal and hope they develop into something more.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Hank Scorpio said:

What did you think was going to happen?

Should we give him a 7 year, $161MM deal?

No, no, no... it should be like the old days when a player was bound by the reserve clause forever.  If Trey was a 1966 Oriole they'd renew his contract at $22k a year every year until he wasn't as good as the next guy up from the minors and then they'd release him. 

[DrungoHazewood]

45 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Trey isn’t the type of player that will be more worth more in July than he is now.

He could be.  He's coming off a so-so season, and it's possible some team really needs a DH or 1B in July.  So if he's OPSing .875 and someone has a big hole he could be worth more than the current Trey Mancini who just had a year OPSing .758.  But no guarantees.

[Too Tall]

42 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Trey isn’t the type of player that will be more worth more in July than he is now.

Tanner Scott is that type of guy.

I think you could get a few pitchers like we got in the Bundy deal and hope they develop into something more.

I agree. As much as I like Trey, now versus later makes sense if the return is acceptable to Elias. Plus, it potentially opens another spot for one of our young position players and creates more flexibility. But if it is seen as a salary dump, this Board will go Ape and rightfully so. 

[DrungoHazewood]

1 hour ago, Ohfan67 said:

Have become? Where were you from 1998 - 2011? Do you remember how the organization treated Davey Johnson? We don't even know the contract basics of Hyde and Elias. The Orioles haven't been a model franchise in decades. Like before a lot of posters were born. They have been an oddly and poorly run franchise since at least the late 90s. They even screwed up starting their own sports channel. We are fans of a pretty pathetic sports franchise.

I'd argue that they haven't been consistently well run since the 1970s.  We've discussed recently the fact that they got essentially nothing at all out of the 1980-86 drafts, and that was also the period where the only free agents they'd sign were 33-year-olds who'd been stars five years ago.  The Camden Yards money papered over a lot of flaws in the 90s, and Duquette's and Buck's creativity won some games in the 2012-16 timeframe.  But the franchise has had some serious holes continuously since the early 80s.

[LookinUp]

The concern I have is that the O's trade him now not based on his trade value, but based on his salary.

If his trade value isn't much now, they'll likely still trade him. I'd prefer if the lack of good offers (an assumption) would mean we held onto him and let him try to build value. 

 

[Sports Guy]

13 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

He could be.  He's coming off a so-so season, and it's possible some team really needs a DH or 1B in July.  So if he's OPSing .875 and someone has a big hole he could be worth more than the current Trey Mancini who just had a year OPSing .758.  But no guarantees.

Ehh, I tend to doubt it.  Relatively one dimensional players don’t usually carry much value as a rental.

[Too Tall]

1 minute ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I'd argue that they haven't been consistently well run since the 1970s.  We've discussed recently the fact that they got essentially nothing at all out of the 1980-86 drafts, and that was also the period where the only free agents they'd sign were 33-year-olds who'd been stars five years ago.  The Camden Yards money papered over a lot of flaws in the 90s, and Duquette's and Buck's creativity won some games in the 2012-16 timeframe.  But the franchise has had some serious holes continuously since the early 80s.

Spot on. I'm sorry some of you - many of you - didn't live through the 60's to 80's. That, and a few years after have had to sustain me.  I remember when----------. Probably will never see a sustained period of competitiveness like that again. It was special. It's been hard staying an Oriole fan since then because the contrast has been so dramatic.  But I have and here we go into another year.

[AlbNYfan]

Like most journalists Connolly is just trying to get some attention. Mancini is certainly a great story. He got the Comeback Award his first at bat of the season and was mentioned almost daily by baseball broadcaster. I was surprised he did so well and expected the long season to wear him down more than it did. I also believe he is likely to have a better season this year, another year away from the disease. I don't know what he should be paid, but you have to imagine his agent suggested this might be a good time (emotionally) to get that extra million, a million he'd never have to fight for again. As far as trades go, there is no one that important currently on this roster from last year that is an untouchable. I like Mullins a lot, but I have my doubts he'll come close to last year's accomplishments. Mancini and Mountcastle are redundant pieces, trade one. Orioles a laughing stock? Baltimore and a half a dozen other teams are just fillers for the big name teams, just like 80% of the minor leaguers are fillers for real MLB hopefuls. I hope for the best...at least I  have been lucky enough to have seen some greatness (and Yankees and Red Sox as bottom dwellers).

[spiritof66]

27 minutes ago, Too Tall said:

I agree. As much as I like Trey, now versus later makes sense if the return is acceptable to Elias. Plus, it potentially opens another spot for one of our young position players and creates more flexibility. But if it is seen as a salary dump, this Board will go Ape and rightfully so. 

A trade of Trey will have to be seen, and in fact will be, at least in part a salary dump: the Orioles will be removing their highest-salary player from their roster and probably would be replacing him on that roster with a guy making the minimum MLB salary. There may be other motivations. The trade may be in the team's best interest. It may be in Trey's best interests. But when the team with MLB's lowest payroll (or almost lowest payroll) reduces that payroll by over 10 percent, of course that will be, and will be seen as, a cost-saving measure.

Unlike most of the Orioles' moves, a trade of Trey would be noticed not by just this Board, or just by Oriole fans. The extremism of the Orioles' salary reduction measures has caught the attention and led to a negative reaction by baseball fans generally, of the players' union and individual players, and no doubt other teams. Those instances of cost-cutting involved the extent of the Orioles' holding down payroll by loading their MLB roster with low-salaried players. If the Orioles trade one of their very few well known and celebrated players for marginal major leaguers or prospects, that will be noticed across the baseball world. And whatever factors induce the Orioles to trade Mancini, I wouldn't expect the baseball world to see that trade as an effort to improve the team or create roster flexibility.

[Frobby]

Terrible thread title.   It made it seem like there was actual information that a trade was imminent.   Then I saw it was a reference to Dan Connolly’s half-baked speculation.  

I’d have no problem whatsoever if they trade Mancini, though if it was a pure salary dump I’d be upset.