Your guess on Tuesday's starter

[LA2]

5 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Yeah but the don’t want to use them in irregular roles coming out of the pen. If Diplan gets sent up and down it’s not as big of a deal. He is basically pitching in mop up duty.
 

I think this is right. Besides DiPlan had a 0.00 ERA through his first seven appearances last season and maybe they're hoping for similar results this year until Grayson's imminent call-up and Kremer's later, if his current trend continues.

[LA2]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

But that’s the point.  We don’t need irregular roles.  We don’t need this AAA shuttle bs.  It’s not great roster management.  It’s just screwing with guys who should be up here to stay, at least stay for a long look.

Elias isn’t being clever here.

That didn't work last season. Although I agree if it's Grayson you're talking about.

[eddie83]

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

But that’s the point.  We don’t need irregular roles.  We don’t need this AAA shuttle bs.  It’s not great roster management.  It’s just screwing with guys who should be up here to stay, at least stay for a long look.

Elias isn’t being clever here.

The top 6 arms in the pen all have ERA’s under 3. Four are under 2. Elias is taking advantage of these pitching roster rules that keep getting extended. He is just tying to eat thru some innings sending guys up and down. 
 

Overall the pen has been good. These guys aren’t the reason why some others haven’t been called up yet. 
 

If MLB ever stops extended the deadline some of these guys will no longer have the opportunities.  

[Orioles0615]

7 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

The top 6 arms in the pen all have ERA’s under 3. Four are under 2. Elias is taking advantage of these pitching roster rules that keep getting extended. He is just tying to eat thru some innings sending guys up and down. 
 

Overall the pen has been good. These guys aren’t the reason why some others haven’t been called up yet. 
 

If MLB ever stops extended the deadline some of these guys will no longer have the opportunities.  

If only he could have done something to avoid this...

[eddie83]

20 minutes ago, Orioles0615 said:

If only he could have done something to avoid this...

Elias will soon be entering a different stage. Expectations are rising and those apply to him as well. 

[sportsfan8703]

This is just how the MLB is now. Buck and DD were ahead of the game a bit with the Norfolk shuttle. Why have a set bullpen?  Makes no sense. Why not have a set of top relievers to use in high/medium leverage roles and then rotate through guys to pitch in low leverage spots?  
 

Also, I have no problems with Baumann and Kremer cutting their teeth on the B side of the pen up here. Learn how to get MLB hitters out in short outings without worrying about throw more than two pitches. Just like Akin has. 

[LTO's]

22 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

The top 6 arms in the pen all have ERA’s under 3. Four are under 2. Elias is taking advantage of these pitching roster rules that keep getting extended. He is just tying to eat thru some innings sending guys up and down. 

I'm surprised people are failing to grasp how this works. You can look around MLB and the Orioles are far from the only team doing this. There wasn't a full spring training and injuries are a big concern. Many managers, including managers on contending hopefuls, have raised concerns about how they are going to eat innings while keeping arms fresh. Part of this is utilizing options/waivers and giving innings to AAAA guys that you don't expect to factor into long term plans.  I mean, the Yankees have Manny Banuelos on their active roster right now....

[Sports Guy]

Just now, LTO's said:

I'm surprised people are failing to grasp how this works. You can look around MLB and the Orioles are far from the only team doing this. There wasn't a full spring training and injuries are a big concern. Many managers, including managers on contending hopefuls, have raised concerns about how they are going to eat innings while keeping arms fresh. Part of this is utilizing options/waivers and giving innings to AAAA guys that you don't expect to factor into long term plans.  I mean, the Yankees have Manny Banuelos on their active roster right now....

Lol. I love when people post stuff like this and because we disagree it means we don’t get it. How ridiculously ignorant.

 

[sportsfan8703]

1 hour ago, eddie83 said:

 

Baker went 2.1 IP scoreless in his start at ST Louis. 

[NCRaven]

11 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Lol. I love when people post stuff like this and because we disagree it means we don’t get it. How ridiculously ignorant.

 

It's really not a matter of agree or disagree.  If you disagree with how the Orioles are managing bullpen arms, given the rules on options, then you're disagreeing with how nearly all ML GM's are managing their bullpens.  It's fine to say you think baseball is missing the boat on a particular issue.  If you're Billy Beane and discover an undervalued talent, you get a movie.  I just don't think you're getting a movie.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, NCRaven said:

It's really not a matter of agree or disagree.  If you disagree with how the Orioles are managing bullpen arms, given the rules on options, then you're disagreeing with how nearly all ML GM's are managing their bullpens.  It's fine to say you think baseball is missing the boat on a particular issue.  If you're Billy Beane and discover an undervalued talent, you get a movie.  I just don't think you're getting a movie.

I can’t speak to what other teams are doing because I don’t know about all of their arms.

But I can say that jerking around a guy like Vespi, who has very little(if anything) to prove in the minors is wrong..especially on a team that isn’t good and needs to see these types of guys pitch.

The Os are bringing up guys with no hope for the future when all they have to do is stick with guys that do.  
 

If you don’t have those guys, so be it..but the Os do now and they shouldn’t be jerking those guys around.

[LTO's]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Lol. I love when people post stuff like this and because we disagree it means we don’t get it. How ridiculously ignorant.

 

Well, it really seems like you don't get it. Either that, or you think you are better at roster management than teams that have won 90+ games for multiple years in a row. Like I said, pretty much every team in the league including the very best, have mop up guys that come up and take the place of more promising pitchers with options for a short while. It's better in the long run for everyone. 

[NCRaven]

18 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

But I can say that jerking around a guy like Vespi, who has very little(if anything) to prove in the minors is wrong..especially on a team that isn’t good and needs to see these types of guys pitch.

The Os are bringing up guys with no hope for the future when all they have to do is stick with guys that do.  

I don't think Vespi has been jerked around.  Handling pure relievers is different than handling starters.  As long as Vespi is being used in the role he's used to, it really doesn't matter whether it's in Norfolk or Baltimore. 

And, if they're trying to optimize their use of guys that aren't long-term pieces, but offer short-term value in 2022, so be it.  Those guys are thrilled to get their cup of coffee.  If they get enough service for life-time healthcare and a pension, even better.  I doubt the Logan Gillaspie's of the world mind coming to the bigs for a game or two.  And, I'm sure that they know why they're there.

[Just Regular]

Here's the thing about getting Rays good, or better than Rays good.

Here are some pitchers I hope pitch big chunks of innings for the Early Adley teams.   Grayson Rodriguez, DL Hall and, feeling generous, John Means.    Also trade acquisitions and free agents.    Maybe Tyler Wells, Kyle Bradish, Keegan Akin and Felix Bautista.

Forget the Vespi level guy, even as someone I hope churns out some years of decent relief.  Jorge Lopez and Dillon Tate are more like Cole Sulser and Tanner Scott than they are Josh Hader and Devin Williams.

If the Orioles play a 5-game 1st round playoff series in October 2023, Rodriguez and Hall will have that Anderson and Fried opportunity, and somebody better than Jordan Lyles will be Charlie Morton.   If you know in May 2022 who is going to be Tyler Matzek in October 2023, 30 GM's want to talk.   Vespi will get as much opportunity as anyone to show the baseball world if that's him the next 1.5 seasons, whether 30% or 70% of those innings come in Baltimore.    The pitches are just data.

[Sports Guy]

9 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

I don't think Vespi has been jerked around.  Handling pure relievers is different than handling starters.  As long as Vespi is being used in the role he's used to, it really doesn't matter whether it's in Norfolk or Baltimore. 

And, if they're trying to optimize their use of guys that aren't long-term pieces, but offer short-term value in 2022, so be it.  Those guys are thrilled to get their cup of coffee.  If they get enough service for life-time healthcare and a pension, even better.  I doubt the Logan Gillaspie's of the world mind coming to the bigs for a game or two.  And, I'm sure that they know why their there.

There is no need to send guys up and down that should be here now.  That’s indefensible.  It’s not smart roster management by any means.

If you have a few guys that are nobodies but you need those innings, that’s fine.  You need it for injury reasons or a DH, so be it.  But Vespi should be here now.  As was pointed out, we have 6 relievers  performing well and almost all of them can go multiple innings.  Vespi can as well.  We don’t need to “spell innings” with mediocre, go nowhere pitchers.  We have the innings covered.

And you can also now add Kremer to the mix, so you really don’t need to do that.

In the past, we didn’t have guys that could cover a lot of innings each, so doing this was a little more necessary. Other teams may not have a lot of guys that can cover 2+ innings at a time.