Orioles acquire Ryan O’Hearn

[RZNJ]

20 minutes ago, Number5 said:

James McCann wasn't DFA, was he?  Differnt situation altogether.  No?

It's still essentially a trade.  Technically the Orioles acquired him before the other teams were able to claim him.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Getting McCann is fine.

Giving McCann at bats at first and DH....not so much.

Good thing we scooped up Ryan O'Hearn then 

[btdart20]

3 minutes ago, DrinkinWithFermi said:

Not really, the Givens and McCann deals received overwhelmingly positive responses.

I hear you.  I was a bit snarky.  Overwhelmingly positive, yes.  But there were "people" (as SG said) who had different thoughts.  There were some people questioning McCann as not clearly better than Chirinos (i.e. an upgrade) and/or we should have gone down another path instead.  I didn't go through the Givens thread.

My general point is that everyone has an opinion.  Good, bad, thoughtful, lazy, and everything in between.  And taking shots as leadership is always in vogue.  Destroying is simpler than creating.

[Going Underground]

27 minutes ago, Number5 said:

James McCann wasn't DFA, was he?  Differnt situation altogether.  No?

McCann is the only Oriole with a guaranteed contract for next year at $4.125 mm. They could trade him.Givens has a mutual option for next year at $6 mm.

[spiritof66]

7 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

I'm 100% convinced that Elias could acquire anyone, and people would have a reason to hate it too.  And isn't that true of many decisions that any lead makes?

I'll speak for myself, not for "people" generally. I may have criticized Elias for acquisitions (Odor, maybe), but I don't recall doing that.

I did criticize Elias for acquiring Phillips and Aguilar last year because I thought that sent a message, both to the team and to "people," that he wasn't willing to make a meaningful move to help the team make a run for a WC spot.

And I criticize him now because so far he has completely failed to meet the expectations for this off-season that he created. And he didn't just blurt out "lift off" once. He repeatedly talked about spending money and making trades to acquire talent for the 2023 season. The only reason I hedge that criticism is that I don't know whether, or how much, that failure is the result of constraints imposed by ownerships that Elias didn't expect.

[Number5]

Just now, RZNJ said:

It's still essentially a trade.  Technically the Orioles acquired him before the other teams were able to claim him.

OK, and why does that mean that "cash considerations" can't mean reducing the obligation that KC already has?  Hey, look, I don't know, and haven't seen it detailed anywhere.  I'm just not convinced that you know, either.  All transactions need consideration from both sides.  You just haven't shown me why the consideration that KC is receiving in this deal isn't a reduction in the hole they had already dug for themselves.  The way you are suggesting, the Orioles would have to have been convinced that another team with a higher waiver claim position than Baltimore was going to claim him and pay the full $1.4 million, and felt it was worth paying more than $1.4 million.  If it is the way I suggest, KC would have believed that it was unlikely that any team would claim him and pay the full $1.4 million, so they took what they could get to lower the amount they were on the hook for.  As I said, I certainly don't know, but the second scenario seems at least as likely as the first to me.

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, Number5 said:

OK, and why does that mean that "cash considerations" can't mean reducing the obligation that KC already has?  Hey, look, I don't know, and haven't seen it detailed anywhere.  I'm just not convinced that you know, either.  All transactions need consideration from both sides.  You just haven't shown me why the consideration that KC is receiving in this deal isn't a reduction in the hole they had already dug for themselves.  The way you are suggesting, the Orioles would have to have been convinced that another team with a higher waiver claim position than Baltimore was going to claim him and pay the full $1.4 million, and felt it was worth paying more than $1.4 million.  If it is the way I suggest, KC would have believed that it was unlikely that any team would claim him and pay the full $1.4 million, so they took what they could get to lower the amount they were on the hook for.  As I said, I certainly don't know, but the second scenario seems at least as likely as the first to me.

Not a big deal.  Usually when a team is paying part of the contract of the player that they are trading, it's announced with cash going from that team to the receiving team.  I'm only stating my opinion based on history and the way this deal was announced. 

[Sports Guy]

16 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Getting McCann is fine.

Giving McCann at bats at first and DH....not so much.

That really better not be the plan but it sure as hell sounds like it.

[emmett16]

45 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I’m 100% convinced that Elias could acquire acquire anyone and people would like the move.

For the record I hate the move.  I'm confused by the moved.  I'm trying to figure out why in the world he would sign him.  If he is on the roster on Opening Day I might vomit.  

[Sports Guy]

17 minutes ago, interloper said:

Does anybody like the move? My take is just that it's a nothing depth move not really worthy of feeling any particular way about. I haven't really seen anyone even saying it's a good depth move. It's just a move. 

I will say that I hope it's just a depth move. Because if not, it's a worrying move. But I only say this because so many other people seem to think it's more than a depth move. 

The Orioles don’t tend to spend 7 figures on a player and keep them in the minors. That’s what people are saying and you can’t really argue against it.

It doesn’t mean that is what will happen, just that history tells us that it will.

But it’s also another awful move that doesn’t address the real issues of the team.

[emmett16]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

That really better not be the plan but it sure as hell sounds like it.

If they throw out a complete garbage bunch of acquisitions and next year is a retread of 2022, I think it's safe to assume two things:

1. Absolutely nothing is going to happen with this franchise until Peter dies

2. Elias is not going to be here very long 

[Number5]

4 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Not a big deal.  Usually when a team is paying part of the contract of the player that they are trading, it's announced with cash going from that team to the receiving team.  I'm only stating my opinion based on history and the way this deal was announced. 

Of course that is true in most deals, where there is additional consideration (players, compensatory picks.)  In this case, the sole consideration is cash considerations.  Let me ask you, in a deal such as the one I suggest is possible, do you think the deal would be presented as "KC trades O'Hearn and cash to BAL in exchange for nothing"?  I don't.

[RZNJ]

So if the Orioles trade for Max Kepler giving up little  and trade Santander + a B prospect for Pablo Lopez will anyone feel better?

[RZNJ]

3 minutes ago, Number5 said:

Of course that is true in most deals, where there is additional consideration (players, compensatory picks.)  In this case, the sole consideration is cash considerations.  Let me ask you, in a deal such as the one I suggest is possible, do you think the deal would be presented as "KC trades O'Hearn and cash to BAL in exchange for nothing"?  I don't.

Yes.  Many trades have been announced exactly like that. They just don't use the word nothing.

The MacCan trade is the Mets sending us McCann and cash for a PTBNL.   You think the PTBNL was essential for that trade to get done?

[eddie83]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

They are impacting every budget.

Every team has a certain amount of money they can spend.  Spending 1.4M on a guy in AAA is part of that.

That's true of the Orioles and it's true of the Mets.

For a team with a lower end budget I'd rather spend the money on the ML roster and not minor league depth.

That there, by itself excluded the Orioles from the rest of my statement.

Now if you want me to go into what I meant by the rest I will.  I was talking about a team that is projected to be a division winner.  Yes every team that makes the playoffs has a chance to advance.  Of course they do.  Division winners have a greater chance to advance in the playoffs "make noise".  If I have a team that I think has a chance to make the WC I'm spending that money on the ML roster.

So yea, I wasn't talking about the Orioles or what I thought their chances were at all there.

Ok. My bad.