The Rotation

[Sports Guy]

19 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

One guy said "probably better" and the other said "could go both ways". Both are specific to Grayson rather than generalizations about development in general.

I don’t care.  It’s still the same implication that development has to be in the minors. It’s complete bs.

Literally Bradish is a recent example of how Bs that is.

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t care.  It’s still the same implication that development has to be in the minors. It’s complete bs.

Literally Bradish is a recent example of how Bs that is.

Means is an even better one.

Got beat up in the majors and went into the offseason with a plan on how to improve.

[RZNJ]

Here’s an article regarding Bradish.   Spin it however you want.  My spin is that he made minor changes, got a mental break, and gave his arm a much needed rest and maybe changed his pitch usage percentages.   Now, I don’t think GRod is beaten down just yet.   His stuff, especially his fastball and change look just fine.  He needs more consistency with his curve and of course like all pitchers he needs to locate.   He needs reps against hitters who make you pay.
 

https://www.masnsports.com/blog/mental-and-physical-resets-have-kyle-bradish-feeling-better-about-his-game

[seak05]

56 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t care.  It’s still the same implication that development has to be in the minors. It’s complete bs.

Literally Bradish is a recent example of how Bs that is.

Clearly development can happen in the majors. In fact nearly every player goes through an adjustment period when they are promoted, Adley last year is another good example.

Development isn’t exclusive to the majors though, the minors, spring training, and the off-season are also important to the development process. It also can be based on what you need to work on. The off-season seems to be a prime time to develop a new pitch for instance, while learning how major leaguers attack you can only happen at the major league level. 
 

That said, the *results* tend to matter a lot more at the major league level. If Grayson is facing the NYY I want him throwing his fastball & chanegeup, not working on his curveball. If he’s facing the Durham bulls, he can throw whatever pitches he likes. 

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Here’s an article regarding Bradish.   Spin it however you want.  My spin is that he made minor changes, got a mental break, and gave his arm a much needed rest and maybe changed his pitch usage percentages.   Now, I don’t think GRod is beaten down just yet.   His stuff, especially his fastball and change look just fine.  He needs more consistency with his curve and of course like all pitchers he needs to locate.   He needs reps against hitters who make you pay.
 

https://www.masnsports.com/blog/mental-and-physical-resets-have-kyle-bradish-feeling-better-about-his-game

These quotes look bad on Bradish imo.  Some of it is, of course, the same cliche stuff you always hear. Some of it makes him look a little weak mentally and makes you wonder what happens if he has a string of bad starts up here again.

That said, I don’t buy that 17 innings changed his season and I don’t buy that without those 17 innings that he wouldn’t have been able to adjust and perform well to end the 2022 season.  

Edited March 19, 2023 by Sports Guy

[Frobby]

4 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

The only logical reason to send him down is to game his service time.

He'll have to make an adjustment to ML hitters at some point and if you waste some of his innings in the minors you are just delaying that process.

I don’t agree.  It’s logical to send him down if (1) he’s not one of our five best starters right now, or (2) he’s not the same pitcher he was through June 2022 and needs to get his act together.   I’m not saying that either of those things is the case, but they could be.  I’ve seen Grayson pitch at his best, in person and on TV, and I’ve seen him this spring, in person and on TV.   He’s not at his best right now.  

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I don’t agree.  It’s logical to send him down if (1) he’s not one of our five best starters right now, or (2) he’s not the same pitcher he was through June 2022 and needs to get his act together.   I’m not saying that either of those things is the case, but they could be.  I’ve seen Grayson pitch at his best, in person and on TV, and I’ve seen him this spring, in person and on TV.   He’s not at his best right now.  

He can get to his best, and get acclimated to pitching in the majors at the same time.

Instead they use up his innings, which will probably be limited, "getting him to his best" in AAA.  Assuming of course that actually happens.  Once he's "at his best" they can bring him up and he can deal with acclimating to the majors.

Heck maybe they'll get 50 or so good innings out of him this year!

If was an established guy no one would be suggesting this.  He can do it in the majors.

[RZNJ]

29 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

These quotes look bad on Bradish imo.  Some of it is, of course, the same cliche stuff you always hear. Some of it makes him look a little weak mentally and makes you wonder what happens if he has a string of bad starts up here again.

That said, I don’t buy that 17 innings changed his season and I don’t buy that without those 17 innings that he wouldn’t have been able to adjust and perform well to end the 2022 season.  

I don’t have any problem with anything Bradish said there.  

[wildcard]

This article is dated August 9, 2022.  At that time Bradish had a 6.55 ERA.   He hadn't had much success in the majors.   Holt and Holmes were still  having him make adjustments.   I know he moved to the middle of the rubber and became more aggressive.  

August ERA 3.14

Sept ERA  3.35

Most of his success came after this article was printed.

[waroriole]

10 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

These quotes look bad on Bradish imo.  Some of it is, of course, the same cliche stuff you always hear. Some of it makes him look a little weak mentally and makes you wonder what happens if he has a string of bad starts up here again.

That said, I don’t buy that 17 innings changed his season and I don’t buy that without those 17 innings that he wouldn’t have been able to adjust and perform well to end the 2022 season.  

They don’t make him look bad at all. He’s being honest about the struggles he was having and what helped him get his mind right. I appreciate his self-awareness 

[Jim'sKid26]

Aren't we talking about the best pitching prospect in baseball here? I agree with @Sports Guy and @Can_of_corn (got it right that time!). Why waste his limited innings this year in AAA? If he's what everyone seems to think he is, he belongs in the rotation. Is he gonna be the ToR starter from day 1? Of course not! But the skill he needs to master is getting MLB hitters out and there are very few MLB hitters in AAA. 

[wildcard]

I think they should put GRod in the rotation as an Opener and let him grow into a regular starter.   

In his 4 spring starts Grod has pitched to a 2.53 ERA in the first 3 innings.    He has trouble in the fourth.    So they let him pitch 3 innings and begin the 4th.  If he  becomes hittable in the 4th they pull him in favor bulk starter that pitches 3 or 4 innings.   I would expect GRod to improve as he gets experience.

Kremer, Gibson, Bradish and Irvin have all gone 4 innings and will probably go 5 in their next spring start.    Having one guy (GRod) who is not going 5 should not be big deal especially with the off days in April.   GRod will grow into the starter role.

Edited March 19, 2023 by wildcard

[UMDTerrapins]

Without reading any of the referenced interviews, my impression of Bradish is that he is pretty tough/resilient and has adjusted well at each level after initial challenges. I feel really good about his future (in part) because of that. 

[Frobby]

11 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

He can get to his best, and get acclimated to pitching in the majors at the same time.

Instead they use up his innings, which will probably be limited, "getting him to his best" in AAA.  Assuming of course that actually happens.  Once he's "at his best" they can bring him up and he can deal with acclimating to the majors.

Heck maybe they'll get 50 or so good innings out of him this year!

If was an established guy no one would be suggesting this.  He can do it in the majors.

It’s debatable which approach is better from the standpoint of getting Rodriguez where he needs to be.   But if he’s not ready to be one of our five best out of the gate, then what is best for the team?  In any event, I reject the idea that if Rodriguez continues to pitch as he has his last two outings, and is sent down to begin the year, the primary motivating reason is to manipulate his service time.  

[Aristotelian]

47 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think they should put GRod in the rotation as an Opener and let him grow into a regular starter.   

In his 4 spring starts Grod has pitched to a 2.53 ERA in the first 3 innings.    He has trouble in the fourth.    So they let him pitch 3 innings and begin the 4th.  If he  becomes hittable in the 4th they pull him in favor bulk starter that pitches 3 or 4 innings.   I would expect GRod to improve as he gets experience.

Kremer, Gibson, Bradish and Irvin have all gone 4 innings and will probably go 5 in their next spring start.    Having one guy (GRod) who is not going 5 should not be big deal especially with the off days in April.   GRod will grow into the starter role.

This is my bet for what they will do, especially with the off days in the first two weeks. Doesn't matter to me whether he opens or pitches a couple low leverage innings, but stretching him out slowly while facing MLB hitters makes sense.