A Realistic Pitching Ace And What It Will Take to Acquire Him

[Billy F-Face3]

14 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

If Cleveland is out of it, I would be surprised to see them keep Bieber. 

Similar to that notion, I have to wonder about Sonny Gray and the Twins.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Billy F-Face3 said:

Let's  just assume that any player in MLB is available and you could DRAFT 1 starting pitcher. What's your wish-list shortlist look like? Who's number 1 on your pitchers wish-list?

The one that is also an All Star hitter.

[hutchead]

3 hours ago, cnmilton said:

Ok, still a hypothetical scenario, but if the Angels fall out of contention and decide to trade Ohtani, should the Orioles entertain the thought of a rental for the rest of the season?  Maybe trade something like DL Hall, Coby Mayo, and Westburg for the 2 to 3 month rental?

Personally, I could never give up 18 years of control of top 100 prospects for a two month rental. I don't care who that rental is.

[DirtyBird]

We should get Goldschmidt. Our pitching will be fine.

[Bemorewins]

26 minutes ago, ArtVanDelay said:

Really?  That seems reasonable for Stroman.  Maybe even light. 

The Orioles can and should do much better! We have a shot to win the whole thing and more prospects than we can use. I don’t want to see us waste this season, next, or any other by trading for a FA to be who is not a #1. That’s a waste IMO.

[Just Regular]

The 1-month rental of Justin Verlander cost Jake Rogers, Daz Cameron and Franklin Perez.     The Astros in some ways got lucky that August after standing pat at the non-waivers deadline, irritating some of the veterans in that clubhouse.

I still don't get why the rest of the 2017 competitors didn't put in a claim.

 

[cnmilton]

The thing about Ohtani is its just not the pitching that you are trading: it's also the bat. In essence you are acquiring an All Star hitter as well as an All Star pitcher. It's pretty much acquiring 2 players at the same time.

 It's not quite apples to apples comparison to what the Astros did in 2017 trading for Verlander, but similar

[Billy F-Face3]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

The one that is also an All Star hitter.

We share that opinion. That would cover 2 needs with 1 player. It could get us over the hurdle like the acquisition of Frank Robinson did back in the day.

[Snutchy]

On 5/11/2023 at 5:32 PM, Frobby said:

I had a guy apply for a lawyer job at my firm one time whose résumé included his softball league batting average.  My thoughts were:

1.  Why does this guy think his softball abilities are relevant?

2.  Who is keeping track of batting averages in a softball league?  And who is judging hits and errors?

3.  Doesn’t this guy know that OPS or wRC+ is far more indicative of his hitting prowess?

I’m kidding about no. 3, but I definitely had the other two thoughts.  He did not get offered a job.

Hear me out - it served its purpose. You noticed it. It made you stop and think.

I'm a shift supervisor at a 911 center. 

Interviewing and recommending for hire is one part of my job responsibilities. That would have caught my eye for sure, and I would have asked him about it. In my line of work, you will get eaten alive if you can't find a way to relate to the customer. Either by me, yourself, or the 911 caller. Having something like that on a resume makes me think this person has an actual personality. It's up to me to figure out if it's the correct one. You've got to be weird, but not too weird.

If you call 911, do you want to talk to a robot or would you rather talk to someone who is capable of empathy and rattling off yesterdays box score?

[Os4days]

Ohtani would be great obviously but what would he cost us in terms of players and would Angelos be willing to sign him or would we just be renting him?  If we were to sign him hypothetically, it would probably mean we wouldn’t be able to sign some of our homegrown talent to extensions.  Gerritt Cole would be awesome and is signed long term but how much would his $36 million per year salary hamper the team’s viability for coming years. 
 

I think Elias sees the progress being made by our young rotation and that will determine who we go after. I do think we do trade for a pitcher but probably not any top ace of any sort. 

Edited May 22, 2023 by Os4days

[Billy F-Face3]

2 minutes ago, Os4days said:

Ohtani would be great obviously but what would he cost us in terms of players and would Angelos be willing to sign him or would we just be renting him?  If we were to sign him hypothetically, it would probably mean we wouldn’t be able to sign some of our homegrown talent to extensions.  Gerritt Cole would be awesome and is signed long term but how much would his $36 million per year salary hamper the team’s viability for coming years.

2 parts I want to respond about:

Othani: That's the big issue. Ohtani is going to be too costly for what the team wants to pay. Yes, the Orioles have the firepower at this point in time to get it done, but they're not going to sell the farm for a rental. Maybe even not if they're guaranteed a long term deal. They have a long term plan to win over a decade, and giving up too much could hinder that success. On the flip side, if you were going to increase your probability of winning the World Series by acquiring Ohtani, isn't that a chance worth taking? It requires nuance and the Orioles won't want him as a rental. Ohtani is probably going to demand something approaching around $40+ Million AAV with some extra contract incentives, depending on how many years he wants. If the Contract is longer, I can't imagine he would go lower than $30Mill per season, and that's being generous. Ohtani is going to get the biggest contract in MLB history because he's that much in demand. As for a trade package, the Angels owner has said they're not trading him. So even if a team was to get them to budge, it's not going to be what the Orioles want to pay. They've learned their lesson from the Chris Davis contract, so all of this seems very improbable. But it is fun to dream.

Gerrit Cole: If the Yankees were to somehow fall out of contention and become sellers, would Orioles fans really welcome a Yankee such as Gerrit Cole or a slugger like Stanton onto the team? And would they really trade with a bitter division rival? This question has me wondering with great intrigue.

[Billy F-Face3]

https://www.prosportsdaily.com/articles/the-x-factors-that-will-shape-the-2023-mlb-trade-deadline-778667.html

 

"2. Will Shohei Ohtani hit the market?

At the moment, industry sources are as close to unequivocal as you can get about the Angels' plans for Ohtani. "They are not going to trade him," said one executive. Said another: "If they were going to deal him, the best time would've been last summer. But unless they completely collapse, no shot."

What some rival evaluators believe is that Angels owner Arte Moreno, who went on the record during spring training saying that Ohtani won't be dealt as long as his team is in contention, does not want to be remembered as the guy who pushed this generation's Babe Ruth out of his organization. (Especially since that is the legacy of late Red Sox owner Harry Frazee, who dealt Ruth to the Yankees.)

It's hard to find anyone who believes that Ohtani will re-sign with the Angels after he hits the free agent market. But if he does leave Anaheim, Moreno will at least have an out: It would be Ohtani's choice to depart, not because Moreno ushered him out of town."

[EddeeEddee]

6 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

Similar to that notion, I have to wonder about Sonny Gray and the Twins.

The Twins are in first place and will easily be in the playoff hunt all year in that weak ass division.  On top of that Sonny Gray leads the league in ERA.  I think the fans would revolt if they traded Gray.

[Bemorewins]

7 hours ago, Billy F-Face3 said:

2 parts I want to respond about:

Othani: That's the big issue. Ohtani is going to be too costly for what the team wants to pay. Yes, the Orioles have the firepower at this point in time to get it done, but they're not going to sell the farm for a rental. Maybe even not if they're guaranteed a long term deal. They have a long term plan to win over a decade, and giving up too much could hinder that success. On the flip side, if you were going to increase your probability of winning the World Series by acquiring Ohtani, isn't that a chance worth taking? It requires nuance and the Orioles won't want him as a rental. Ohtani is probably going to demand something approaching around $40+ Million AAV with some extra contract incentives, depending on how many years he wants. If the Contract is longer, I can't imagine he would go lower than $30Mill per season, and that's being generous. Ohtani is going to get the biggest contract in MLB history because he's that much in demand. As for a trade package, the Angels owner has said they're not trading him. So even if a team was to get them to budge, it's not going to be what the Orioles want to pay. They've learned their lesson from the Chris Davis contract, so all of this seems very improbable. But it is fun to dream.

Gerrit Cole: If the Yankees were to somehow fall out of contention and become sellers, would Orioles fans really welcome a Yankee such as Gerrit Cole or a slugger like Stanton onto the team? And would they really trade with a bitter division rival? This question has me wondering with great intrigue.

I don't want to begrudge anyone for their fantasies or dream scenarios because after all isn't that what a message board is for?

But in the reality of the 2023 MLB world, there is no realistic possibility that the Orioles could resign Ohtani and outbid the Mets and Dodgers after trading for him. And the chances are even worse (like less than zero) that the Yankees will become sellers... like ever. You know that's not how the NY market works.

[MCO'sFan]

2 hours ago, Bemorewins said:

I don't want to begrudge anyone for their fantasies or dream scenarios because after all isn't that what a message board is for?

But in the reality of the 2023 MLB world, there is no realistic possibility that the Orioles could resign Ohtani and outbid the Mets and Dodgers after trading for him. And the chances are even worse (like less than zero) that the Yankees will become sellers... like ever. You know that's not how the NY market works.

Plus, Ohtani is staying out west. It will be the Dodgers or the Angels with SF as a dark horse. I can't see anyone else signing him.