Is Atkins the Middle of Order Big Bat AM Promised or Not?

[Capn Vivi]

There's a lot of irrational fear and craziness in this thread. The only reason anyone would care whether or not Atkins is "the" bat Andy wanted is for fear that, cloistered now in the warehouse, MacPhail has disconnected the phones and is no longer pursuing any other options. Who's to say that Atkins is "the" bat? If MacPhail signs no one else, will Atkins then qualify? Or what if we grab Delgado or LaRoche? Are they all of a sudden the bat MacPhail was referring to? (note: the latter two are both lefties)

This is not just a case of cryptic word choice or semantics, but of expectations vs. results. MacPhail is obviously trying to make the Orioles a better team. If he's pursuing other options, he's doing his job. If he fails to execute and doesn't land one of these options, that doesn't mean he can't move on. The big heart attack is that we just don't know what he's trying to do and in absence of that, we assume he's sipping cider by the window, re-reading War & Peace and pondering life's greatest questions (or thereabouts).

As it happens, we have a few relative unknowns as far as young hitters go that we all expect to start 140+ games this year. MacPhail wants as much to give them time to prove themselves as he wants to provide Trembley with better options. As SG said, one of the few positions on this team without a any kind of prospect is SS and MacPhail hasn't made much progress on that front.

Not to mention we aren't exactly competing this year. There's no reason Dunn or Pena couldn't be playing 1B for us in 2011. "The Big Bat" is that great phantom that every year seems to pass us by. Let's settle a few more positions than C, RF, and 2B before deciding we need to go all in.

[Old#5fan]

A few questions for you.

1.) Who would you list as the big bats that were available when free agency first started?

2.) Did the position of those players correspond with a team need (Big bat is not a position by itself)?

3.) How would those players offensive production compare to Luke Scott or Reimold?

It seems that this is another poll or quote from you that will somehow "justify" your stance on the fact that the Orioles have not added the big bat Andy MacPhail was looking to acquire. He either didn't acquire his big bat or Atkins was his big batter, neither option is good enough for you.

The guy simply acquired a bat which is what Atlanta did with Glaus. They mentioned a big bat and Glaus was good enough to fit the description for the casual fan. For me a big bat this offseason would have to be someone with more power than Scott when healthy and those names would have been Delgado, Bay, Holliday, and Glaus. I do not think that LaRoche, Branyan, Vlad, Beltre, or Matsui will hit more homeruns than Scott next year and even then I think 25 homeruns is going to be what those four players average.

Holliday and Bay would have really been an expensive way to add a bat (In terms of dollar and position). The Orioles should have probably made a run at Glaus, but considering he signed for so little and could play both first and third I would suspect that the Orioles did inquire about obtaining him as they have with just about every other player that fit the bill as a position of need.

So we have LaRoche, Blalock, Branyan, and Delgado as what is left of the somewhat reliable big bats. Baltimore, Toronto, Seattle and the Mets all need first baseman. I would say the odds of landing one of those three guys is good which will mean that MacPhail added bats, just like he said.

Glaus would have been a great choice, but if he was too costly for the Scroogelike MacPhail, then you go to the aging but still fearsome when healthy proven sluggers like Vlad, Delgado or as a last resort Thome. Any slugger is worth a shot when you have none on this team. This team other than probably Adam Jones has zero star power to draw fans. Vlad, Delgado and even Thome would correct that at least for a season or two.

[Old#5fan]

There's a lot of irrational fear and craziness in this thread. The only reason anyone would care whether or not Atkins is "the" bat Andy wanted is for fear that, cloistered now in the warehouse, MacPhail has disconnected the phones and is no longer pursuing any other options. Who's to say that Atkins is "the" bat? If MacPhail signs no one else, will Atkins then qualify? Or what if we grab Delgado or LaRoche? Are they all of a sudden the bat MacPhail was referring to? (note: the latter two are both lefties)

This is not just a case of cryptic word choice or semantics, but of expectations vs. results. MacPhail is obviously trying to make the Orioles a better team. If he's pursuing other options, he's doing his job. If he fails to execute and doesn't land one of these options, that doesn't mean he can't move on. The big heart attack is that we just don't know what he's trying to do and in absence of that, we assume he's sipping cider by the window, re-reading War & Peace and pondering life's greatest questions (or thereabouts).

As it happens, we have a few relative unknowns as far as young hitters go that we all expect to start 140+ games this year. MacPhail wants as much to give them time to prove themselves as he wants to provide Trembley with better options. As SG said, one of the few positions on this team without a any kind of prospect is SS and MacPhail hasn't made much progress on that front.

Not to mention we aren't exactly competing this year. There's no reason Dunn or Pena couldn't be playing 1B for us in 2011. "The Big Bat" is that great phantom that every year seems to pass us by. Let's settle a few more positions than C, RF, and 2B before deciding we need to go all in.

That is a fine strategy if you want to remain mired in either fourth or at best third place at least ten game below 500 which is right where this team is undoubtedly headed. All this does is develop a lack of confidence and a culture of losing that these younger players didn't have in the minors. It becomes, oh well, lets talk about my new Mercedes instead of competitive baseball because they are doomed before they take the field for the season. This is not only a horrible strategy it is stupid.

[Old#5fan]

"We do feel like we have young kids at first and third," said MacPhail. "Anyone that required a long-term commitment was something that wasn't ideal for us. Here we had the opportunity, in our view, to take a little bit of a risk on a guy that was one of the game's most productive hitters going into last season. We got the kind of right-handed bat we wanted on pretty much our terms, one plus an option. And it gives us the versatility to sort of gauge the first- and third-base market going out. The more we got into this, the more we learned about the potential cost for other options at first and third, the more attractive Garrett became." LINK

I have posted this before, and I am sure others have posted this also. IMO, the bold text says it all. It seems crystal clear to me. Atkins IS, I repeat..., IS the 'big bat.' Very disappointing.

This is precisely what I fear as well. If so, I want to know how the board will defend such a Syd Thrifty type move! Granted, there is sime time yet so that hopefully he will prove us wrong but he damn sure better get moving. Other teams haven't been waiting around. Even the Nationals have made more and better moves.

[SilentJames]

This is precisely what I fear as well. If so, I want to know how the board will defend such a Syd Thrifty type move! Granted, there is sime time yet so that hopefully he will prove us wrong but he damn sure better get moving. Other teams haven't been waiting around. Even the Nationals have made more and better moves.

Please tell me you are calling the Pudge signing a good move.

[jjdman]

This team other than probably Adam Jones has zero star power to draw fans.

When did we trade Wieters?

[Old#5fan]

When did we trade Wieters?

Wieters may have star potential but he has not had enough time to prove it yet.

[waroriole]

Wieters may have star potential but he has not had enough time to prove it yet.

If you think more people are going to turn up to see Jones rather than Nick or BRob then you're just wrong.

[Old#5fan]

If you think more people are going to turn up to see Jones rather than Nick or BRob then you're just wrong.

I have no idea who is going to turn up to see who and neither do you. Most fans, I suspect show up to see the team as a whole.

The fact is though that only Adam Jones would qualify as a possible "star" on this team as he has been named an All-star and won a Gold Glove something that nobody else on the team has done (received both honors). That is the point I was making and which you completely missed the boat.

[waroriole]

I have no idea who is going to turn up to see who and neither do you. Most fans, I suspect show up to see the team as a whole.

The fact is though that only Adam Jones would qualify as a possible "star" on this team as he has been named an All-star and won a Gold Glove something that nobody else on the team has done (received both honors).

So you think when fans are deciding whether to go see the O's play they are going to look at the roster and say "Let's go see the O's b/c Jones is an All-Star and a GG winner." But if not for Jones they would say "I'd like to go see them play, I mean Atkins, Izturis and BRob have been All-Stars but they haven't won GG, so lets just stay home.":scratchchinhmm:

Also, I guess it sucked for the Red Sox when they had Manny and Ortiz b/c they didn't draw fans based on your definition of a "star." Neither has won a GG.

[Old#5fan]

So you think when fans are deciding whether to go see the O's play they are going to look at the roster and say "Let's go see the O's b/c Jones is an All-Star and a GG winner." But if not for Jones they would say "I'd like to go see them play, I mean Atkins, Izturis and BRob have been All-Stars but they haven't won GG, so lets just stay home.":scratchchinhmm:

Also, I guess it sucked for the Red Sox when they had Manny and Ortiz b/c they didn't draw fans based on your definition of a "star." Neither has won a GG.

Sometimes I feel like I am responding to either 5th graders or people who are just jerking my chain but all I am saying is this team LACKS STAR POWER! Most teams have some bonifide stars that do in fact, help DRAW FANS. The last true STAR this team had that did so was Cal. This team really, really lacks this type of player. Back in the day they were loaded with future HOFer's like Palmer, Brooks, Frank, Aparicio, etc. Now they have NONE!

[larrytt]

The fact is though that only Adam Jones would qualify as a possible "star" on this team as he has been named an All-star and won a Gold Glove something that nobody else on the team has done (received both honors). That is the point I was making and which you completely missed the boat.

Nope, Cesar Izturis was also both an All-star and Gold Glove winner, so by your reckoning, Izturis and Jones must be our only "stars." Meanwhile, 2-time All-star Brian Roberts is no longer a "star." (Kevin Millwood was also an All-star.) Would you like a list of superstar players who never won Gold Gloves, starting with, say, Carlos Delgado? (Who, by the way, has made the All-star team exactly twice, way back in 2000 and 2003, while Roberts did it recently in 2005 and 2007.)

-Larrytt

[waroriole]

Sometimes I feel like I am responding to either 5th graders or people who are just jerking my chain but all I am saying is this team LACKS STAR POWER! Most teams have some bonifide stars that do in fact, help DRAW FANS. The last true STAR this team had that did so was Cal. This team really, really lacks this type of player. Back in the day they were loaded with future HOFer's like Palmer, Brooks, Frank, Aparicio, etc. Now they have NONE!

Nick, Wieters, Tillman and Matusz are all possible future HoF players. You can't just go pick up a washed up Vlad b/c you think he's a future HoF.

[larrytt]

Sometimes I feel like I am responding to either 5th graders or people who are just jerking my chain but all I am saying is this team LACKS STAR POWER!

Putting aside the irony of you saying others are like 5th graders or are yanking your chain (look in the mirror), if you believe the team lacks star power, then instead of making all sorts of factually incorrect or misleading statements (you know, the ones so many respond rather negatively), why not just say, from the start (drum roll please), "This team lacks star power." Most would agree - it's a young, up-and-coming team. You also wrote, "Back in the day they were loaded with future HOFer's like Palmer, Brooks, Frank, Aparicio, etc. Now they have NONE!" Wow - you can see the future! Perhaps you might want to wait a few years and see how Markakis, Jones, Reimold, Pie, Wieters, Tillman, Matusz, and Bergesen turn out.

-Larrytt

[Old#5fan]

Putting aside the irony of you saying others are like 5th graders or are yanking your chain (look in the mirror), if you believe the team lacks star power, then instead of making all sorts of factually incorrect or misleading statements (you know, the ones so many respond rather negatively), why not just say, from the start (drum roll please), "This team lacks star power." Most would agree - it's a young, up-and-coming team. You also wrote, "Back in the day they were loaded with future HOFer's like Palmer, Brooks, Frank, Aparicio, etc. Now they have NONE!" Wow - you can see the future! Perhaps you might want to wait a few years and see how Markakis, Jones, Reimold, Pie, Wieters, Tillman, Matusz, and Bergesen turn out.

-Larrytt

Look Mr. Genius. Everyone on the planet knew that Frank, Brooks, and Palmer were future HOFers and you know what I meant by that unless you weren't around at the time. Nobody can say that about anyone on the Orioles now since Cal retired and you know what I am talking about. It has nothing to do about foreseeing the future. We don't even have any sure fire All-stars on this team right now other than possibly Jones, but even that isn't a lock. So stop the incessant bashing of my posts fore merely speaking the truth and being factual!!