Heyman: Orioles being aggressive

[SrMeowMeow]

If you're buying it on eBay and there is a BUY NOW option for an item you desperately want, then you sure as hell do!

Fine, I'll follow you down Metaphor Lane.

Do you pay sticker price for cars?

[Dipper9]

Fine, I'll follow you down Metaphor Lane.

Do you pay sticker price for cars?

No sir.

But I DO find a car, speak to the salesman, see how much he's asking, make my best offer, and walk away with a brand new Rav-4 somewhere between the asking price and what I wanted to spend.

:thumbsup1:

What I DON'T do is see an add on tv, mention to the Mrs. how much I like that car, and then sit by the phone waiting for Toyota to call ME out of the blue asking if I am interested.

[SrMeowMeow]

Do you think it is difficult to figure out what kind of offer you could put on the table that would be a good starting point for a guy like Beltre?

For example, do you think if the Orioles offered Beltre a 4/44 deal would be some crazy, out of this world offer? Do you think that teams would look at that offer and say boy, are the Orioles insane for offering that?

If it comes out tomorrow that Atlanta will not offer DLee arbtiration and the Orioles call up Lee and offer him a 1/7 deal, do you think that is an insane beginning offer?

It would be a lowball offer, is what it would be. If you're serious about being aggressive, you should offer him 4/64. He will top 4/44 even if he restricts his market to contenders.

You know what makes more sense? Waiting until we know more. Wait, sorry, that's the cowardice and laziness that led to 13 consecutive losing seasons. Better just start throwing handfuls of money in random directions!

[SrMeowMeow]

No sir.

But I DO find a car, speak to the salesman, see how much he's asking, make my best offer, and walk away with a brand new Rav-4 somewhere between the asking price and what I wanted to spend.

:thumbsup1:

What I DON'T do is see an add on tv, mention to the Mrs. how much I like that car, and then sit by the phone waiting for Toyota to call ME out of the blue asking if I am interested.

Okay, I think we've gotten far enough afield. But I am happy with how our conversation went.

[Roll Tide]

Quoted for truth except I changed the tense. There are just a few voices in the wilderness that are worth reading at this point IMO and almost no chance for a good debate where folks want to learn rather than lecture, complain, and/or one up each other. And yes, I know I'm complaining right now so I'll quote one of my favorite movies "And like that... he's gone"...

No ...The Orioles have ruined this board by years & years of piss por managemnet & ownership. They took a franchise that was healthy & was a great draw and allowed it to turn into 13 years of losing...10 years of not have a marquee offensive player. Tons of penny pinching....Expecting us to pay to see the a AAAA baseball team. Allowing the Nationals to move into DC ...Which I would have fought & dragged out forever if I were a lawyer.

Need I go on?

Then comes Andy "Grow The Arms & Buy The Bats" McPhail.....Perhaps he should've said "Grow The Arms & Buy The Rats".

Basically he is handling is job here like this team is in Pittsburgh or Minnesota.

Sorry for the Rant...But Jeez .... I will believe in the Orioles are capable of a big free agent signing when they actual make one.... ( Not the Rats like Uribe, Damon, & Pena)

I believe he can make a deal to bring in a star player when he does it here...Not just selling off veterans for prospects.

[SrMeowMeow]

No ...The Orioles have ruined this board by years & years of piss por managemnet & ownership. They took a franchise that was healthy & was a great draw and allowed it to turn into 13 years of losing...10 years of not have a marquee offensive player. Tons of penny pinching....Expecting us to pay to see the a AAAA baseball team. Allowing the Nationals to move into DC ...Which I would have fought & dragged out forever if I were a lawyer.

Need I go on?

Then comes Andy "Grow The Arms & Buy The Bats" McPhail.....Perhaps he should've said "Grow The Arms & Buy The Rats".

Basically he is handling is job here like this team is in Pittsburgh or Minnesota.

Sorry for the Rant...But Jeez .... I will believe in the Orioles are capable of a big free agent signing when they actual make one.... ( Not the Rats like Uribe, Damon, & Pena)

I believe he can make a deal to bring in a star player when he does it here...Not just selling off veterans for prospects.

I...what? Minnesota? The playoff team? If you think Minnesota is poorly-run, then you don't know what a well-run team looks like.

[Roll Tide]

I...what? Minnesota? The playoff team? If you think Minnesota is poorly-run, then you don't know what a well-run team looks like.

1) The twins don't play in the AL East.

2) The Twins don't spend

3) The Twins have a minor league systems that produce major league hitters.

and I didn't mean poorly ran.... I mean financially frugal out.

And actually the twins fortunes have improved drastically improved with their new stadium.

[Roll Tide]

No sir.

But I DO find a car, speak to the salesman, see how much he's asking, make my best offer, and walk away with a brand new Rav-4 somewhere between the asking price and what I wanted to spend.

:thumbsup1:

What I DON'T do is see an add on tv, mention to the Mrs. how much I like that car, and then sit by the phone waiting for Toyota to call ME out of the blue asking if I am interested.

Funny I thought of this a bit earlier in a thread when they mentioned Cashman on a plane to Arkansas to meet with Lee & his family...And feeling wanted.

I personally really want a 2010 Mercedes SL-500. But I know I'll never agree to the amount of the payments. I can go to the dealer (The Agent) & tell them how badly I want it ....At the end of the day he will never sell it to me for $500.00 per month and I will never agree to spend $1000.00 on a car payment.

So rather than waste my time at the Mercedes Dealer ... I head over to Toyota and by that 2010 Camry XLE that has every option under the sun & get it for the $500.00 I can comfortably afford to spend.

[Dipper9]

Funny I thought of this a bit earlier in a thread when they mentioned Cashman on a plane to Arkansas to meet with Lee & his family...And feeling wanted.

I personally really want a 2010 Mercedes SL-500. But I know I'll never agree to the amount of the payments. I can go to the dealer (The Agent) & tell them how badly I want it ....At the end of the day he will never sell it to me for $500.00 per month and I will never agree to spend $1000.00 on a car payment.

So rather than waste my time at the Mercedes Dealer ... I head over to Toyota and by that 2010 Camry XLE that has every option under the sun & get it for the $500.00 I can comfortably afford to spend.

In your scenario, YOU are a smart GM.

In the world of MacPhail, he wants the Mercedes, but heads over the CarMax to find the old 1973 Beatle for $15 dollars a month! :mwahaha:

[Roll Tide]

In your scenario, YOU are a smart GM.

In the world of MacPhail, he wants the Mercedes, but heads over the CarMax to find the old 1973 Beatle for $15 dollars a month! :mwahaha:

No ...He wants the the Mercedes ...But for the price of the Camry ...Which will never happen.

[ledzepp8]

Dip, you're my friend, but you're incredibly naive if you really think this is what AM thinks. This board is the one full of the folks that want the Mercedes for Camry prices. AM is much more realistic than 90% of this place could ever hope to be.

We simply aren't getting the premier FAs UNLESS the Yanks don't want them. I know that is a crappy thing, but it just is. You folks are pretending when you act like it doesn't have to be that way.

This is exactly right and illustrates why most discussions in regards to personnel moves go nowhere. The anti MacPhail crowd is so hyperbolic in their arguments, it's not even funny. We have people that honestly think that MacPhail believes the above or that he's just sitting by the phone waiting for FA to call and beg him to play for the Os or for other teams to call and beg him to take their great players. We have people that think up unrealistic trade scenarios where we get a great return for our spare parts and then criticize MacPhail when these hypothetical trades don't happen.

[Roll Tide]

Dip, you're my friend, but you're incredibly naive if you really think this is what AM thinks. This board is the one full of the folks that want the Mercedes for Camry prices. AM is much more realistic than 90% of this place could ever hope to be.

We simply aren't getting the premier FAs UNLESS the Yanks don't want them. I know that is a crappy thing, but it just is. You folks are pretending when you act like it doesn't have to be that way.

Plenty of top free agents have moved to teams other then the Yankees the past 10 years....Name 1 that the Orioles were actually serious bidders/contenders for his services?

[ledzepp8]

Plenty of top free agents have moved to teams other then the Yankees the past 10 years....Name 1 that the Orioles were actually serious bidders/contenders for his services?

Start naming "top free agents" that the Yankees wanted and didn't get.

[TonySoprano]

You rebel.

When you're a 64 win team in the AL East, you're not an attractive destination for ***PREMIUM*** free agents no matter how proactive you are or how many flights you book. A phone call to an agent is likely just as impactful as a face to face visit, because no decisions are being made at this point anyways. Maybe you could send them flowers too, for effect.

Conversely, when you're a 95 win team in the AL East, you shouldn't have to fly to ***PREMIUM*** free agents, they should be anxious to fly to meet you.

But that's not the way tbe Yankees act. To get to be a 95 win team, you have to be aggressive.

[El Gordo]

This is exactly right and illustrates why most discussions in regards to personnel moves go nowhere. The anti MacPhail crowd is so hyperbolic in their arguments, it's not even funny. We have people that honestly think that MacPhail believes the above or that he's just sitting by the phone waiting for FA to call and beg him to play for the Os or for other teams to call and beg him to take their great players. We have people that think up unrealistic trade scenarios where we get a great return for our spare parts and then criticize MacPhail when these hypothetical trades don't happen.

There are two problems operating here IMO. One is that AM by nature is a cautious and conservative fellow, and that rarely sits well with young minds, who would prefer a hairy chested swashbuckling man of action like say Jim Bowden :laughlol: to a sweater vested Mr Rogers. Never mind that Bowden has been reduced to being a talk show host because he is basically a ninny, and Fred Rogers was a truly great man and an innovator in TV. The other is that AM controls leaks so well, that we don't hear much about his activety in the press until something actually happens. Many here seem to believe, that like the tree falling in the forest, if the press doesn't report it it doesn't exhist.