Report: Morosi says a source links us with Hamilton and Ross

[Brendan25]

The only good thing is, it seem's even the team's that can spend, won't give Hamilton the years. If i'm DD, I jump in and say here's my offer, you have 24 hours to accept, or we have to move on.

I'd offer him something front loaded like..5 years at 28,28,25,25,14. That's 5/120 mil. I think that's a fair deal, and we're paying up front for more likely production.

He'd say thanks but I'll wait. Thanks for the offer. Go find someone else.

It doesn't work this way DH.

[weams]

Update... I like the 1st part!

Yeah. It was Bill Ripken. On national TV. For the First guy.

Jim Duquette for the second.

Good work Jon.

[weams]

He'd say thanks but I'll wait. Thanks for the offer. Go find someone else.

It doesn't work this way DH.

Did you ever see a deal structured like that either?

[Brendan25]

Ian Kinsler may be the closest?

[apollod]

Did you ever see a deal structured like that either?

I don't think they can structure it like that unless there's deferred compensation involved:

B. Maximum Salary Reduction

(1) Maximum Salary Cut Rule

A Club may not tender, sign or renew a Player under reserve to

the Club pursuant to Article XX(A) of this Agreement and paragraph 10(a) of the Uniform Player?s Contract to a Uniform Player?s

Contract that provides a salary for:

12(a) Major League service that constitutes a reduction in

excess of 20% of his salary for Major League service in the previous season or in excess of 30% of his salary for Major League

service two seasons prior to the first season covered by the new

contract; or

(b) Minor League service as calculated under Section 2©

below that constitutes a reduction in excess of 40% of his salary

for Minor League service in the previous season.

(2) Calculation of Previous Seasons Salaries

(a) Single-Year Contract?Previous Major League Salaries

In order to calculate a Player?s salary for Major League service in the previous season or two seasons prior to the first season

covered by the new contract, the following steps shall be taken:

(i) Base Salary. The Player?s ?Base Salary? shall be the

rate of pay for Major League service contained in paragraph 2

of the contract, or in any special covenant thereto. The Base

Salary shall be adjusted in accordance with paragraphs

2(a)(ii)-(v) below to determine the Player?s salary.

(ii) Deferred Compensation Adjustment. If any deferred

compensation is included in the Base Salary, the Base Salary

shall be adjusted to reflect the discounted present value of the

deferred amount.

(iii) Signing Bonus Adjustment. If the contract contains a

signing bonus, the signing bonus shall be added to the Base

Salary. If any portion of the signing bonus is deferred, the

present value of the signing bonus shall be used for purposes

of the calculation in this paragraph 2(a)(iii).

(iv) Performance Bonus Adjustment. If the contract contains performance bonuses, regardless of whether or not any

portion of the bonus is earned, the Club has the option of either

adding the entire bonus (both earned and unearned portions) in

the Base Salary, or excluding it from the Base Salary but

repeating the bonus on the same terms.

13(v) Other Forms of Compensation Adjustment. If the contract contains any other forms of compensation, the determination of whether the compensation shall be included in the

salary calculation will be determined in accordance with the

facts in each situation. Amounts that are payable on the occurrence of a specific event or events shall not be included in

Base Salary if such event or events fail to occur within the

specified period. If the item is included, the Club has the

option of either including the value of the item in the Base

Salary, or excluding it from Base Salary but repeating the item

on the same terms.

The following is a nonexhaustive list of other forms of compensation:

(A) payments for performing services for a Club in addition to skilled services as a baseball player;

(B) cash, lump sum, payments made in accordance with

agreed upon special covenants to compensate for trading a

Player, releasing a Player, etc.;

© the value of individual property rights granted to a

Player by a Club;

(D) any compensation for postactive Major League

Baseball playing career employment; and

(E) other payments or things of value not specifically

made for performance as a Major League Baseball Player.

(b) Multi-Year Contract?Previous Major League Salaries

In order to calculate a Player?s salary for Major League service in the previous season or two seasons prior to the first season

covered by the new contract, the following steps shall be taken:

(i) Base Salary

(A) If the annual rates of pay contained in paragraph 2

of the contract, or in any special covenant thereto, satisfy

the maximum salary cut rule, the rate of pay stipulated in

the contract for the year at issue shall be the Player?s Base

Salary.

14(B) If the annual rates of pay contained in paragraph 2 of

the contract, or in any special covenant thereto, do not satisfy

the maximum salary cut rule, the average annual value

(?AAV?) of the contract shall be the Player?s Base Salary

for the year at issue. The AAV shall be calculated by averaging the rates of pay contained in paragraph 2 of the contract (or any special covenants thereto) for each year of the

contract. If deferred compensation is contained in any year

of the multi-year contract, the present value of the deferred

amount will be used for purposes of calculating the AAV.

© The Base Salary shall be adjusted in accordance

with paragraphs 2(b)(ii)-(iv) below to determine a Player?s

salary.

(ii) Signing Bonus Adjustment. If the contract contains a

signing bonus, the bonus, irrespective of payment dates, shall

be prorated and included in equal amounts as part of the Base

Salary for each year of the contract. If any portion of the signing bonus is deferred beyond the expiration of the contract, the

present value of the signing bonus shall be used for purposes

of the calculation in this paragraph 2(b)(ii).

(iii) Performance Bonus Adjustment. If the year of the

multi-year contract at issue contains performance bonuses,

they shall be treated in the same manner as in paragraph

2(a)(iv) above.

(iv) Other Forms of Compensation Adjustment. If the

year of the multi-year contract at issue contains any other

forms of compensation, they shall be treated in the same manner as in paragraph 2(a)(v) above.

© Previous Season Minor League Salary

In order to calculate a Player?s salary for Minor League service in the previous season, the following steps shall be taken:

(i) Contracts That Do Not Contain a Separate Rate of Pay

for Minor League Service. If a single year contract, or the relevant year of a multi-year contract, does not contain a separate

rate of pay for Minor League service, the Player?s salary for

Minor League service in the previous season shall be deemed

15to be the same as his salary for performing Major League service as calculated pursuant to paragraph 2(a) or 2(b) above.

(ii) Contracts that Contain a Separate Rate of Pay for Minor

League Service.

(A) If a single-year contract, or the relevant year of a

multi-year contract, contains a separate rate of pay for

Minor League service, and the rate of pay is higher than the

Major League minimum salary for the preceding season

contained in Article VI(A)(1), the Player?s salary for Minor

League service in the previous season shall be the rate of

pay for Minor League service that is stipulated in the contract. For purposes of this paragraph 2©(ii), the stipulated

rate of pay for Minor League service contained in the contract shall not be adjusted to account for a signing bonus,

performance or award bonuses, or any other forms of compensation provided for by the contract.

(B) If a single-year contract, or the relevant year of a

multi-year contract, contains a separate rate of pay for Minor

League service, and that rate of pay is lower than the Major

League minimum salary for the prior season contained in

Article VI(A)(1), the Player?s salary for Minor League service in the previous season shall be the greater of the total

amount of the Player?s actual baseball salary earnings

(defined below) in that season, or the rate of pay stipulated

for Minor League service in the Player?s contract for that

season. A Player?s ?actual baseball salary earnings? for purposes of this paragraph 2©(ii)(B) shall include only those

amounts paid to the Player as salary for performing services

in the Major or Minor Leagues, and shall not include signing bonuses, performance or award bonuses, or any other

forms of compensation provided for by the contract.

(d) Fines or Suspensions

The calculation of a Player?s previous year salaries shall

include amounts which were not paid to a Player for the season

by reason of any fine or suspension which may have been

imposed on the Player, or by reason of any deduction from salary.

16(e) Option Years

Option years shall be included as a year of the contract if the

option had been fully exercised at the time of the tender, signing

or renewal.

(3) Disputes

In the event of a dispute regarding a contract tender, signing or

renewal with respect to any form of additional compensation

referred to in paragraph (2)(a)(v) or 2(b)(iv) above, either the

Player or Club may file a Grievance in order to obtain a determination with respect thereto as the exclusive means of resolving

such dispute, and both parties shall be bound by the resulting

decision. The contract tender, signing or renewal shall be altered

as necessary to conform to the decision, and such tender, signing

or renewal shall remain valid.

I could be reading all that wrong however.

[ChaosLex]

Update... I like the 1st part!

Haha. Keep dreamin', Johnny.

[Crazysilver03]

I don't think they can structure it like that unless there's deferred compensation involved:

I could be reading all that wrong however.

I am pretty sure that only applies to when their isn't a contract in place for the coming season, ergo arbitration.

[Dark Helmet]

I am pretty sure that only applies to when their isn't a contract in place for the coming season, ergo arbitration.

Thats the way I took it too. I cant name any off the top of my head, but Ive seen FA contracts, where a team option exceeds a 30% cut to previous years. Do options fall under a different rule then guaranteed years?

Does my suggestion of a contract breakdown of 28,28,25,25,14 violate any rules you know of?

[apollod]

I am pretty sure that only applies to when their isn't a contract in place for the coming season, ergo arbitration.

Yeah you might be right after reviewing everything. In any case, it's probably a general guideline for free agent contracts. I'd be interested to see if there's been a contract that broke that "rule"; I know Brendan25 alluded to Ian Kinsler's contract doing something similar, but it didn't break it.

Edit:

Actually I'm not so sure anymore.. its quite a rabbit hole.. a player is considered in reserve if they're on the 40 man and "renewing a contract" can be construed as simply not releasing a player already under contract for the season:

Subject to the rights of Players as set forth in this Agreement, each

Club may have title to and reserve up to 40 Player contracts. A Club

shall retain title to a contract and reservation rights until one of the following occurs:

(1) The Player becomes a free agent, as set forth in this Agreement;

(2) The Player becomes a free agent as a result of

(a) termination of the contract by the Club pursuant to paragraph 7(b) thereof,

(b) termination of the contract by the Player pursuant to paragraph 7(a) thereof,

© failure by the Office of the Commissioner to convey to the

Player, by Central Tender Letter submitted to the Association, the

Club’s tender of a new contract within the time period specified

in paragraph 10(a) of the contract (see Attachment 9), or

(d) failure by the Club to exercise its right to renew the contract within the time period specified in paragraph 10(a) thereof;

or

(3) The contract is assigned outright by the Club.

On or before December 2 (or, if December 2 is a Saturday or Sunday,

then on or before the preceding business day) the Office of the Commissioner shall satisfy the Clubs’ tender obligations pursuant to paragraph 10(a) of the Uniform Player’s Contract by submitting to the

Association a letter listing, by Club, the Players to whom each Club is

tendering a contract for the term of the next year (“Central Tender Letter”). The Central Tender Letter shall, consistent with Article VI(A)

and Article VI(B), include for each Player so tendered the salary or

salaries, performance bonuses and/or other terms, if any, offered by the

Club. The Central Tender Letter also shall separately list, also by Club,

those players who have not been tendered a contract for the term of the

next year. The Office of the Commissioner, at the time it transmits the

Central Tender Letter, shall provide to the Association addresses for all

Players who had been promoted to the Major League roster for the first

time in the preceding November and for those Players who do not have

a certified Player Agent. (See Attachment 9.)

With the exception of an untimely tender or renewal, any inadvertent

error in the tendering or renewal of a contract shall result in free

85agency under paragraph (2)© or (2)(d) above, whichever is applicable, only if the Player has first given the Club written notice that the

tendered or renewed Contract does not conform to the requirements of

Article VI of this Agreement and the Club has not retendered or reexercised a renewal in conformance with all applicable rules within

seven (7) days after receipt by the Club of written notice of such

defect. In the event of an untimely tender or renewal, the Player shall

immediately become a free agent under paragraph (2)© or (2)(d)

above, whichever is applicable, and the Club shall have no right to cure

such a tender or renewal. (But see Article VI(B)(3).)

A Club may also reserve, under separate headings on a Reserve List,

Players who properly have been placed on the Voluntarily Retired List,

the Military List, the Suspended List, the Restricted List, the Disqualified List or the Ineligible List. (See Attachments 10, 11 and 12.)

and that section on salaries covers multi-year contracts

(b) Multi-Year Contract—Previous Major League Salaries

In order to calculate a Player’s salary for Major League service in the previous season or two seasons prior to the first season

covered by the new contract, the following steps shall be taken:

(i) Base Salary

(A) If the annual rates of pay contained in paragraph 2

of the contract, or in any special covenant thereto, satisfy

the maximum salary cut rule, the rate of pay stipulated in

the contract for the year at issue shall be the Player’s Base

Salary.

14(B) If the annual rates of pay contained in paragraph 2 of

the contract, or in any special covenant thereto, do not satisfy

the maximum salary cut rule, the average annual value

(“AAV”) of the contract shall be the Player’s Base Salary

for the year at issue. The AAV shall be calculated by averaging the rates of pay contained in paragraph 2 of the contract (or any special covenants thereto) for each year of the

contract. If deferred compensation is contained in any year

of the multi-year contract, the present value of the deferred

amount will be used for purposes of calculating the AAV.

© The Base Salary shall be adjusted in accordance

with paragraphs 2(b)(ii)-(iv) below to determine a Player’s

salary.

in any case; I'd still like to see if there's a players contract out there that breaks the salary reduction rule. Nevermind I really don't see a player considering that contract unless that last year was an option year.

Thats the way I took it too. I cant name any off the top of my head, but Ive seen FA contracts, where a team option exceeds a 30% cut to previous years. Do options fall under a different rule then guaranteed years?

Does my suggestion of a contract breakdown of 28,28,25,25,14 violate any rules you know of?

I do know option years are calculated as being executed; that part of the CBA is clear.

[Crazysilver03]

Thats the way I took it too. I cant name any off the top of my head, but Ive seen FA contracts, where a team option exceeds a 30% cut to previous years. Do options fall under a different rule then guaranteed years?

Does my suggestion of a contract breakdown of 28,28,25,25,14 violate any rules you know of?

It doesn't violate any rules. But that $120M is worth more in that set-up than if it was the other way around when you account for inflation in future years.

[Roll Tide]

DraftRunners.com ‏@DraftRunners

Baltimore Orioles in the front running for Josh Hamilton. Red Sox, Braves, and Rangers still in the running #offseason #DraftRunners

Expand

Posted today from a website call Draftrunners.com so take it FWIW

[Bulgaria]

Am i the only who thinks we need to acquire another arm for the rotation? I'm okay with Hammel, Chen, Gonzalez, Saunders and Tillman but... i'll be perfectly fine if we add another solid gamer. I know that we can get some innings from Arrieta/ Hunter but they are better suited for 'pen now. S. Johnson is what he's - useful swingman. Wada is question mark at the point, he probably start as a reliever and then get some innings as a rotation guy. Bundy and Gausman are probably late call ups.

Most likely those guys are worth a gamble - Liriano, Haren and E. Jackson.

In my try to make list with expendable starters, i have this; Collmenter from Dbaks, Jurrjens from Braves, Porcello from Tigers, Harang from Dodgers, Niese and Gee from Mets (probably Mets not a good trade partner now).

Some another nothing special option but guys with good expierence - Blanton, Bedard, Feldman (i'd love to sign him), Stauffer, Karstens.

I'll be more than happy to sign Feldman and give a short term try at Liriano for example. Probably won't happen.

[weams]

http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/kirk-minihane/2012/11/21/red-sox-should-stay-away-josh-hamilton

[Bulgaria]

Hamilton's on big decline, sadly. But he still can be elite hitter. His defense is nonfactor, he's close to useless as a center fielder. The thing here is that if you can secure Hamilton for something like three years, you take the risk. But he's not worth the gamble. Anything more than two or three years is gonna hunt every franchise. I'm for it but on short term.

[Bulgaria]

If we magically sign Hamilton for three or four years, that probably means next year Chris Davis is our first baseman, Reimold and Betemit shares duties as a DH. Reimold still can operate as a left fielder on some night while Hamilton DH'd.

Our problem is that we love to add complete and solid player but we do not have pieces. We like Butler but M's can afford to offer Paxton. The best way to add impact bat right now is free agency. Swisher is another great guy. I know, he was beyond pathetic against us, but his bat is pretty impact all season long. I prefer to take a risk with Hamilton/ Swisher at three or four years than to trade Gausman/ Bundy for good but not great player in Butler's mold.