Bradford traded to Tampa Bay for player to be named later

[Roll Tide]

The Rays claimed the submarining right-hander on waivers and then got him from the Orioles in a trade for a player to be named.

"A very interesting acquisition," Tampa Bay manager Joe Maddon said before his surprising team opened a road trip at Seattle. "No hitter says, 'Oh good, we have a sinkerballer coming in.'

"It's a different weapon that we haven't had," he said.

The 33-year-old Bradford is 3-3 with a 2.45 ERA this year. The durable reliever has made 47 appearances and thrown 40 1/3 innings.

Doesn't Sound like a salary dump aquisition !

Even better for a team expecting to make the playoffs for the first time: He has a 0.00 ERA in 17 postseason games spanning 15 1/3 innings -- no active reliever has pitched more innings in the playoffs without giving up a run.

Doesn't Sound like a salary dump aquisition !

"This guy's a groundball pitcher. He's durable. He's been very successful in the postseason. And I've heard he's a great guy," Maddon said. "He doesn't give up home runs very often. He gives up singles. Doesn't walk people."

Doesn't Sound like a salary dump aquisition !

Maybe they are priming thier fans to what they might have had to give up to get the "pocket picker" to allow the claim/trade to happen!

[byrdz]

So most of you feel that McPhail got us Brignac or is it just wishful thinking I'm seeing in this thread? Sure would be nice!

[Cokeman]

So most of you feel that McPhail got us Brignac or is it just wishful thinking I'm seeing in this thread? Sure would be nice!

Never say never, but I think its more just wishful thinking...I'm expecting more of a AA pitcher who has struggled, but still has some upside.

[Skywalker76]

To be quite honest I would be dissapointed if we only got some Adam Stern typer of player back for a reliever who was very consistent and if having a similar season in 2009 will be at least a type B like FA.

I think a lot of people will be quite surprised by what the Orioles will receive in November.

[Anonymous]

I disagree with both of these. There's no doubt in my mind that we could have traded Bradford - a solid middle reliever who only has a 1-year/3.5 contract - in November for a decent player. I'll be disappointed if this is purely a salary dump. On the other hand, I don't expect a Brignac type of player in return. Some b level prospect would be nice.

There may be no doubt in YOUR mind. But there's a lot of doubt in my mind that you know MORE than Andy MacPhail about what Andy MacPhail was offered in a trade for Bradford.

Do you really think that he was offered a decent player for Bradford last week, turned down the offer, and then proceeded a week later to dump him for less value? (Or that he neglected to seek offers for Bradford during July???) This defies common sense. If the player he gets back now is less than what you'd consider decent, then it clearly indicates that he failed to receive an offer for a decent player before. So you might be disappointed in the haul we got for Bradford. But it's silly to proclaim (with "no doubt") that we could have gotten more.

[wildcard]

Bradford is definitely a least a Type B free agent. He might be a Type A. Because Tampa is top half in the standing that means that Type A nets a first rounder and a sandwich pick. Type B nets a sandwich pick. Bradford compensation should be somewhere in that range.

The $3.5M in salary is just the going rank for a top ranked veteran reliever. Maybe the market is a little higher then that now. That might be a salary dump to a building team like the O's but it is the cost of getting to and going deep into the playoffs for Tampa. It really should not affect the player the the O's get that much.

Because of what has been published about the Jason Bay negotiation people think that Price, Davis and Hellickson are untouchable. But that leaves McGee, Houser, Niemann, Mason and Talbot among the high minors starters. To me, Bradford compensation is likely to be one of these pitchers.

[Mackus]

Everyone keeps talking about Bradford, FA, and compensation picks. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Bradford isn't even a FA until after 2009, right?

Yep. We're talking about the possibility of getting a sandwich pick in the 2010 draft for Bradford. Its not even a definite.

A 50% chance of getting about the 40th pick in the 2010 draft really isn't all that valuable, 25% chance of getting two picks in that range, and a 25% chance of getting nothing really isn't all that valuable. Change the percentages around if you like, but the bottom line, is if you are saying "you have to get back value comparable to two 2010 draft picks", you really don't need to get a very good player to match that value.

Just like money, prospects now are worth more than prospects in the future.

[wildcard]

Everyone keeps talking about Bradford, FA, and compensation picks. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Bradford isn't even a FA until after 2009, right?

Of course you are right. But don't you think that where he ranks at the time he is traded helps set the compensation level?

[wildcard]

Yep. We're talking about the possibility of getting a sandwich pick in the 2010 draft for Bradford. Its not even a definite.

A 50% chance of getting about the 40th pick in the 2010 draft really isn't all that valuable, 25% chance of getting two picks in that range, and a 25% chance of getting nothing really isn't all that valuable. Change the percentages around if you like, but the bottom line, is if you are saying "you have to get back value comparable to two 2010 draft picks", you really don't need to get a very good player to match that value.

Just like money, prospects now are worth more than prospects in the future.

McGee was a 5th rounder, Talbot and Mason were 2nd rounders. However at the beginning of the year BA ranked McGee the 2nd best pitcher in the Rays system. So the O's would not have to get a 1st rounder back to get a pitcher with pretty good potential.

[Mackus]

McGee was a 5th rounder, Talbot and Mason were 2nd rounders. However at the beginning of the year BA ranked McGee the 2nd best pitcher in the Rays system. So the O's would not have to get a 1st rounder back to get a pitcher with pretty good potential.

I think you're missing my point.

The value of a former 5th round pick who has met or exceeded expectations is far superior to the value of a potential supplemental pick in two years. Talbot, Mason, and McGee are all far more valuable than the potential of getting a supplemental pick in the 2010 draft when Bradford walks.

Think of it as the time value of money except with an insanely high interest rate.

[Crazysilver03]

Bradford is definitely a least a Type B free agent. He might be a Type A. Because Tampa is top half in the standing that means that Type A nets a first rounder and a sandwich pick. Type B nets a sandwich pick. Bradford compensation should be somewhere in that range.

This has nothing to do about the selection. If the team that SIGNS a Type A Free Agent is the 1st to 15th best team, it costs them their first rounder. If the team is the 16th-30th best, then signing someone like Bradford would forfeit their second rounder.

[wildcard]

I think you're missing my point.

The value of a former 5th round pick who has met or exceeded expectations is far superior to the value of a potential supplemental pick in two years. Talbot, Mason, and McGee are all far more valuable than the potential of getting a supplemental pick in the 2010 draft when Bradford walks.

Think of it as the time value of money except with an insanely high interest rate.

However a pitcher like Talbot who has spend two years at AAA and is still having trouble getting his ERA under 4.00 may not be as valuable to the Rays when measured against the potential of the other pitchers in the system even though he was a 2nd rounder. How is that for a run on sentence.

Also the fact that 2nd rounder Mason has an ERA over 6.00 at AAA even after a great AA season last year may make him more available.

[Mackus]

However a pitcher like Talbot who has spend two years at AAA and is still having trouble getting his ERA under 4.00 may not be as valuable to the Rays when measured against the potential of the other pitchers in the system even though he was a 2nd rounder. How is that for a run on sentence.

Just because the Rays have guys that are more valuable, doesn't make Talbot less valuable.

I've been saying all season long that Bradford is worth about an organizational top 15-20 prospect. Thats assuming an average farm system. So if a farm system is very bad, then maybe he gets you someone in the 10-15 range. If its very good, then its someone in the 20-25 range.

[wildcard]

Just because the Rays have guys that are more valuable, doesn't make Talbot less valuable.

I've been saying all season long that Bradford is worth about an organizational top 15-20 prospect. Thats assuming an average farm system. So if a farm system is very bad, then maybe he gets you someone in the 10-15 range. If its very good, then its someone in the 20-25 range.

Sounds about right. But whos ranking when? BA ranked Talbot 21st at the beginning for the year and Mason 10th. However Talbot has done better then Mason this year. I think it comes down to where Tampa and the O's project these guys to be going forward in their systems.

[rolliefingers]

Do you really think that he was offered a decent player for Bradford last week, turned down the offer, and then proceeded a week later to dump him for less value? (Or that he neglected to seek offers for Bradford during July???) This defies common sense. If the player he gets back now is less than what you'd consider decent, then it clearly indicates that he failed to receive an offer for a decent player before. So you might be disappointed in the haul we got for Bradford. But it's silly to proclaim (with "no doubt") that we could have gotten more.

No, I think that no team was offering anything because they anticipated that we'd be trying to pass him through waivers, so why not just claim him and work something out in August?

Keep in mind, though, that TB was one of the last teams to have a shot at Bradford, so it's not like teams were clamoring for him.