Should the O's be considering 3B/2B Josh Harrison this off season?

[NCRaven]

3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

There should be no plan where Mateo is handed a starting job.  I do like him as a UTI guy though and if he ends up playing his way into a starters position, so be it.

I wouldn't "hand" anyone a job.  But, I would like to see Mateo given an extended look in 2022 to see what we have there.  I liked what I saw in a limited look.  We need to see if he is more than a utility or AAAA player.

[Sports Guy]

17 minutes ago, LTO's said:

Ok, I'll bite....What makes a young SS firmly in his prime, coming off a 7 WAR season more of a risk than a 30 year old corner OF? Even if you could give a satisfactory answer to that, you also aren't looking at the current situation with this roster. The Orioles actually have the 5th highest OF/DH wRC+ in all of baseball. They also have the third most OF/DH HR in all of baseball. They have another potential 20-30 HR OF knocking on the door as well as two other blue chip OF prospects who could move fast. They need to be prioritizing above average defensive infielders with pop. Bryant isn't that guy. I'd rather give Javy Baez the money you are giving Bryant and I don't think I'd even hesitate with that decision. He's actually been better than Bryant this year and he's younger and still a SS who could easily move to 2B/3B eventually. 

From 2017-2019, he didn’t appear in more than 110 games.

Bryant and Correa debuted in MLB the same year and Bryant is worth 7 more WAR.

Bryant isnt some butcher at third.  You are greatly overreacting to his defense as of right now.  We agree that it will be an issue in a few years and he likely won’t stay at third long term but he can still play there now.

Baez is about to turn 29.  He’s an intriguing option but I think he’s wAnts glitz and glamour.  He seems to be a guy like that, so I dont think he’s a likely signing for us.  
 

To be honest with you, I think all of these guys are extremely risky.  If we are talking the FA route, I like Bryant aging well and keeping up his value whether it’s in the OF or first.  I think his bat will stay strong, especially in our park, that he will have value anywhere he plays.  
 

But look at the SS..Correa and Seager have health issues.  Story’s having an off year, he’s about to turn 29 and his career OPs on the road is almost 250 points less than at home in Coors.  Simien has had his recent issues.

The stat you brought up is great but the bottom line is that our current OF is completely unreliable.  
 

We will wait and see on Mullins but no one should be going into the offseason feeling great about Santander and Hays.  On top of that, we don’t know how long Mancini will be here, who has helped with that stat.  
 

Beyond that, we agree about the long term viability of the OF but it wasn’t long ago where we thought Diaz was a long term guy and Mullins was garbage…things change fast.  Personally, I don’t feel Stowers or Neustrom will be everyday guys but I do want to see them get a chance.  And of course we still know nothing about Kjerstad.

One thing I will say is that the best case scenario would be to get a Nolan Jones or someone like that, for third or SS (ie, an up and coming young player with high upside who is attainable) and spend the money elsewhere.

[Sports Guy]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2948617-fresh-predictions-for-top-2021-22-mlb-free-agents-with-offseason-approaching.amp.html
 

Btw, if this article is right, GTFO all of these guys except Stroman..I would beat that offer and not think twice about it.

[NCRaven]

I wish Stroman could be had for 3 years, but I'm sure 4 is more likely.  I just don't think that long-term contracts for free agent pitchers in their 30's is a great way to go.  I would hate to see another Cobb situation for the Orioles.

[Sports Guy]

10 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

I wish Stroman could be had for 3 years, but I'm sure 4 is more likely.  I just don't think that long-term contracts for free agent pitchers in their 30's is a great way to go.  I would hate to see another Cobb situation for the Orioles.

I hate it too…but I think Stroman could be an exception to the rule because of how he pitches. I worry less about him wearing down vs a power arm.

But we aren’t going to sign the perfect player.  FA doesn’t allow for that.  At some point, risks have to be taken.  It’s just a matter of mitigating the risks as much as possible.

[Aristotelian]

26 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I hate it too…but I think Stroman could be an exception to the rule because of how he pitches. I worry less about him wearing down vs a power arm.

But we aren’t going to sign the perfect player.  FA doesn’t allow for that.  At some point, risks have to be taken.  It’s just a matter of mitigating the risks as much as possible.

If going budget on 3B enabled us to get a Stroman/Gausman/Gray/Desclafini would you reconsider on Bryant? Highly doubt we're getting both. 

[Ruzious]

Syndergaard is no Stroman, but he could make a comeback and will obviously be much cheaper and therefore much more realistic - especially considering Stroman is a NYer, and the Mets undoubtedly want him back.  Noah is scheduled to make his MLB comeback tonight - probably just an inning - from the UCL tear - so he's basically missed 2 years - but he did pitch 197 innings the year before.  High risk but high reward.  Just turned 29, but the hair may be past its prime.     

[Sports Guy]

36 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

If going budget on 3B enabled us to get a Stroman/Gausman/Gray/Desclafini would you reconsider on Bryant? Highly doubt we're getting both. 

I have very little desire to acquire any of those starters outside of Stroman.

And yes, if I had to choose, I’m paying Stroman.  I think he’s #1 on my FA list.  He just makes a ton of sense for this team in so many ways.

[Sports Guy]

43 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

Syndergaard is no Stroman, but he could make a comeback and will obviously be much cheaper and therefore much more realistic - especially considering Stroman is a NYer, and the Mets undoubtedly want him back.  Noah is scheduled to make his MLB comeback tonight - probably just an inning - from the UCL tear - so he's basically missed 2 years - but he did pitch 197 innings the year before.  High risk but high reward.  Just turned 29, but the hair may be past its prime.     

He will sign a pillow contract and no pitcher is signing that in Baltimore unless they have no options.

I would love to sign him though. 

[Aristotelian]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I have very little desire to acquire any of those starters outside of Stroman.

And yes, if I had to choose, I’m paying Stroman.  I think he’s #1 on my FA list.  He just makes a ton of sense for this team in so many ways.

OK, something we can agree on! Stroman would be my top choice but I would be open to any of the others for the right price. 

[Sports Guy]

I would sign Gray or Gausman…but they wouldn’t even consider the offers I would pay, so it wouldn’t be worth the phone call.

[spiritof66]

7 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

For what?  Iglesias was terrible this year.  

This past offseason, those guys made sense because of where the team decided to go.  None of these aging, mediocre at best players make sense if you are actually trying to be significantly better as a ML team.

Are the Orioles going to "try to be significantly better" in 2022? I'm not so sure.

Let's suppose Elias says to John Angelos (I believe he's the team's principal decision-maker since he's the only Angelos identified as a club officer), "If we're going to be significantly better in 2022, we 're going to need to add some better players from outside the system -- a couple of infielders and a starting pitcher, maybe a backup catcher. We might be able to pick up one of those guys in a trade, but I'm not confident we can do that unless we give up one of our really good prospects. So we may need to rely on free agents that we would sign to one- or two-year contracts. The market for the better guys is going to be competitive -- there are a lot of teams who think they're one or two additions from competing for a division title. So I'm thinking about adding $25 million to our payroll, total. [Fill in your own number, if you like.]

Angelos's reply might well be, "With these higher-level free agents, we will still be a last-place team in 2022, right? Are these free agents guys who will be around to contribute when the Orioles can compete in the AL East in a few years -- you won't say how many years?" Elias would have to agree it's a last-place team but that's just because the division they're in yada yada yada. He could say there might be a keeper among the signees who will be around to play on a contending Oriole team if he's extended or re-signed or signed with a team option that's exercised.

If there were such a discussion, I would expect Angelos to say something like, "I'm not going to spend $25 or $20 million of my Dad's money so that our last-place team can win a few more games. Let me know when a free agent or two will enable the team to compete in the division, and we'll take a close look. I know that's not the expectation for 2022. For next year's free agents, I hope you can fill in those spots by adding $6 to $8 million in payroll, but you've got $10 million."

Freddie Galvis, come on down! You too, Matt Harvey!

[Sports Guy]

Well, we don’t know if ownership is committed to winning.  I don’t think they are, so I do think all of this conversation is a moot point but hey, we need something to talk about, so why not.

[backwardsk]

Harrison is guy you may be able to get if they overpay a little.  I’m talking 1yr/4-5M.  He has more value to a competitive team that can use him in a utility role, IMO.  If we offered him $1M and other teams offer him spring invites, I can see him going for a Spring invite.  If he’s offered $1M from competitive clubs, and we offer him $4M, he may consider us.

These other guys being discussed (Correa, Bryant, Seager, Baez, etc) aren’t coming here unless we massively overbid.  Why would they want to come here?  They’ll have other offers.  And if we do overbid, then we won’t have the payroll flexibility to make other necessary improvements.

[Sports Guy]

8 minutes ago, backwardsk said:

Harrison is guy you may be able to get if they overpay a little.  I’m talking 1yr/4-5M.  He has more value to a competitive team that can use him in a utility role, IMO.  If we offered him $1M and other teams offer him spring invites, I can see him going for a Spring invite.  If he’s offered $1M from competitive clubs, and we offer him $4M, he may consider us.

These other guys being discussed (Correa, Bryant, Seager, Baez, etc) aren’t coming here unless we massively overbid.  Why would they want to come here?  They’ll have other offers.  And if we do overbid, then we won’t have the payroll flexibility to make other necessary improvements.

Yes they will.