Do you believe the O's will call up Henderson this season?

[Roll Tide]

34 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

Yeah, I’m assuming Hall comes around and Grayson is throwing and able to be hidden for a while. If I’m Elias, I’m allowing for the possibility of competing in the post season.

I’m probably holding both back until next season. Especially if it allows for another season of control. 

[LookinUp]

17 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I’m probably holding both back until next season. Especially if it allows for another season of control. 

No chance I am if we have a legit playoff opportunity and studs to contribute.

Edited August 7, 2022 by LookinUp

[oriolefan1035]

25 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

No chance I am if we have a legit playoff opportunity and studs to contribute.

This is the only correct answer to this. You play to win the game - if we continue to push for the playoffs and Gunnar, GrayRod, and Hall can all help that pursuit, you call them up. Besides, what team wants to face a couple of top end arms in the playoffs that there is little MLB video on?

[Frobby]

10 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Yes..but as Frobby pointed out, it’s not just days, it’s at bats, which is 130.  

I think August 23 is the date at which he’ll be sure not to accumulate 45 days of service.   They’d still probably need to hold him out of some games to keep him under 130 at bats.  I’m hoping they do it, so that can_of_corn can have a case of apoplexy when they do.  

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I think August 23 is the date at which he’ll be sure not to accumulate 45 days of service.   They’d still probably need to hold him out of some games to keep him under 130 at bats.  I’m hoping they do it, so that can_of_corn can have a case of apoplexy when they do.  

I'd prefer that to holding him back longer.

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, LookinUp said:

No chance I am if we have a legit playoff opportunity and studs to contribute.

 

1 hour ago, oriolefan1035 said:

This is the only correct answer to this. You play to win the game - if we continue to push for the playoffs and Gunnar, GrayRod, and Hall can all help that pursuit, you call them up. Besides, what team wants to face a couple of top end arms in the playoffs that there is little MLB video on?

I hear you but wait and see what Elias does. He’s pretty deliberate and they gave Hall a pep talk a few weeks ago. Since the he hasn’t been producing. I doubt the are going push Gray Rod. The same folks calling for these moves are the ones saying Elias wouldn’t trade Mancini or Lopez. 

[oriolefan1035]

3 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

 

I hear you but wait and see what Elias does. He’s pretty deliberate and they gave Hall a pep talk a few weeks ago. Since the he hasn’t been producing. I doubt the are going push Gray Rod. The same folks calling for these moves are the ones saying Elias wouldn’t trade Mancini or Lopez. 

For what it’s worth, I’d still rather have Mancini and Lopez over the lottery tickets that we got. It basically comes down to 2022 value vs future value. I’m not sure we got any future value out of those trades. Maybe some guys that can flourish in the pen, but none of them have been dominating their way through the minors - the TJS guy is the only one with good numbers and he’s old for his league and on the shelf now. With that in mind, losing Mancini and Lopez is easier to accept if we backfill them with our minor league talent. With Vavra getting consistent at bats and performing well in his SSS so far, we’re not missing Mancini’s production.

[dbmillertime]

7 minutes ago, oriolefan1035 said:

For what it’s worth, I’d still rather have Mancini and Lopez over the lottery tickets that we got. It basically comes down to 2022 value vs future value. I’m not sure we got any future value out of those trades. Maybe some guys that can flourish in the pen, but none of them have been dominating their way through the minors - the TJS guy is the only one with good numbers and he’s old for his league and on the shelf now. With that in mind, losing Mancini and Lopez is easier to accept if we backfill them with our minor league talent. With Vavra getting consistent at bats and performing well in his SSS so far, we’re not missing Mancini’s production.

Cade Povich’s line last night: 6IP, 1H, 0 runs, 0 walks, 8K

[oriolefan1035]

58 minutes ago, dbmillertime said:

Cade Povich’s line last night: 6IP, 1H, 0 runs, 0 walks, 8K

Good start for him. Hopefully these Birds in the bush outvalue the one we already had in hand. Yet to be seen though.

[bpilktree]

I think people are way over reacting to the 40 man roster crunch.  I don’t believe there is any crunch at all really this season.  Elias has pretty much stayed at between 24-26 pitchers on the 40 man throughout every season when I check including in the off season.  So I assume we stay in that same area again this off season giving us 14-16 spots.  I am only going to look at the positional players for this.

Staying 

1. Rutschman

2. Mountcastle 

3. Urias

4. Mateo

5. Varva

6. Mullins

7. Hays

8. McKenna

9. Santander (could be traded at some point but will have to be protected til then)

10. Stowers (will be at majors some point this season or must be added in off season) 

Must be added 

11.  Ortiz 

Could be added

Handley, Neustrom, Hall

Guys on 40 man but will be free agents currently on 40 man and gone off 40 man Odor & Chirinos 

Then you have a list of guys that are currently on 40 that can be DFA’s and we wouldn’t miss any of them and similar type players could be guys they bring in on minor league deal with spring invite  

Arauz, Nevin, Bannon, Martin, Phillips, Diaz. 
 

I expect one of Nevin or Bannon to be released for Stowers some point this season.  Then before the 40 man has to be set ME can pick any combination would like.  I don’t expect Phillips to be paid Arb 2 money next season.

If you add Henderson at some point you just DFA one of those guys now instead of waiting til off season 

You have 11 guys right now that will be on the 40 man that gives you 3-5 spots to play around with.  If you add Henderson that gives you 12 but you still have plenty of room on 40 man.  I actually think they might add Handley as he would be a guy a rebuilding team could select and get away with stashing as 2nd catcher because of his defense in the rule 5 then add a veteran on minor league deal that doesn’t need to be on 40 man til season starts. 

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, oriolefan1035 said:

For what it’s worth, I’d still rather have Mancini and Lopez over the lottery tickets that we got. It basically comes down to 2022 value vs future value. I’m not sure we got any future value out of those trades. Maybe some guys that can flourish in the pen, but none of them have been dominating their way through the minors - the TJS guy is the only one with good numbers and he’s old for his league and on the shelf now. With that in mind, losing Mancini and Lopez is easier to accept if we backfill them with our minor league talent. With Vavra getting consistent at bats and performing well in his SSS so far, we’re not missing Mancini’s production.

Saying we got lottery tickets diminish your argument. 18 year old DSL guys are lottery tickets. Players that slot into the top 30 of the number 1 farm system in baseball are not. But, whatever meets your narrative I guess.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Roll Tide

[oriolefan1035]

12 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Saying we got lottery tickets diminish your argument. 18 year old DSL guys are lottery tickets. Players that slot into the top 30 of the number 1 farm system in baseball are not. But, whatever meets your narrative I guess.

Using subjective non-consensus top 30 rankings is fitting your narrative. What are the odds these guys become quality MLB players? It’s not like we got top 100 guys in return with a high likelihood of making it to that level. Maybe they will. The likelihood isn’t real high though.

[Morgan423]

1 hour ago, oriolefan1035 said:

For what it’s worth, I’d still rather have Mancini and Lopez over the lottery tickets that we got. It basically comes down to 2022 value vs future value. I’m not sure we got any future value out of those trades.

Since we traded from a position of strength, and have immediate people to step in to provide theose guys' production in the short term, you just need these acquired dudes to produce more value in the future than this last half season of Mancini and the next couple of years of Jorge Lopez to win these trades (assuming you pick up all of Lopez's arb years).

From what Twins fans were saying about Povich, it feels like Povich and post-rehab Johnson alone are going to do that.  Chayce McDermott may be pretty good if he can work out his control issues as well.  And then after that you have three other guys (more lottery tickets sure, but the chances of one hitting are not zero).

Ultimately time will tell on this trade, but at this point I'm pretty optimistic that we got this one right.

Edited August 7, 2022 by Morgan423
typo fingers

[oriolefan1035]

13 minutes ago, Morgan423 said:

Since we traded from a position of strength, and have immediate people to step in to provide theose guys' production in the short term, you just need these acquired dudes to produce more value in the future than this last half season of Mancini and the next couple of years of Jorge Lopez to win these trades (assuming you pick up all of Lopez's arb years).

From what Twins fans were saying about Povich, it feels like Povich and post-rehab Johnson alone are going to do that.  Chayce McDermott may be pretty good if he can work out his control issues as well.  And then after that you have three other guys (more lottery tickets sure, but the chances of one hitting are not zero).

Ultimately time will tell on this trade, but at this point I'm pretty optimistic that we got this one right.

I’m looking at it this way. If we call up GrayRod, Hall, and Henderson in the stretch run this year, I think we’re going to be more competitive in the playoffs than most folks think. I think the odds  that the amount Mancini and Lopez would help us there exceeds the amount any of these guys will help us in future years.

Is what it is at this point. I’m done beating this dead horse that Roll Tide dragged back onto the track lol. Hopefully time will indicate that we made the right moves.

[Sports Guy]

Whether you believe in the Os chances to contend this or not, the fact is they are contending and have a shot.  
 

I get that they are winning and that makes it easier to prolong calling up Henderson and Stowers and whoever else but the fact is, this lineup has struggled for the most part and these guys can potentially be much better than what is here.

We should be more concerned about winning games and trying to make the playoffs than the potential for a draft pick in 2024.