The Third Base Market - Ramon Urias Trade Speculation

[Just Regular]

Now mostly complete following yesterday's Brian Anderson and Jeimer Candelario non-tenders.

Steamer blending its rates and Fangraphs playing time guesses see Gunnar in 619 PA and R. Urias in 510 PA producing the 7th and 22nd most 2023 WAR among players it classifies as 3B.

BAL second-best option Urias is only the second highest MLB-wide second place finisher on his own Club; for TBR it sees Yandy 9th and Isaac Paredes 15th, so they also may have a 3B option for someone.

Steamer does project Ramon Urias about a half win better than top FA Justin Turner and Brandon Drury, with Longoria still almost another full win behind those guys.    

Urias has the Gold Glove, one more year at minimum wage, and the peculiar situation of being a GG guy who maybe doesn't project as his team's starter at the position next year.   That's a tough sell for a manager if you want to trim back his role for the good of the Club.

Gunnar is in some ways a Machado re-run.    With the benefit of hindsight, any supposing BAL may have had a better chance of keeping him longer term if at the beginning of his career they'd made JJ Hardy move, and put him at the six to begin.      Of course 10 years ago there wasn't another super stud like Holliday just a couple years off, nor much at all save future Andrew Miller trade things.

Edited November 20, 2022 by Just Regular

[waroriole]

They could’ve resigned Manny if they made him a fair contract offer. 
 

Elias should be shopping one of Urias or Mateo, depending on where he thinks Gunnar should play. 

[tabletop]

I think Longoria would be a great signing if he’s willing to be a backup corner infielder / platoon player. He still hits lefties well and can backup 1B and 3B. 

[sportsfan8703]

What a difference a year makes. We started out last year with handing the job to Kelvin Guiterrez, largely because of his defense and exit velos. Then… Urias wins a GG there, Gunnar went from Bowie starting in Bowie to an .800 OPS in the MLB. Westburg is fully baked in AAA, and Joey Ortiz is right behind him. 
 

3B is just not a position of need for us. Thankfully. 

[tntoriole]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

What a difference a year makes. We started out last year with handing the job to Kelvin Guiterrez, largely because of his defense and exit velos. Then… Urias wins a GG there, Gunnar went from Bowie starting in Bowie to an .800 OPS in the MLB. Westburg is fully baked in AAA, and Joey Ortiz is right behind him. 
 

3B is just not a position of need for us. Thankfully. 

Used to be a guy named Brooks was the reason for the last statement.  

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

 

3B is just not a position of need for us. Thankfully. 

I assume the point of this thread is to consider what players would be alternatives to Urias for other teams if we decided to market Urias.

[wildcard]

I was not sure what Just Regular was driving at and I am not at all sure what "what players would be alternatives to Urias for other teams if we decided to market Urias." means????

[RZNJ]

Here's what he's saying.   If Gunnar is the 3B, then Urias, who just won a GG isn't going to be happy being moved to 2B or asked to be a utility guy.  "Hey!  I just won a freakin GG at 3B!!!".    Two other 3B were just non-tendered.   Teams need a 3B.   Ramon Urias.  Prime trade bait!

[wildcard]

39 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Here's what he's saying.   If Gunnar is the 3B, then Urias, who just won a GG isn't going to be happy being moved to 2B or asked to be a utility guy.  "Hey!  I just won a freakin GG at 3B!!!".    Two other 3B were just non-tendered.   Teams need a 3B.   Ramon Urias.  Prime trade bait!

Thanks.  I don't think Urias would have any trouble moving to 2B.   But the point is well taken that he has trade value at 3B.

But here is something to think about.   What if the O's begin with Mateo at  SS but he does not hit.   6 weeks into the season they have to make a move to get more offense.

Without the shift the O's SS with the most range are IMO: Mateo, Gunnar, Ortiz,   Westburg.   And Ortiz is still at AAA trying to prove he can hit.     So they move Gunnar to SS.    

In that case Urias is the O's best replacement for Gunnar at 3B.

Edited November 19, 2022 by wildcard

[Camden Yards]

Why not just play Urias at 3B, Gunnar at SS, and Mateo at 2B. Westburg serves as the utility guy. 

[wildcard]

Probably because Mateo is an amazing SS.   And if he hits even at an average level he is a game changer.

[RZNJ]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

Thanks.  I don't think Urias would have any trouble moving to 2B.   But the point is well taken that he has trade value at 3B.

But here is something to think about.   What if the O's begin with Mateo at  SS but he does not hit.   6 weeks into the season they have to make a move to get more offense.

Without the shift the O's SS with the most range are IMO: Mateo, Gunnar, Ortiz,   Westburg.   And Ortiz is still at AAA trying to prove he can hit.     So they move Gunnar to SS.    

In that case Urias is the O's best replacement for Gunnar at 3B.

Ortiz already proved he could hit.  

[wildcard]

10 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Ortiz already proved he could hit.  

From Tony:    "While the defense is no doubt major league ready, the question is whether Ortiz’s bat is for real or whether he was just on an incredibly heater."

Are you disagree with him?

Edited November 19, 2022 by wildcard

[Just Regular]

1 hour ago, wildcard said:

Thanks.  I don't think Urias would have any trouble moving to 2B.   But the point is well taken that he has trade value at 3B.

I believe if Urias fielded 2B decently in 2021 Rougned Odor may never have been an Oriole.    Rolling back one year, the only angle to Odor that ever made any sense was he was a lot better with the glove (by OAA's rate stat at least) in 2021.

I think Urias showed this year he has that ~0.1 seconds skill set to play 3B, but feel the Club has settled its evaluation they don't want him at 2B where foot speed or lack thereof in ~0.5 seconds matters more.   It said something to me in September they played 3B Urias, SS Mateo, 2B Gunnar infields when it was about the fourth game in Gunnar's life doing that.   

If Urias genuinely had 3B/2B flex, why that configuration?    I think Ramon Urias earned a starting 3B role for next year in MLB, but I don't feel he's a middle infielder anymore.

[owknows]

I like Urias....  But you really need more than a .305 OBP  out of your 3B