LA Angels

[rolliefingers]

Which is why i think we would have to get Kotchman back in this deal.

An Escobar and Kotchman for Gibbons and Javy deal would be a solid trade.

Think we could sub Lackey or Santana for Escobar if we ate some contract?

Sike. This is the Orioles, what was I thinking?

[Sports Guy]

Think we could sub Lackey or Santana for Escobar if we ate some contract?

Sike. This is the Orioles, what was I thinking?

I really think it is unrealistic to think we could get Lackey or Santana.

[NewMarketSean]

I don't see this move happening. Not in a million years. The O's just locked up Gibbons and he is the #3 "fan favorite" on the team.

We need more hitting, not more pitching -- especially if we are bringing up Penn and possibly Loewen in the next few weeks and trying to build our rotation that way.

[wse120372]

I'm in the "do the deal" camp as well. Jay is a nice player but sometimes I think he is a slightly better Tony Batista. His .315 career OBP says it all. He can get hot for stretches and make you say "wow" but in the end Jay is someone that can be replaced.

I would put Markakis in right and tell him to relax because he will be there for the next 5 years.

Plus, you can't help but wonder how close the front office thinks Riemold is. If they think he is will be ready next year then Gibby for a starting pitcher makes sense. Then a young pitcher for a young first baseman can be done.

Leowen for Daric Barton anyone?

[clapdiddy]

Unless the Angels have a stud prospect ready to step into the rotation, I can't see them dealing Lackey or Santana.

I'd take either of them for Gibbons, but I don't see it happening. Maybe if we were to acquire a pitcher like that, we'd be more willing to deal a prospect (like Penn or Loewen) for a big bat we've been looking for?

[rolliefingers]

I don't see this move happening. Not in a million years. The O's just locked up Gibbons and he is the #3 "fan favorite" on the team.

We need more hitting, not more pitching -- especially if we are bringing up Penn and possibly Loewen in the next few weeks and trying to build our rotation that way.

You can never have too much pitching.

As much as I like Kotchman, I'd vastly prefer to get Lackey, Santana or Adenhart.

Like it or not, Gibbons is replaceable. He's an average RF, on both sides of the ball. His OBP is subpar. If you can trade an aging catcher and average RF for an ML-ready potential ace, I think you have to do it.

Honestly, I'll take the temporary hit in offense to improve our pitching immediately.

Edit: that said, I agree that it's unlikely the LAA trade those guys. Kotchman and Escobar is more likely, and I would do that deal.

[NewMarketSean]

You can never have too much pitching.

As much as I like Kotchman, I'd vastly prefer to get Lackey, Santana or Adenhart.

Like it or not, Gibbons is replaceable. He's an average RF, on both sides of the ball. His OBP is subpar. If you can trade an aging catcher and average RF for an ML-ready potential ace, I think you have to do it.

Honestly, I'll take the temporary hit in offense to improve our pitching immediately.

Edit: that said, I agree that it's unlikely the LAA trade those guys. Kotchman and Escobar is more likely, and I would do that deal.

I agree you can never have too much pitching... but you also need hitting to win as well. I also agree that Gibbons is replaceable, but this team isn't able to repalce good players.

OF is a place we should be upgrading, not downgrading.

[mikezpen]

A month ago, we thought the starting rotation w/b the best we've had in years. Now with the collapse of Chen and Lopez, it's one of the worst.

But I'm inclined to go getting w/hitting over pitching, anyway. There IS pitching on the horizon. We do have Penn close to being ready, Loewen's coming whether he's ready or not, and Liz could even be in the picture next year since he's been so dominant in high-A. Then there are stop-gaps like Birkins or maybe Dubose. And who knows, maybe Chen or Rodrigo could find himself, still.

But outside of Markakis who is struggling, the farm system has nothing on the horizon, hitting wise, for 2 years unless Reimold really moves. So go get hitting.

However if they do go for pitching, no way Gibbons for Ecobar, 30, who's been little more than a journeyman.Lackey or Santana or forget it.The Angels need that trade more than the Orioles do, anyway.I'd gladly throw in the Lopezes for Kotchman and maybe a prospect, if we can get him.

I've felt from the beginning of the year that the Angels and Orioles could pull off a deal.

[olehippi]

This is my first experience with a WB post that says "stay tuned" about a significant trade. So, I don't know what to think. But let's not worry about that. Here's a couple questions:

1. If the O's trade Gibbons for pitching, and especially if Javy goes along, then exactly who is gonna knock in runs around here? Jay is #4. Another few games of getting hits, plus a dinger or two, and Javy's #6 (if not #5). So if they're gone, then what?

2. If the answer is that the O's are then gonna turn around and get a hitter or two who are as good or better, who are those guys?

3. Whoever those guys are, why don't the Angels just go get them and cut out the middle man?

Introducing logical, sensible questions to this discussion is inexcusible!....

But the answers to them are the reason the trade will likely never happen.

[Frobby]

I don't see this move happening. Not in a million years. The O's just locked up Gibbons and he is the #3 "fan favorite" on the team.

We need more hitting, not more pitching -- especially if we are bringing up Penn and possibly Loewen in the next few weeks and trying to build our rotation that way.

It sorts of depends on what you are looking to do. For 2006, we have a pretty good offense and bad pitching right now. Trading Jay for pitching meets an immediate need. Longer term, however, we have plenty of young pitching talent and virtually no young hitters. So to me a straight-up trade of Jay for a good pitcher isn't a good long-term move.

[Brando]

If we pick up a top pitcher what are the chances of Loewen being brought up for an audition, then being dealt for a big bat?

[bluedog]

I'm not complaining either, I just don't think they've been very good. I also don't care that much about win totals, and I certainly don't care much about win total projections based on 1/4 of the season.

Bedard: 4.18 ERA, 51.7 innings, 31 K's, 21 BB, 5 hr's given up. That's not very good imo.

Benson: 4.38 ERA, 49.3 innings, 25 K's, 18 BB'S, 5 HR's given up. Also not very good imo.

If the O's had 5 starters with those stats, they'd probably be leading the AL East and quite possibly have the best record in baseball. Pretty good in my book.

[tennOsfan]

Before any of us advocate doing a deal, we need to KNOW who we're getting. At this point, we can only speculate.

If I can trade Jay for a solid young starting pitcher like Lackey, I'd do it regardless of whom would replace Jay. I like Jay, and we'd be missing a vital power hitter, but darn it, we need pitching. Relying on mediocre starters like Lopez and Chen have gotten us nowhere, and we can't completely rely on the home-grown starters. We need more competition in that rotation -- who knows? Maybe competition is what Cabrera needs to focus and get his act together.

I don't care what happens to our power numbers -- we need a complete cast of reliable, talented starting pitching. If we're getting seven good innings every game, most of our bullpen woes aren't as glaring. If we're getting reliable starts, we're not blown out once every 2 or 3 games. This team needs starters who will give it a chance to win. Jay for Lackey? I'd do that 100 times over.

If it's Jay for Weaver, forget it.

[ooowillis]

Why is everyone so enamored with Kotchman? His career OPB is lower than Jay's, plus he's been struggling/injured this year.

[davearm]

Why is everyone so enamored with Kotchman? His career OPB is lower than Jay's, plus he's been struggling/injured this year.

It's probably because experts have considered him one of the best prospects in all of baseball for the last several years.