Is Yankee/Red Sox Hegemony coming to an end?

[Art Wing]

It took me a while to get my bearings with this thread... lots of bumps and broken conversations.

[OFFNY]

There's a very distinct possibility that the both the Sox and Yanks finish in the bottom spots of the division. I think then, and only then, will people really see the division differently.

Though everything I've read and heard regarding previews and predictions is that the AL East is a full 5 team division right now and the days of having a top 2 and bottom 3 are gone.

The last time that neither team made the post-season was 1993 ...... 20 years ago. The perception of these 2 teams' dominance/ownership of the division didn't end when the Yankees missed the postseason in 2008 and/or when the Red Sox missed the postseason in 2009, and it probably won't end until both teams finish out of the running in the same season and/or at least one of them finishes with a losing record for several consecutive seasons. 2013 could be the year that both of them fail to make it (the postseason.)

.

Edited February 11, 2013 by OFFNY

[Frobby]

The last time that neither team made the post-season was 1993 ...... 20 years ago. The perception of these 2 teams' dominance/ownership of the division didn't end when the Yankees missed the postseason in 2008 and/or when the Red Sox missed the postseason in 2009, and it probably won't end until both teams finish out of the running in the same season and/or at least one of them finishes with a losing record for several consecutive seasons. 2013 could be the year that both of them fail to make it (the postseason.)

.

There's a pretty big quantitative difference between the Yankees' one 89-win blip in 2008 and the Red Sox missing the playoffs three years in a row and winning 69 games last year. At this point, it's Yankee hegemony, not Yankee/Red Sox hegemony.

[Tx Oriole]

The last time that neither team made the post-season was 1993 ...... 20 years ago. The perception of these 2 teams' dominance/ownership of the division didn't end when the Yankees missed the postseason in 2008 and/or when the Red Sox missed the postseason in 2009, and it probably won't end until both teams finish out of the running in the same season and/or at least one of them finishes with a losing record for several consecutive seasons. 2013 could be the year that both of them fail to make it (the postseason.)

.

We can only hope so

[brooks1083]

The last time that neither team made the post-season was 1993 ...... 20 years ago. The perception of these 2 teams' dominance/ownership of the division didn't end when the Yankees missed the postseason in 2008 and/or when the Red Sox missed the postseason in 2009, and it probably won't end until both teams finish out of the running in the same season and/or at least one of them finishes with a losing record for several consecutive seasons. 2013 could be the year that both of them fail to make it (the postseason.)

.

I think we're definitely seeing the corner being turned. I think players are starting to get it in their heads that these aren't the dominant teams they usually are. Once you have the competition believing you are beatable, you've lost that extra edge. There's a lot to be said for the mental aspect of any game.

[OFFNY]

I think we're definitely seeing the corner being turned. I think players are starting to get it in their heads that these aren't the dominant teams they usually are. Once you have the competition believing you are beatable, you've lost that extra edge. There's a lot to be said for the mental aspect of any game.

Excellent post, and I agree. There were times a few years ago when I went to Yankee Stadium, and I really wondered whether or not our team was afraid of the opposition before a pitch was thrown. Last year, I went to a game in late April, and even though we lost a tight one by a score of 2-1, the game had an almost playoff atmosphere (both on the field and in the Yankee Stadium stands), and I had the sense that our team wasn't phased by the mighty Yankees in the slightest.

We proceeded to come back and beat the Yankees handily the next 2 games by scores of 7-1 and 5-0, respectively.

[Blizzard1090]

Excellent post, and I agree. There were times a few years ago when I went to Yankee Stadium, and I really wondered whether or not our team was afraid of the opposition before a pitch was thrown. Last year, I went to a game in late April, and even though we lost a tight one by a score of 2-1, the game had an almost playoff atmosphere (both on the field and in the Yankee Stadium stands), and I had the sense that our team wasn't phased by the mighty Yankees in the slightest.

We proceeded to come back and beat the Yankees handily the next 2 games by scores of 7-1 and 5-0, respectively.

I agree 100% with you on this. Before Buck came along,too many of the games against the Yanks and Red Sox were lost before the first pitch was even thrown. Same with many other teams.

That has all changed now IMO. Not only because the Yanks often can't make it past the first round in the postseason but because of the Red Sox missing the playoffs so much.

No longer are these teams feared. And without the fear factor,these two teams are showing nothing more and more.

Having said all that...these two teams will never fade away,Selig and company will make sure of that.

[OFFNY]

.

Whatever your interpretation of "hegemony" is, I believe that this has all played out very interestingly.

OThe A.L. East was unquestionably marked by Yankee/Red Sox hegemony from 2003-2007 ........ then the Rays got up there from 2008-present, winning one pennant, making 3 postseason appearances, and are now well on their way to their 6th consecutive winning season. It was the Yankees and the Rays on top of the division in 2010-2011 (thanks in part to the Orioles taking 5 out of 7 games from the Red Sox in the final week and-a-half of the 2011 season.) Then the Yankees, the Orioles, and the Rays all won 90 or more games in 2012, with the Rays being the odd man out of the postseason at 90-72, while the Red Sox floundered all the way down to last place, at 69-93. Now, the Red Sox have regained their dominance atop the division this year. They (the Red Sox) really putting the hammer down in the last 3 weeks, going 15-4 in their last 19 games to go from being in a 1st place tie with the Rays to having a commanding 8 and-a-half game lead. The Bostonians are almost certainly assured of coasting to the (A.L. East) title ........ but the Yankees have slipped back, and are in danger of missing the postseason for only the 2nd time in the last 18 years.

Even with the Rays and the Orioles hammering their way into contention as of late, at least one of these teams (the Yankees or the Red Sox) have managed to stay at or very near top of the A.L. East., one way or the other. Fortunately for us, we are no longer the doormats of the division, and (along with the Rays) will be trying to knock both of these teams out of the postseason in the same year in 2014 and beyond. But as of now, they both just won't go away at the same time.

[Dipper9]

This season has to be the tightest this division has been in quite some time. As it stands with 13 games left to play, there is a 3.5 game difference between 2nd and 4th place in the division, and any of the 3 or none of the 3 could make the postseason.

So while one of the two mega teams is in again, the division itself has gotten VERY tight and competitive the past two seasons.

[Frobby]

I will await the outcome of the playoff race before commenting further. The OP posited that the Yankees and Red Sox would remain competitive teams, but perhaps we were beyond the point where it would just be assumed every year that those two teams would be in the playoffs. I'd certainly be very unhappy if the Yankees snuck in at the end.

[OFFNY]

This season has to be the tightest this division has been in quite some time. As it stands with 13 games left to play, there is a 3.5 game difference between 2nd and 4th place in the division, and any of the 3 or none of the 3 could make the postseason.

So while one of the two mega teams is in again, the division itself has gotten VERY tight and competitive the past two seasons.

Thanks for the chime in, Dipper.

[OFFNY]

I will await the outcome of the playoff race before commenting further. The OP posited that the Yankees and Red Sox would remain competitive teams, but perhaps we were beyond the point where it would just be assumed every year that those two teams would be in the playoffs. I'd certainly be very unhappy if the Yankees snuck in at the end.

Just to be clear, I didn't bump the thread to necessarily prove or disprove the hegemony theory, and/or to assert whether or not it was/is coming to an end. I think that the entire subject is VERY interesting, so I thought it would be cool to revisit it, especially considering the Red Sox' roller-coaster ride over the last 3 or 4 seasons, the Yankees' endangerment of possibly not making the playoffs for only the 2nd time in 19 years, and the Orioles joining the Yankees, the Red Sox, and the Rays as contenders in what is now a 4-headed monster that is now atop the division either making the playoffs, or at least contending for the playoffs right down to the final week of the season.

Last year, the division had 3 teams winning at least 90 game or more, and one of them (the Rays) didn't even make the playoffs.

This year, the Red Sox have gone from one extreme to the other, and what appeared to be their gradual descent away from contention from 2009-2012 is now anything but.

Edited September 17, 2013 by OFFNY

[weams]

How wrong I was.

[TradeAngelos]

As the money keeps flowing so will the wins. If not for a complete catastrophe of injuries and other off field issues Yanks would have been right there with Red Sox.

[weams]

As the money keeps flowing so will the wins. If not for a complete catastrophe of injuries and other off field issues Yanks would have been right there with Red Sox.

Teams that spend tons of money are often much worse than the Orioles. Unfortunately, with the insane amount of money that Yankees and Red Sox can continuously spend, there is no way to compete long term consistently.