Orioles dropping Hardy from the 2 spot?

[NCRaven]

I have no idea what the final lineup will look like, but dropping Hardy to the bottom half of the order was a no brainer. Clearly, Markakis will hit in one of the top three positions. I could see him leading off with Roberts hitting second - he may have the best bat control on the team with the ability to foul off pitches, lay down bunts, hit to the right side of the infield and advance the runner, etc. - or in either of the #2 or #3 hitters, as well. I think that Reimold's ability to get on base will put him near the top of the order, as well.

But, I think that Buck likes having Markakis, Jones, Wieters in the #3-5 positions in the lineup. So I wouldn't be at all surprised to see something like eventually ending up as a regular lineup:

Reimold - Roberts - Markakis - Jones - Wieters - Davis - Machado - Hardy - McLouth, if Roberts is healthy or

McLouth - Reimold - Markakis - Jones - Wieters - Davis - Machado - Hardy - Roberts/Casilla, if Roberts is able to hit at the top of the order or is re-injured.

[NCRaven]

I think Machado could eventually be there at #2, but I would still let him hit lower in the the lineup for at least half a season. Let him gain lots of confidence in the lower part of the lineup first.

Ultimately, I hope to see Machado as a #3.

[waroriole]

The lineup should look like this (but it wont)

Markakis - RF

Reimold - LF/DH

Wieters - C

Jones - CF

Davis - 1B

Hardy - SS

Betemit/McLouth - DH/LF

Machado - 3B

Roberts - 2B

Yes, I'm comfortable with Wieters hitting 3rd. Who knows, it might light a fire under his butt. And if that means Nick is going to be our lead off hitter, so be it.

Depending on how Hardy and Machado are hitting, I'm fine with switching them. But to start, have Machado hitting 8th.

I like that lineup too. Wieters at 3 makes sense since lineup optimization says that 1,2,4, and 5 are more important spots. 6-8 depend on who is hotter at the moment.

[Mayor McCheese]

But, I think that Buck likes having Markakis, Jones, Wieters in the #3-5 positions in the lineup. So I wouldn't be at all surprised to see something like eventually ending up as a regular lineup

I dont agree at all that Buck likes them 3-5, I think Buck and Dan are looking for high OBP. In order to score runs you need to get on base and it starts from the top of the order.... Its that simple.

In his first six seasons in the majors, Markakis had compiled a career .365 on-base percentage. And that was enough for manager Buck Showalter and executive vice president Dan Duquette to consider moving Markakis away from his traditional spots of third or second.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-08-23/sports/bs-sp-orioles-nick-markakis-leadoff-0824-20120823_1_orioles-right-fielder-leadoff-experiment-nolan-reimold

[PaulFolk]

If you replace Hardy with Roberts at the top of the lineup, are you really gaining anything? Ideally, both should be hitting near the bottom of the order.

[harp6]

I like that lineup too. Wieters at 3 makes sense since lineup optimization says that 1,2,4, and 5 are more important spots. 6-8 depend on who is hotter at the moment.

Should a manager just follow what some data tools say is the best place to put their hitters? They should use it as a tool, but what is more important is knowing the players on the team. Since the 4th spot is considered to statistically be a more important spot in your lineup you are saying that Jones needs to be there and not Davis or Wieters. Your idea makes sense if Wieters has at least average speed in front of Jones, but he doesn't. Having him on the bases in front of Jones will limit Jones on the base paths.

[waroriole]

Should a manager just follow what some data tools say is the best place to put their hitters? They should use it as a tool, but what is more important is knowing the players on the team. Since the 4th spot is considered to statistically be a more important spot in your lineup you are saying that Jones needs to be there and not Davis or Wieters. Your idea makes sense if Wieters has at least average speed in front of Jones, but he doesn't. Having him on the bases in front of Jones will limit Jones on the base paths.

It also makes sense because Wieters has said that he feels most comfortable hitting 3.

[Can_of_corn]

Should a manager just follow what some data tools say is the best place to put their hitters? They should use it as a tool, but what is more important is knowing the players on the team. Since the 4th spot is considered to statistically be a more important spot in your lineup you are saying that Jones needs to be there and not Davis or Wieters. Your idea makes sense if Wieters has at least average speed in front of Jones, but he doesn't. Having him on the bases in front of Jones will limit Jones on the base paths.

How many runs do you think that will cost the team over the course of a season? I am guessing somewhere between zero and three. Jones isn't much of a basestealing threat and I think Wieters can get from first to third on a double.

[webbrick2010]

the same as it was last year. We don't have enough high OBP players. Reynolds was third on the team and we replaced him with nothing

I'm a huge Reimold fan but I don't think he is going to be an immediate impact player... and have doubts that he will stay healthy. BRob is done which means that we will have Casilla and his .305 OBP in the line up. I doubt that McClouth will match his late season success.

This team is really going to struggle to score runs... and it will be caused by one of the lowest team OBP in the majors.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really dissapointed that after a 93 win season the team didn't add any pieces.

A Michael Morse would have been a huge addition to the offense

[Can_of_corn]

the same as it was last year. We don't have enough high OBP players. Reynolds was third on the team and we replaced him with nothing

I'm a huge Reimold fan but I don't think he is going to be an immediate impact player... and have doubts that he will stay healthy. BRob is done which means that we will have Casilla and his .305 OBP in the line up. I doubt that McClouth will match his late season success.

This team is really going to struggle to score runs... and it will be caused by one of the lowest team OBP in the majors.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really dissapointed that after a 93 win season the team didn't add any pieces.

A Michael Morse would have been a huge addition to the offense

I don't understand the pessimism about Reimold staying healthy. Yes he has had two pretty serious injuries but they were not related to one another and I see no reason to think either should flare up. If Manning can play a full season in the NFL and have his neck hold up I don't see a reason to think that Reimold can't play in the outfield.

This isn't like Koji with his hamstrings where you know at some point in the season they will flare up.

[bpilktree]

I like this lineup the best if Nolan is healthy.

1. Nolan

2. Markakis

3. Jones

4. Davis

5 Wieters

6. Hardy

7. Machado

8. Mclouth

9. Roberts

I like the 8-9-1 combo with all that speed.

[Terpdawg32]

Just to throw my hat into the ring...

Roberts 2B

Markakis RF

Jones CF

Davis 1B

Wieters C

Reimold DH

Hardy SS

Machado 3B

McLouth LF

I'd be good with switching McLouth and Roberts based on how Roberts looks. Also, it would be great to see Machado take a step forward and work his way into that top third of the lineup.

[webbrick2010]

I don't understand the pessimism about Reimold staying healthy. Yes he has had two pretty serious injuries but they were not related to one another and I see no reason to think either should flare up. If Manning can play a full season in the NFL and have his neck hold up I don't see a reason to think that Reimold can't play in the outfield.

This isn't like Koji with his hamstrings where you know at some point in the season they will flare up.

Reimold has already been held out of the Wed and Thursday Intra-squad games.

If he is fully recovered why is he being "eased back in" according to Buck

If he is not 100% , why not, when will he be, will he ever be?

Sorry to put so much hope on a guy who has never had a full season in the majors is not likely to pan out.

So...

LF Reimold/McClouth McClouth out of majors for most of last 3 years

2B Cassilla Well below replacement level hitter

DH Betemit/??? A long list of cast offs

[srock]

Markakis is one of those rare players that you can really put anywhere in your line up. However, 8 of his 13 HR's were hit before mid May.

Looking at the second half splits where he was hitting leadoff was really impressive.

                                                            Split       G  PA  AB  R  H 2B 3B HR RBI   BA  OBP  SLG  OPS1st Half   50 225 199 25 51 13  1  8  26 .256 .333 .452 .7862nd Half   54 246 221 34 74 15  2  5  28 .335 [b].390[/b] .489 .879

Markakis needs to leadoff so long as he keeps this ridiculous .390 OBP going. You can argue about lineup order not mattering all you want, but for Nick Markakis, his psyche changes with his slot in the order.

Generally, some combination of Markakis, McLouth, Reimold, and Roberts should be batting #1 and #2. Given Reimold and Roberts injury history, Markakis and McLouth will get the bulk of the carries.

[srock]

Reimold has already been held out of the Wed and Thursday Intra-squad games.

If he is fully recovered why is he being "eased back in" according to Buck

If he is not 100% , why not, when will he be, will he ever be?

Sorry to put so much hope on a guy who has never had a full season in the majors is not likely to pan out.

So...

LF Reimold/McClouth McClouth out of majors for most of last 3 years

2B Cassilla Well below replacement level hitter

DH Betemit/??? A long list of cast offs

I think they are concerned Nolan may be overdoing it because he feels forgotten and that he something to prove.