"As much as most of us root for Bud . . . he's not helping our pitching"

[Il BuonO]

I am glad Buck did not Bench Chris Davis last week when I wanted him to. That makes a difference in the end of season standings as well.

You equate that to Norris coming back?

[Can_of_corn]

You equate that to Norris coming back?

I didn't realize that Walker was putting up big numbers for the O's.

[Il BuonO]

I didn't realize that Walker was putting up big numbers for the O's.

He's the future.

[tntoriole]

We could be .500 after today's game. A huge part of that has been Wright's 3 starts. Norris has pitched 8 more innings than Wright so far this season and has given up 27 more runs. Let that sink in. I don't want Norris anywhere near the rotation. But I'd take him in Chaz Roe's spot all day. He's making 10 million this year. We owe him nothing.

Buck seemingly is not quite ready to give up on a guy who won a key playoff game just last fall and was an excellent starter for us in second half of 2014 because he has not pitched well so far this year. And not just ready to turn that slot over to a rookie who has pitched 3 starts in the majors (no matter how well those starts have looked). And DD probably isn't a big fan of sending the guy we are paying 10 million dollars to go to an undefined bullpen role although it may indeed come to that as it did with Ubaldo last year. Bud's performance definitely has to improve if he is going to stay in the rotation longer than another start or two. But I think he very well may improve (as he can't pitch much worse than 9.88 ERA). Lots of people would have jettisoned Ubaldo in a heart beat this winter if not for the contract. Relying upon a veteran big league pitcher's track record of performance over a large sample size to gauge what his near future performance is likely to be (in the absence of injury) is not "loyalty." It is what successful big league managers and GMs do...as opposed to us guys on a board.

[tntoriole]

I am glad Buck did not Bench Chris Davis last week when I wanted him to. That makes a difference in the end of season standings as well.

Exactly. And hopefully Bud will have a few excellent performances in him in the next couple of weeks to silence the crowd calling for his head.

[Crazysilver03]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Buck said he won't go to 6 man rotation when Norris comes off DL." <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/orioles?src=hash">#orioles</a></p>? Roch Kubatko (@masnRoch) <a href="

">May 30, 2015</a></blockquote>

<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

So does anyone think Bud gives the team a better chance to win the then five guys currently in the rotation (or Gausman for that matter)?

Does anyone think this is solely about giving the team the best chance to win?

It is amazing. You put the newly signed free agent addition in the bullpen with 47M left on his contract but put the FA to be who won't be with $5M left back in.

[weams]

You equate that to Norris coming back?

No. I don't. I just meant that I am not always right in what I want for the team.

[Can_of_corn]

It is amazing. You put the newly signed free agent addition in the bullpen with 47M left on his contract but put the FA to be who won't be with $5M left back in.

Did Ubaldo win 15 for the O's the year before?

It's perfectly logical when you look at it that way.

[weams]

It is amazing. You put the newly signed free agent addition in the bullpen with 47M left on his contract but put the FA to be who won't be with $5M left back in.

What month did Ubaldo go to the pen?

[Can_of_corn]

No. I don't. I just meant that I am not always right in what I want for the team.

That's OK. I want him gone and I am almost always right in what I want for the team.

[Il BuonO]

Buck seemingly is not quite ready to give up on a guy who won a key playoff game just last fall and was an excellent starter for us in second half of 2014 because he has not pitched well so far this year.

And not just ready to turn that slot over to a rookie who has pitched 3 starts in the majors (no matter how well those starts have looked). And DD probably isn't a big fan of sending the guy we are paying 10 million dollars to go to an undefined bullpen role although it may indeed come to that as it did with Ubaldo last year.

Bud's performance definitely has to improve if he is going to stay in the rotation longer than another start or two. But I think he very well may improve (as he can't pitch much worse than 9.88 ERA). Lots of people would have jettisoned Ubaldo in a heart beat this winter if not for the contract. Relying upon a veteran big league pitcher's track record of performance over a large sample size to gauge what his near future performance is likely to be (in the absence of injury) is not "loyalty." It is what successful big league managers and GMs do...as opposed to us guys on a board.

I added the breaks just to help everyone else out with your post. I hope you don't mind. Also, your first sentence is a run on. Just saying....

Ok, DD doesn't make decisions about what Norris does or doesn't do on the field, including whether he's used to start or in relief.

Finally, I'd agree he probably has two starts, maybe three, to get it turned around. The difference is I see no indication he will. Improving from a 9.88 ERA is no great accomplishment, the bar was set really low.

[tntoriole]

It is amazing. You put the newly signed free agent addition in the bullpen with 47M left on his contract but put the FA to be who won't be with $5M left back in.

Of course it was August 19 then, not May 30th, before Ubaldo went to the pen. And he got much, much, much rope on that leash before then. And even then, it was Miguel Gonzalez coming back off the DL that really forced the decision (even as bad as Ubaldo was pitching right then in the heat of a pennant march). If Gausman pitches great at Norfolk and comes roaring back and Norris continues to suck, then, yes, he will likely go to the pen. But maybe that scenario is reversed. Maybe Norris figures something out and Gausman pitches badly. If they both are pitching well, then Buck really will have a conundrum on his hands at that point. My point is that no one is forcing Norris out right this minute (unless you include Mike Wright and I don't think Buck is going to give the slot permanently right now to the rookie).

[Il BuonO]

What month did Ubaldo go to the pen?

Here's a thread on started on the subject.

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/showthread.php/141725-Send-Ubaldo-To-The-BP

He was getting more than Norris is now.

[Il BuonO]

Of course it was August 19 then, not May 30th, before Ubaldo went to the pen. And he got much, much, much rope on that leash before then. And even then, it was Miguel Gonzalez coming back off the DL that really forced the decision (even as bad as Ubaldo was pitching right then in the heat of a pennant march). If Gausman pitches great at Norfolk and comes roaring back and Norris continues to suck, then, yes, he will likely go to the pen. But maybe that scenario is reversed. Maybe Norris figures something out and Gausman pitches badly. If they both are pitching well, then Buck really will have a conundrum on his hands at that point. My point is that no one is forcing Norris out right this minute (unless you include Mike Wright and I don't think Buck is going to give the slot permanently right now to the rookie).

Yes, most everyone believes Wright is out pitching Norris except you. It shouldn't matter that he's a rookie.

[tntoriole]

I added the breaks just to help everyone else out with your post. I hope you don't mind. Also, your first sentence is a run on. Just saying....

Ok, DD doesn't make decisions about what Norris does or doesn't do on the field, including whether he's used to start or in relief.

Finally, I'd agree he probably has two starts, maybe three, to get it turned around. The difference is I see no indication he will. Improving from a 9.88 ERA is no great accomplishment, the bar was set really low.

Thanks. My grammar, she is not so good. And I agree that DD doesn't make the decisions about what Norris does or doesn't do on the field, but that doesn't mean DD wouldn't have an opinion about it. Or seek to move Norris if he felt really strongly about it. Not that DD would share that opinion with us but probably would with Buck. Good discussion, thanks. It has given me an additional rooting interest on top of our mutually shared interest in the Orioles winning EVERY game. I now really, really want Bud to turn into Cy Young for a month of starts. Lol.