Bedard

[Flosman]

I think he's saying that Bedard is pretty much untouchable in his book.

No not untouchable but it will take more than a 800-850 OPS corner outfielder to get him from me. Besides if you trade a guy like Bedard it better make you better at more than one spot IMO or it better be for a truely elite player (which are almost never available).

[rolliefingers]

I would take upton and a prospect for Bedard. Probably Crawford and a prospect. Bedard is a more valuable player than Crawford IMO. Crawford is a really good player but he is not an elite player and a top of the rotation pre FA pitcher has more value than a Very good but not great Corner outfielder. I would love to have Crawford but I would think it is very unlikely that I would pay Tampa's price to get him.

If Crawford were on a team other than TB, I'd deal Bedard for him, straight-up. But I don't want Bedard in TB, period.

[rolliefingers]

No not untouchable but it will take more than a 800-850 OPS corner outfielder to get him from me. Besides if you trade a guy like Bedard it better make you better at more than one spot IMO or it better be for a truely elite player (which are almost never available).

He's Beltran with slightly less power and more speed. And much younger. You really don't think he's "elite"?

[tim27]

He's Beltran with slightly less power and more speed. And much younger. You really don't think he's "elite"?

He ain't Beltran by any stretch of the imagination. Beltran: GG CENTER fielder. Crawford: GG Left fielder. Sure he's an excellent defensive player but he plays the easiest position on the field; Beltran plays one of the hardest. Advantage: Beltran.

Somebody earlier said CC was a 25 hr guy. No he's not. Maybe he should hit 20 first before we say he's a 25 hr guy. I don't know maybe it's just me. He doesn't have slightly less power thanh Beltran, it's a signifigant drop off. Beltran's hit 38+ hr two of the last three seasons. Carl hit 18 last year- his career high. Beltran is also consistently higher in obp, though he hit's for a lower average. He also slugs over .500, something CC has yet to do. I mean CC is a fine player but he isn't in the same category as Beltran, case close.

[Sports Guy]

I would love to see if the Dodgers and DBacks would get into a bidding war for Bedard.

[Spoonless]

He ain't Beltran by any stretch of the imagination. Beltran: GG CENTER fielder. Crawford: GG Left fielder. Sure he's an excellent defensive player but he plays the easiest position on the field; Beltran plays one of the hardest. Advantage: Beltran.

Somebody earlier said CC was a 25 hr guy. No he's not. Maybe he should hit 20 first before we say he's a 25 hr guy. I don't know maybe it's just me. He doesn't have slightly less power thanh Beltran, it's a signifigant drop off. Beltran's hit 38+ hr two of the last three seasons. Carl hit 18 last year- his career high. Beltran is also consistently higher in obp, though he hit's for a lower average. He also slugs over .500, something CC has yet to do. I mean CC is a fine player but he isn't in the same category as Beltran, case close.

Sorry about that, I was wrong. I was looking at the wrong category on his stat page.

[JTrea81]

I would love to see if the Dodgers and DBacks would get into a bidding war for Bedard.

The Dodgers are loaded. Like I've been saying a Tejada and Bedard package to LA could be the best thing that ever happened to this organization since the 1983 WS.

[Leitch]

He's Beltran with slightly less power and more speed. And much younger. You really don't think he's "elite"?

I think Vlad Guerrero is a better comp in terms of overall profile. Ton of average, zero walks, even fewer strikeouts, ton of speed - the only difference is Crawford's(relative) lack of power, something that can still improve.

[Sports Guy]

He ain't Beltran by any stretch of the imagination. Beltran: GG CENTER fielder. Crawford: GG Left fielder. Sure he's an excellent defensive player but he plays the easiest position on the field; Beltran plays one of the hardest. Advantage: Beltran.

CC could be a GG CFer though.

Somebody earlier said CC was a 25 hr guy. No he's not. Maybe he should hit 20 first before we say he's a 25 hr guy. I don't know maybe it's just me. He doesn't have slightly less power thanh Beltran, it's a signifigant drop off. Beltran's hit 38+ hr two of the last three seasons. Carl hit 18 last year- his career high. Beltran is also consistently higher in obp, though he hit's for a lower average. He also slugs over .500, something CC has yet to do. I mean CC is a fine player but he isn't in the same category as Beltran, case close.

Crawford will be a Beltran type player though(imo) but i agree he isn't there yet.

However, you need to compare the 2 at the same ages.

Here are their OPS's from ages 22-24(Crawford first):

781...791

810...675(Beltran was hurt this year i believe...this was in just over 300 abs)

830...876

So far this year, at age 25, CC has an 838 OPS...Beltran had an 847 OPS in his age 25 season.

There is every reason to think Crawford can approach Beltran status if he can stay healthy.

BTW, i am not sure how the 2 parks compare but KC is a good hitters park, so any power difference may be explained there(not sure about the Trop though)

[Sports Guy]

The Dodgers are loaded. Like I've been saying a Tejada and Bedard package to LA could be the best thing that ever happened to this organization since the 1983 WS.

I am not sure i agree with this or not...We may get more if we piece them off seperately, as opposed to together.

[Frobby]

So, Drungo or others,

Would you say I'm off base with this assessment since Will Carroll assesses him as green? I'm curious about other opinions about this observation?

I was surprised to see your assessment of Bedard's mechanics, because I always felt he had a very simple, repeatable motion. However, you are a former pitcher and a very keen observer of this sort of thing and so I suspect your points are valid. And we all know that Bedard already had a knee injury back in 2005, which tends to support what you say.

I think Will Carroll does not really analyze mechanics as you have. He's more into how many innings a pitcher has thrown at certain ages, high pitch count outings, etc.

[davearm]

FWIW, PECOTA thinks Bedard for Crawford is a slam dunk for the O's.

Crawford projects 25.3 WARP over the next 5 years, and Bedard 16.9.

[tim27]

So, Drungo or others,

Would you say I'm off base with this assessment since Will Carroll assesses him as green? I'm curious about other opinions about this observation?

Well, Carrol's views on this matter back up mine but I don't think that neccessarily makes him or me right. What he does might be the most scientific way of evaluating injury risk but that doesn't make it neccessarily faultless. As far as Bedard's mechanics go I've noticed exactly what you're talking about and it almost seems more pronounced to me this year. However, I've never pitched and I can't speak on it from first hand expierience as you can. However, if he's comfortable with it (and it seems that way) then I don't think it will be much of an issue. I'd rather him be putting that strain on his lower body than on his arm, and his mechanics up top are really excellent. So while I whole-heartedly agree with your assessment of Bedard's mechanics I don't think that it should really lead to much of an injury risk as long as he is comfortable with it.

[tim27]

FWIW, PECOTA thinks Bedard for Crawford is a slam dunk for the O's.

Crawford projects 25.3 WARP over the next 5 years, and Bedard 16.9.

Yeah, but PECOTA is naturally biased against pitchers.

[Sports Guy]

FWIW, PECOTA thinks Bedard for Crawford is a slam dunk for the O's.

Crawford projects 25.3 WARP over the next 5 years, and Bedard 16.9.

Well, i would make this trade i think...However, i would probably prefer a package of 2-3 elite prospects since we need more than one player on this team. We need to fill alot of holes.