Duquette Run Is Over

[weams]

Sorry but if someone is going to post something as a fact, when it isn't, I don't think I should be called out for providing accurate information.

You are not called out. I was just bring the context back where it is.

[Can_of_corn]

Thank you for defining your criteria.

I mentioned 500 or above because I needed some sort of a criteria in absence of anything from you besides "4.3 seasons isn't good enough". You knew that. You also know that 500 is routinely used a barometer for a competitive year. Your question was intentionally tweaking me. Whatever, moving on.

With your criteria there are rarely more than 1-2 teams in all of MLB in the midst of that sort of a run at any period of time over the last 25 years. The only team in that sort of run right now is the Cards, right? The Rays aren't anymore, right?

And I don't even know how you define a "full rebuild" for teams like the Yanks and Sox who just reload regardless of young talent due to their payroll.

So, you want to be in the 94% percentile or above when compared to their full peer group to feel satisfied is what I am reading. Ok, you have very high expectations. My expectations aren't that high for an entertainment endeavor. Heck, my expectations aren't that high for myself and I have much higher expectations for myself than most people I know.

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Rays could be, would depend on how this year goes, I don't think they have been excluded.

Giants from 2009 till now would qualify, I'm not going to exclude them because of a 76 win season.

[jabba72]

Would have been. I do not think they have the structure any longer. Plus they would have to move.

I think their rotation and present lineup has Postseason potential. If not this year, then the next 2-3 years.

[Prayin4Reign]

No, you are the one trying to dictate what is or is not acceptable to opine about on a message board.

Dictate? Nooo...I don't think so, but a valiant effort just the same. I was merely pointing out the humor I saw in your statement, (note I'm saying statement rather than opinion).

[LookitsPuck]

I'm completely confused now as you have multiple, multiple posts in this thread calling for DD's head for inexcusable errors. I agree with the summary you wrote above. Slightly above average, some things that he is better at than most, but a few bad blind spots. I would have just never concluded that is where you are based on the positions you took throughout the thread.

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As said before, I'm a critical person by nature. I'm not going to be singing Duquete's praises about things I care a lot about (drafting, developing, signing FAs and handling draft picks). Those mean a lot.

[Can_of_corn]

Ok, fair enough. Now I understand. Thanks

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If you need to be told I'm critical by nature then you hacked vatech's account and you should really give it back.

[CanadianOriole]

So we are the winningest team in the AL since the start of 2012 and you believe that our GM has underachieved and we should be better???

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I agree - it sounds odd to say when you say it that - but I 100% believe Dan has underachieved to some extent. He had a core of good, really young players at the MLB and MiLB levels and a really good manager when he came in - and he's done a solid enough job - made some good moves - hasn't ruined the team, in fact we've won games - but the opportunity was there for us to be even better for sure. He's done a very poor job for the most part with starting pitching in my opinion - both for now and in the future. I don't trust him to properly evaluate starting pitchers either at the MLB or Minors level at all at this point to be honest. Plus, our farm system is in fairly dire straits.

I don't think he's been a bad GM - I think he's been solid on the whole- a little above average. However, I also think there was an opportunity for us to be a current and future powerhouse and we've missed it to some extent. We're still good, we've made the playoffs, made an ALCS. It's easy to see my perspective as spoiled - I understand that. I watch as many games as I can as I always have, it's been wildly better than the 17 years that preceded it - but I also don't think Dan should be immune to criticism. He's made some great moves and those should be praised, but he's done some very dubious things that have held us back some too - and our future is a concern. I see no harm in posters raising and discussing that perspective.

In a weird way, the message board was more fun when we were terrible. Most everyone was united in slamming all the ridiculous moves and terrible players. Venting on here was a nice reprieve from the losing. The baseball is infinitely more fun to watch now of course - and I'm glad we're not back in the doldrums of the early and mid and late 2000s, and the early 2010s - but I also do think we could be even better.

[Can_of_corn]

So we are the winningest team in the AL since the start of 2012 and you believe that our GM has underachieved and we should be better???

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I think he had done a fine enough job at the ML level but I think he has not done a good job at all in setting the team up for future success.

Pretty sure it's the managers job to win now. The EVP should also be concerned with the future.

[scOtt]

I agree - it sounds odd to say when you say it that - but I 100% believe Dan has underachieved to some extent. He had a core of good, really young players at the MLB and MiLB levels and a really good manager when he came in - and he's done a solid enough job - made some good moves - hasn't ruined the team, in fact we've won games - but the opportunity was there for us to be even better for sure. He's done a very poor job for the most part with starting pitching in my opinion - both for now and in the future. I don't trust him to properly evaluate starting pitchers either at the MLB or Minors level at all at this point to be honest. Plus, our farm system is in fairly dire straits.

I don't think he's been a bad GM - I think he's been solid on the whole- a little above average. However, I also think there was an opportunity for us to be a current and future powerhouse and we've missed it to some extent. We're still good, we've made the playoffs, made an ALCS. It's easy to see my perspective as spoiled - I understand that. I watch as many games as I can as I always have, it's been wildly better than the 17 years that preceded it - but I also don't think Dan should be immune to criticism. He's made some great moves and those should be praised, but he's done some very dubious things that have held us back some too - and our future is a concern. I see no harm in posters raising and discussing that perspective.

In a weird way, the message board was more fun when we were terrible. Most everyone was united in slamming all the ridiculous moves and terrible players. Venting on here was a nice reprieve from the losing. The baseball is infinitely more fun to watch now of course - and I'm glad we're not back in the doldrums of the early and mid and late 2000s, and the early 2010s - but I also do think we could be even better.

This is weird to say but I think 2012 really hurt the team. Winning and getting to the playoffs, earlier than we really should have, really raised expectations to keep winning and get back. If we had finished say 5 over .500 He might have continued more of a rebuild to add to the talent we had. But he started spending assets to keep us winning.

[atomic]

This is weird to say but I think 2012 really hurt the team. Winning and getting to the playoffs, earlier than we really should have, really raised expectations to keep winning and get back. If we had finished say 5 over .500 He might have continued more of a rebuild to add to the talent we had. But he started spending assets to keep us winning.

Damn that Duquette for keeping us winning. Looks like this will be the fifth straight non losing season. If only we could get Macphail back so we could be losers again.

[MDtransplant757]

It's interesting to see the stockholm's syndrome on this thread. Truly fascinating

[MDtransplant757]

Alright, rant time.

I am so damn sick and tired of everyone here being whiny, mopey. We have a competitive team (with flaws), but there is a difference between being critical and being pessimistic. We sound more like detractors than fans. Has DD made mistakes? Yes. No question. But no one here, myself included, would have the balls done half, if any of the moves DD has done like singing Jason Hammel, Nelson Cruz or trading for Trumbo, Milller. Etc. Everyone here would be the billy beane's of the world, build, "win", trade for picks and prospects, and start over. This is why Oakland doesn't win because they do this. Everyone here would have traded guys like Cal, Brooks and Palmer for parts back in the day, and complained that we were "incomplete" or not as good because Mike Flannigan didn't develop until later on, like Tyler Wilson or Mike Wright. I'm not saying they're like Flannigan, that has yet to be determined, but please, PLEASE stop being so damn negative.

I truly love guys like C_o_c, LookIt'sPuck and Gordo, but stop the infighting. You all look like petty assholes, and while everyone has points in their arguments, everyone is looking with hindsight and being manic depressive. Hindsight is 20/20, and no one would have signed like Cruz, Chen and Hamell. If it was up to you guys, we'd be the team that everyone here says we are. Guys like Gallardo will come around, as their stats and track record say so. Everyone needs to calm down and stop predicting the apocalypse.

[video=youtube_share;qPEcDg6mUsM]

Rant over.

[Rene88]

We all want to win and we all like the O's and we vomited in our mouths watching the starting pitching this week, we can all agree on those points.

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[El Gordo]

We all want to win and we all like the O's and we vomited in our mouths watching the starting pitching this week, we can all agree on those points.

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I didn't care for the SP but I didn't vomit in my mouth. Speak for yourself.

[LookitsPuck]

We all want to win and we all like the O's and we vomited in our mouths watching the starting pitching this week, we can all agree on those points.

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The staring pitching now has a collective ERA of over 5. It's been bad for nearly a month.