Should we go after Andrew Cashner?

[Moose Milligan]

3 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Cashner is more likely to be Mike Wright than the pitcher with a 1.194 WHIP with the Orioles last year. 

He'd be closer to the 2018 version of himself.  Anyone pointing to the 1.194 WHIP last year as a sign of what to expect moving forward isn't interested in looking at the guys entire body of work

[Frobby]

18 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I'm going to assume you do recognize that what Cashner did here last year wasn't in line with the rest of his career.  

The rest of his career is a lot better than that litany Mr. Chewbacca Jr. laid out.    He’s a meh back of rotation starter, but many pitchers aren’t that good.    Don’t know if you looked at my thread on the BA top 100 from 2008-10, but he falls in the group of 31 reliable starters from that batch of 99 pitchers.   I’m not saying we should sign him, but I don’t think he should be dismissed as a scrub.   

[interloper]

Re: Cashner, I'd rather a random lightning in a bottle type or a bounce-back candidate personally. That said, I don't find any huge fault with Cashner on like a 1/$5 kind of deal. You can slot him in the bullpen once a guy like Akin is ready to go. 

Plus I don't really buy Cobb staying healthy all year. 

[Moose Milligan]

4 minutes ago, Frobby said:

The rest of his career is a lot better than that litany Mr. Chewbacca Jr. laid out.    He’s a meh back of rotation starter, but many pitchers aren’t that good.    Don’t know if you looked at my thread on the BA top 100 from 2008-10, but he falls in the group of 31 reliable starters from that batch of 99 pitchers.   I’m not saying we should sign him, but I don’t think he should be dismissed as a scrub.   

Might not be as big of a scrub as some of those guys but what he did in 2018 was certainly scrub worthy.  I'll concede that the real Cashner is somewhere between what he did in 2018 for us and what he did here in 2019.  Let's not forget how badly he tanked as soon as he left Baltimore.  

Yeah, it's a lot better than what he laid out but I still hate watching him pitch.  Anyone want to fight me on that?  Anyone want to say that they enjoy watching Cashner?  

[wildbillhiccup]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Might not be as big of a scrub as some of those guys but what he did in 2018 was certainly scrub worthy.  I'll concede that the real Cashner is somewhere between what he did in 2018 for us and what he did here in 2019.  Let's not forget how badly he tanked as soon as he left Baltimore.  

Yeah, it's a lot better than what he laid out but I still hate watching him pitch.  Anyone want to fight me on that?  Anyone want to say that they enjoy watching Cashner?  

You mean you don't enjoy watching those golden mullet locks wave in the wind as he gets hit harder than a nail at a hammer convention?

[Moose Milligan]

3 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

You mean you don't enjoy watching those golden mullet locks wave in the wind as he gets hit harder than a nail at a hammer convention?

Nope, sure don't!  

[interloper]

17 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Nope, sure don't!  

I mean I didn't hate watching him pitch in 2019 before the trade. Threw a lot of good games.  Obviously I do not expect him to be able to do that again though.

[Philip]

2 hours ago, Mr. Chewbacca Jr. said:

Unfair to call him a scrub. The O's actually started plenty of scrubs last year:

Sean Gilmartin: 1 GS / 2.1 IP / 19.29 ERA / 3.857 WHIP

Yefry Ramirez: 1 GS / 10.1 IP / 6.97 ERA / 1.935 WHIP

Chandler Shepherd: 3 GS / 19 IP / 6.63 ERA / 1.526 WHIP

Tom Eshelman: 4 GS / 36 IP / 6.50 ERA / 1.611 WHIP

Jimmy Yacabonis: 4 GS / 41 IP / 6.80 ERA / 1.829 WHIP

Ty Blach: 5 GS / 20.2 IP / 11.32 ERA / 2.177 WHIP

Dan Straily: 8 GS / 47.2 IP / 9.82 ERA / 1.993 WHIP

Aaron Brooks: 12 GS / 59.2 IP / 6.18 ERA / 1.492 WHIP

David Hess: 14 GS / 80 IP / 7.09 ERA / 1.550 WHIP

 

and... Andrew Cashner: 17 GS / 96.1 IP / 3.83 ERA / 1.194 WHIP.

 

Bundy is gone. Cobb is injury-prone. There will be other injuries. Cashner or someone similar to him is something the O's need to get through the 2020 season. There will be plenty of opportunities for the waiver-wire scrubs with a 1 in a 1,000 chance of being a surprise. Elias certainly didn't have any luck with that last year.

Most of the guys you mentioned are gone. I personally think there’s no reason to keep Hess around, But I am apparently in a minority. Is Shepherd still here? I thought he showed more promise than those figures indicate, but if he didn’t, I’m happy to send him on his way as well.

As long as there is been baseball, there have been people who sought value in the discards of others, and that’s not going to change now.

Cashner is a known quantity, and because of his Pedegree will not be cheap. He doesn’t offer very much, however, so I would just as soon spend our marbles on castoffs and lottery tickets, and see if one of them hits.

[interloper]

2 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

I'm going to assume you do recognize that what Cashner did here last year wasn't in line with the rest of his career.  

The rest of his career is still not scrub level. He's a guy that has a lot of peaks and valleys due to his low K rate. But he's a ML pitcher unlike most of our AAAA non-prospect guys.

I don't really get the ire Cashner seems to draw around here. We knew what we were getting when Duquette signed him. Most of us were down for it and the contract wasn't even that bad. He was far more successful of an Oriole than Cobb has been thus far.

Plus, hey, two 17-year old Dominicans and tanked for the Sox. Guy did us a solid.

[jerios55]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

The rest of his career is still not scrub level. He's a guy that has a lot of peaks and valleys due to his low K rate. But he's a ML pitcher unlike most of our AAAA non-prospect guys.

I don't really get the ire Cashner seems to draw around here. We knew what we were getting when Duquette signed him. Most of us were down for it and the contract wasn't even that bad. He was far more successful of an Oriole than Cobb has been thus far.

Plus, hey, two 17-year old Dominicans and tanked for the Sox. Guy did us a solid.

However, based on this last part, I want no talk of trading him at the deadline if we do sign him.  But it'll happen anyway....haha.

Related to Moose's comment, I was never excited to watch Cashner pitch (mullet or otherwise...).  Knowing the team will be bad, I want to see young guys play.  Means, Santander, Hays, Harvey made me happy.  Mountcastle, Akin, other prospects that may be called up will make me happy.  Cashner could replicate or improve on last season I won't get excited.  Getting wins from average-ish pitchers just doesn't feel productive at this point. 

That said, having a stable pitcher in a rotation be a benefit?  Sure.  I don't know if Cobb will stay healthy and there is still lots of room for waiver wire guys to show they can be the next Rodrigo Lopez, MGonzalez or Guthrie, even if Cashner is signed.  So I wouldn't be outright against it (at the right price). 

[wildbillhiccup]

2 hours ago, interloper said:

The rest of his career is still not scrub level. He's a guy that has a lot of peaks and valleys due to his low K rate. But he's a ML pitcher unlike most of our AAAA non-prospect guys.

I don't really get the ire Cashner seems to draw around here. We knew what we were getting when Brady signed him. Most of us were down for it and the contract wasn't even that bad. He was far more successful of an Oriole than Cobb has been thus far.

Plus, hey, two 17-year old Dominicans and tanked for the Sox. Guy did us a solid.

Fixed that for ya. And they really didn't know what they were getting because Dan Aykroyd's doppleganger and Mr. Coconut Oil were blinded by his obviously unsustainable 2017 ERA. Everyone else knew a big regression was coming...except for the Orioles. 

[interloper]

5 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Fixed that for ya. And they really didn't know what they were getting because Dan Aykroyd's doppleganger and Mr. Coconut Oil were blinded by his obviously unsustainable 2017 ERA. Everyone else knew a big regression was coming...except for the Orioles. 

But where is the ire coming from exactly? The 2018 team was going to be terrible no matter who they signed to pitch for them. We all know that now. It was a dice roll and it didn't work out until 2019 when he did pitch very well on a bad team and didn't pout about it. 

I just don't see why folks dislike him so much. Sure, there are the reports of his abrasive (but, I think it's been stated, well-meaning) personality at times. But he didn't block any prospects, he stayed mostly healthy and ate innings, his contract didn't hurt the organization like Cobb's or Ubaldo's did, and we got something for him. 

/shrug

[Frobby]

9 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Fixed that for ya. And they really didn't know what they were getting because Dan Aykroyd's doppleganger and Mr. Coconut Oil were blinded by his obviously unsustainable 2017 ERA. Everyone else knew a big regression was coming...except for the Orioles. 

Baloney.    If anyone had thought Cashner was going to repeat 2017 he would have received a far bigger contract than he got.   His contract was commensurate with his career performance, not his outlier 2017 season.   

Honestly, I’m amazed when posters think that the Orioles’ (prior) front office couldn’t see what any Joe Blow spending five minutes on the internet could see.
 

[thezeroes]

Cashner 2017 version and the Cashner 2019 Oriole version had one common denominator.  This is why I think having him  on a contract under two million would be worth it.

[wildbillhiccup]

25 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Baloney.    If anyone had thought Cashner was going to repeat 2017 he would have received a far bigger contract than he got.   His contract was commensurate with his career performance, not his outlier 2017 season.   

Honestly, I’m amazed when posters think that the Orioles’ (prior) front office couldn’t see what any Joe Blow spending five minutes on the internet could see.
 

Well they admittedly weren't using analytics at the time. Is it really that much of a stretch to think that they were more focused on stats like ERA then the more advanced stats that would have pointed to the unbelievable amount of luck he had in 2017? No other team in their right mind would have given Cashner a multi-year deal.