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It might be time to cleanout the clubhouse

JTrea81

By JTrea81
in Orioles Talk

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JTrea81 Hangout Grand Counsel

JTrea81

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I wish we had spies who would really tell us what goes on in the clubhouse. Not people with agendas running up garbage like our last insiders.

Tony had a great post which really started me on this line of thinking:

I think a losing culture breeds this type of "inmates running the asylum" kind of thing. I've heard some things about Jones, Roberts and even Markakis and I've always wondered if they weren't constantly losing would they have a better attitude?

Continual losing can not be good for anyone. Roberts and Markakis have been on losing teams their entire major league careers. Tejada was burned out when he left because he was just burnt our from losing.

As good as Roberts (when healthy) and Markakis are, they are not team leader guys and they have no experience at winning.

I'm a big believer that you should surround your young players with solid veterans who have won. The Orioles have too many guys with the same laid back personality and I think it was hard for Trembley to hold their feet to the fire because I'm not sure he ever truly felt he could be himself with his clubs for fear of "losing the clubhouse."

Wieters is another guy who's not going to inspire others. It's not really his style. Matusz is too new and hasn't done enough at the big level. Jones is a good guy overall but he's got his own rumors floating around about his on and off field habits.

This team needs a transfusion. MacPhail is going to have to trade off major pieces of his "core" for no other reason then to change the culture.

The Orioles have a culture of losing. Their minor league teams over the years minus a few good teams have pretty much lost more than they won, and the big league team is going about completing it's 13 straight year of losing.

MacPhail has to realize his core group needs a tranfusion of different personalities. Obviously talent is the main ingrediant, but if he keeps the current group, he's going to need a well respected high energy type of manager to lead it.

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brooksie05 AAA

brooksie05

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I like Nick, but let's not pretend he is any more than a decent role player on a contending club. He has nice defense, can take a walk or two and is a slap hitter with moderate power. If I can package him with a lower-tier pitching prospect and get a difference making power bat....you have to consider it. Nick's contract status makes it all the more appealing that we can get more for him.

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Mad Mark All-Star

Mad Mark

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I've been hanging onto the fact that we need to keep everybody we have to try to win in the second half but perhaps it's time for a complete clubhouse cleaning at the deadline.

I would keep Wieters, Matusz and Jones because they aren't quite used to the losing culture yet.

But Markakis probably needs to go, as does Roberts. Hearing Tony's comments in another thread, I think this clubhouse has too many players that are used to losing and Markakis is one of those players IMO.

I think it might be best for him and the team to part ways and since he is under control for some time, we could probably get a good haul for him considering the lineup is the reason he is underperforming power wise.

Roberts would be harder to trade for a good return, but I would look to try to sneak him through waivers if he's healthy in August as nobody would want his contract.

And the vets like Wigginton, Tejada, Millwood, Guthrie etc would all go as well.

So clean everybody out, and start over with younger established ML players if you can, and try to make some trades in the offseason to rebuild this thing once again. By tearing everything apart, we should also lock up Rendon for the 1st round pick as well.

I never thought I would want this, but I really think this might be our best course now. Baltimore is a complete mess.

First, you get the feint. Draw the people in. Hell, I was ready to agree with you--with the crucial caveat of what we do the Orioles get in return?--when in Post #5, you come to the true reason for this thread:

True, I think MacPhail would have to be fired and a GM that would be really aggressive such as Towers would be the architect of the next rebuild, which shouldn't take as long.

Bingo! Trembley was your Chezchoslovakia...MacPhail is your Poland.

Who will be your Russia? And when will you finally get there?

My eyes are starting to bleed from reading your monomanical rubbish.

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JTrea81 Hangout Grand Counsel

JTrea81

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No where did Tony mention clubhouse cancer for Nick..that is the worse statement you have ever made on here.

Well perhaps that is the wrong choice of words. Maybe saying he's a negative influence because he's been brought down by the losing would be better...

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Why_Knott? Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Why_Knott?

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Hell, even I one of his biggest detractors have never seen Markakis as a clubhouse cancer. He always hustles (even tonight was hustling down to first when they were down 11-0) and quiet guys like him are rarely clubhouse cancers. He just isn't much of a leader but would probably become an all-star on a talent laden team like the Yankees or Boston where he wouldn't have to be the main guy like he is with the Orioles and doesn't seem to handle it well.

Wait, you see Nick as an all-star?

Stop the presses!

Seriously though, how can anyone outside of the clubhouse know who is a clubhouse cancer?

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enchiridion AAA

enchiridion

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Bingo! Trembley was your Chezchoslovakia...MacPhail is your Poland.

Who will be your Russia? And when will you finally get there?

My eyes are starting to bleed from reading your monomanical rubbish.

So would vatech be Churchill in this analogy?

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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No where did Tony mention clubhouse cancer for Nick..that is the worse statement you have ever made on here.

I have not seen nor heard that anywhere either. That is just a stretch to presume somthing like that when there seems to be no actual basis.

I did here Thorne I believe say tonight that while Markakis always publicly supported Trembley throughout his managerial tenure, he commented that perhaps a more intense personality type manager (like Juan Samuel) would be what this club needs. I found that interesting if nothing else coming from Markakis.

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Gurgi Hangout Grand Counsel

Gurgi

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Don't see Nick as a clubhouse cancer.

Me either. I see him as a quiet guy just putting in his time. Going with the flow. A good role player but nothing to depend on or build a team around.

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